Monitor 70 or 60?

Britbill4000

Hey all,

So i recently purchased an Onkyo HT-RC370 and needed some speakers to go with it.....receiver hasn't arrived yet. Anyways, I needed to upgrade my speakers as I was using a HTIB. I already have a PSW10 sub.

I first bought a pair of Monitor 70s for my fronts. I wanted the CS2/CS20 for my center but there was no way I could get it to fit so I settled for the CS10. I then went back and bought a pair of Monitor 60s to use for surrounds (I prefer towers for my setup).

Now Considering I have no choice but to stick with the CS10/PSW10 am I better off using the 70s for the fronts and 60s for the surrounds or rerurning the 70s and going with 60s for fronts and surrounds? Also, when I do upgrade my sub will I be better off adding a second PSW10 or selling that and going with a different sub? I plan to pick up the speakers when the receiver arrives. The difference in price between the 70s and 60s is $100 for the pair.

67jason

Keep the 70s and put the 60s on surround duty, thats what I have and I love it, you might want to reconsider the cs2 though. I had to make mine work with my set up, just took some thought and a new stand to make it happen. Upgrade the sub as soon as you can. The only psw series worth a darn is the 505 and it is currently NLA, though rumor has it newegg will be getting a large order in sometime soon. Also look into the dsw sub line.

Geoff4rfc

I second the reconsideration on the CS2, much better speaker to go with your current choice of towers.

Upstatemax

keep the 70's in the front.

You need to use your own ears to know if you want a larger center. If it sounds good to you, don't fix something that's not broken...

I would look more at your sub, I also have a PSW10 and I have wanted to replace it for some time... I just can't settle on a new sub.

Lietuvis91

I agree, for HT m70 as fronts are really cool. The sound stage is a good bit better than m60s, even though m60s a nice speakers non the less.

Agree with everyone else on getting a "real" sub.

cnh

Welcome to Club Polk!

I run M-70s and a CS2 myself and I'd never think of moving down the Monitor ladder. M-70s can pretty much do it all in that series: HT, great sound stage, better 'imaging' than all other towers in that series, fuller more spacious sound for music--room filling.

Get yourself a good sub and you'll be happy. Although a CS1 is not optimum with M-70s you can 'boost' your center levels till they're more in sync with the larger towers?

If you're on a 'budget' and you can find a Polk PSW 505 that would be a few steps up from a PSW10 which has a lot of port noise and really does not add much low end to a set of M-70s which can almost play as low as that sub by themselves!

cnh

Britbill4000

Thanks for the replies guys. So I will stick with the Monitor 70s for the fronts. Unfortunately, the CS2 will just not fit in my current setup. My TV is the Toshiba 72HM196 with the matching stand. The CS10 will just about fit but the CS2/CS20 will not fit height or width wise. With regards to the PSW10 I actually purcashed this a few months back as an upgrade to my HTIB passive sub so unless I sell it, it will have to do for now. I should mention that my room is relatively small about 18 x 15. My usage is about 90/10 Movies/Music and I normally listen at moderate levels. Would I be better off adding say a second PSW10 which I can get for less than $100 and running 5.2/7.2 or selling my existing PSW10 and putting in another say $500 or so for a better sub and running 5.1/7.1?

tonyb

Get a better sub,don't waste your coin on 2 psw10's.

pdxfj

I have a Plasma and made this stand work.

http://www.amazon.com/OmniMount-CCH1B-Center-Channel-Speaker/dp/B00067AIEU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1305139426&sr=8-1

I also used the monitor isolation wedges at the bottom of this page to angle my CS2 towards the listening position. The second set of wedges they include really helped.

http://www.foambymail.com/SPaccessories.html

Get the CS2. You'll be happier in the long run. I had a smaller center channel before upgrading and could never get enough sound and clarity out of it.

Lietuvis91

Now that we are on the topic of the cs2, I will add that I was not happy with my cs2, even after running audissey. When watching movies, voices just were not clear enough, and it was hard to make out what the characters were saying. I fixed this by increasing the the center channel speaker level and also frequency (to 100hz) and turned the trebble up slightly.

So if the OP sticks to the CS1, you may be able to compensate for speaker size with turning up the level on the center and also bumping up the frequency to get more clarity out of it.

EndersShadow

pdxfj wrote: »

I also used the monitor isolation wedges at the bottom of this page to angle my CS2 towards the listening position. The second set of wedges they include really helped.

http://www.foambymail.com/SPaccessories.html

Good Lord those wedges are cheaper than the Auralex ones....Might have to snag a couple sets just because...

Britbill4000

pdxfj wrote: »

I have a Plasma and made this stand work.

http://www.amazon.com/OmniMount-CCH1B-Center-Channel-Speaker/dp/B00067AIEU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1305139426&sr=8-1

I also used the monitor isolation wedges at the bottom of this page to angle my CS2 towards the listening position. The second set of wedges they include really helped.

http://www.foambymail.com/SPaccessories.html

Get the CS2. You'll be happier in the long run. I had a smaller center channel before upgrading and could never get enough sound and clarity out of it.

Man..I wish I could make it work. Here's my TV/Stand.

http://di1-2.shoppingshadow.com/images/pi/35/35/48/35868742-260x260-0-0_Toshiba+72HM196.jpg

The CS2 will not fit on any shelf height wise or width wise. I need all 4 shelves becasue of the number of components I have. Unless my TV breaks..it's a no go :frown: Having said that, considering I was using a teeny tiny HTIB center for the past 4 years, the CS10 should be a huge improvement.

pdxfj

Guess I should have been a bit more clear. That center channel stand is designed to work with DLP/CRT TV's. Since I have a Plasma I had to get a bit inventive on how to make it work. The stand has adjustable legs in the back with feet that will rest on the angled back of your DLP TV.

Search on Amazon for "Center channel speaker stand" and you'll get a lot of results.

I don't remember where I found that company for the foam wedges but they have kick butt prices. Have a look at their site as they have many other items that are way cheaper than Auralex.

As far as the clairty of the CS2 it was a much needed improvement over what I had before, but I always felt it to be a bit harsh sounding. I had everything crossed over at 80hz. The addition of an external amp helped some more, but to me it still sounded a little harsh and rather flat.

Then one evening I got to thinking that perhaps I'm not letting it stretch it's legs by cutting it off at 80hz. So I set everything in my system to cut off at 60hz and the difference was night and day. The sound stage exploded and I'm hearing things I hadn't heard before. Vocals are crystal clear and pronounced. I tried 50hz but things got a bit muddy so 60hz seems to be the sweet spot for my setup.

I can say that the CS2 can hold it's own with the M70's no problem. Before moved down to 60hz I tried Dynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume, Re-EQ, etc. Nothing really sounded great. Now I use none of the added EQ functions. Sometimes Re-EQ depending on the movie, or THX Cinema. Just a direct decode with the Audyssey room correction and that's it.

cnh

pdxfj wrote: »

Guess I should have been a bit more clear. That center channel stand is designed to work with DLP/CRT TV's. Since I have a Plasma I had to get a bit inventive on how to make it work. The stand has adjustable legs in the back with feet that will rest on the angled back of your DLP TV.

Search on Amazon for "Center channel speaker stand" and you'll get a lot of results.

I don't remember where I found that company for the foam wedges but they have kick butt prices. Have a look at their site as they have many other items that are way cheaper than Auralex.

As far as the clairty of the CS2 it was a much needed improvement over what I had before, but I always felt it to be a bit harsh sounding. I had everything crossed over at 80hz. The addition of an external amp helped some more, but to me it still sounded a little harsh and rather flat.

Then one evening I got to thinking that perhaps I'm not letting it stretch it's legs by cutting it off at 80hz. So I set everything in my system to cut off at 60hz and the difference was night and day. The sound stage exploded and I'm hearing things I hadn't heard before. Vocals are crystal clear and pronounced. I tried 50hz but things got a bit muddy so 60hz seems to be the sweet spot for my setup.

I can say that the CS2 can hold it's own with the M70's no problem. Before moved down to 60hz I tried Dynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume, Re-EQ, etc. Nothing really sounded great. Now I use none of the added EQ functions. Sometimes Re-EQ depending on the movie, or THX Cinema. Just a direct decode with the Audyssey room correction and that's it.

+1, this has been my own experience. I also took my CS2 down to 60hz and also equalized the bass and treble a tad, manually. This made a HUGE difference in center channel presentation (almost a new speaker). YMMV, though. I know the common wisdom is cross over everything higher. But that's not what 'my' ears tell me?

cnh

67jason

cnh wrote: »

+1, this has been my own experience. I also took my CS2 down to 60hz and also equalized the bass and treble a tad, manually. This made a HUGE difference in center channel presentation (almost a new speaker). YMMV, though. I know the common wisdom is cross over everything higher. But that's not what 'my' ears tell me?

cnh

I've got my cs2 crossed at 80, no real issues, but I think I will try it at 60 and see how it sounds.

Lietuvis91

pdxfj:

if i understand you correctly you have your cs2 hooked up through an external amp? Did you have a dialog clearity problem before adding the amp?

I think the problem with my cs2 is that in 5.1 mode the onkyo 608 receiver wasn't really feeding it enough power(i'm guessing), so cutting out lower frequencies made it sound clearer/cleaner. I suspect if I add an external amp, the cs2 would probably be able to run to lower frequencies while maintaining clearity and probably sound much fuller.

I can tell that running the cs2 at 100hz is taking out some of the sound image and I am not hearing the full sound stage, but at least I can understand the dialog, and that is more important for now.

or Maybe I'm the only one having this problem with the cs2...

pdxfj

Yes, I am running things off an external amp now. Like you I was on a 608 and moved up to the 808 and amp. I noticed of the same issues you describe with the 608 and CS2. I remember trying different crossover points, but wasn't happy with things. IIRC I changed the mains and center at the same time. I don't remember trying just the center at a lower crossover setting and leaving everything else at 80hz. I do remember Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume (set at low) did help the vocals, but at the expense of detail in other sounds.

Giving the CS2 and M70's more power really makes them come alive. I haven't tried everything just off the 808 to see how it sounds. Perhaps if I'm bored some evening I'll give it a shot.

Lietuvis91

pdxfj wrote: »

Yes, I am running things off an external amp now. Like you I was on a 608 and moved up to the 808 and amp. I noticed of the same issues you describe with the 608 and CS2. I remember trying different crossover points, but wasn't happy with things. IIRC I changed the mains and center at the same time. I don't remember trying just the center at a lower crossover setting and leaving everything else at 80hz. I do remember Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume (set at low) did help the vocals, but at the expense of detail in other sounds.

Giving the CS2 and M70's more power really makes them come alive. I haven't tried everything just off the 808 to see how it sounds. Perhaps if I'm bored some evening I'll give it a shot.

wow, ok! That is really helpful! It's good to know I'm not imagining things. So it sounds like I was right in thinking that the 608 receiver just wasn't up to snuff for all this gear. Appreciate your input sir

I think it's time to move my marantz 7002 from two channel duty to HT duty, should see some good results :biggrin: