Receiver for my LSi?

Tmyckow
Tmyckow Posts: 13
edited March 2011 in Electronics
I have a full LSi setup (thanks to working for Polk many years ago)

LSi15's
LSiC
LSiFX
and PSW10 (so not full...)

I'm looking at finally upgrading my 5+ year old Denon to the Yamaha RX-V867. However, I know the LSi's are 4 ohm and more receivers don't usually come in that rating. This receiver is much better quality then the Denon I'm running them on now and I have had no power issue but if I'm going to upgrade I might as well do it right (or as right as my wallet will let me).

From my understanding the Yamaha can be run on 8 or 6 ohms. If I do purchase it should I run it on 6ohms or leave it on the default 8. Also, is there another high quality receiver in the ~$500 price range I should be looking at.
Post edited by Tmyckow on
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,077
    edited March 2011
    Their is no receiver in that price range that can drive a full LSI system properly. What you need is a receiver with pre outs and a 5 channel amp. I know it's not what you want to hear, but you'll risk doing damage to your speaks or receiver,or both, if you don't power them properly.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • Tmyckow
    Tmyckow Posts: 13
    edited March 2011
    Well that's unfortunate. What is the price range I will need to go up to run them properly?
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited March 2011
    WELCOME TO CLUB POLK!

    Try to buy 'used'. Get something like an older Harman Kardon AVR254 that has pre-outs (probably 250-300 dollars) and then look for a used Adcom, Parasound, Rotel, etc. 5 channel amp for 500-600. So I'd say for somewhere between 750-1000 dollars you could get everything you need!

    It's a bit more than your budget but not terrible. Another option is to find a 3 channel power amp and maybe run the surrounds off the AVR for a while till you can get a 2 channel for back there. That might bring you in at an even LOWER price!

    Check the Fleamarket on this site for deals in the Forum Menus and www.audiogon.com for used equipment.

    Harman Kardon also has a refurb ebay site you can google and watch for a 'deal' there!

    Good Luck

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • dbaldus
    dbaldus Posts: 730
    edited March 2011
    cnh wrote: »
    Try to buy 'used'. Get something like an older Harman Kardon AVR254 that has pre-outs (probably 250-300 dollars)

    That was going to be my recommendation as well.

    I have a Harmon Kardon AVR254 in absolutely perfect condition that I'd like to sell. Let me know if you're interested, otherwise I will probably be posting it for sale here in the near future...

    2-channel
    Squeezebox Touch| MSB Analog DAC | Audio Research Ref 40 Anniversary Edition| Pass Labs X350.8 | Wilson Audio Sasha 2

    Home Theater
    Arcam AVR 550 | GoldenEar Triton One | GoldenEar SuperCenter XXL | GoldenEar Aon 3 | JL Audio Fathom F113v2
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  • PSOVLSK
    PSOVLSK Posts: 5,291
    edited March 2011
    An Adcom GFA-6000 can be had used for around $200. Pair that with an H/K (or another AVR with pre-outs) as mentioned above and you'll be okay. If you're like most here you'll eventually want to upgrade to something better, but it's a good start for around the $500 you're looking to spend on an AVR.
    Things work out best for those who make the best of the way things work out.-John Wooden
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  • Tmyckow
    Tmyckow Posts: 13
    edited March 2011
    Besides the Adcom mentioned above is there any other 5 channel amp you guys would recommend. I'm having a hard time finding one that's under $1,500.

    Finding receivers with preamps or just getting a preamp is much easier.

    The NAD T955 keeps coming up. I also looked at the the Outlaw 7125 or Emotiva XPA-5.

    I don't have much knowledge about Outlaw or Emotiva, these quality brands?
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  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,598
    edited March 2011
    Some might not be fans of it, but I personally like my Carver AV-705x. Now I personally dont use it to drive 4 ohm speakers (because I dont own any yet), but I know of polk members that have used it to drive their front 3 LSi's with no problems.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
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  • thuffman03
    thuffman03 Posts: 1,325
    edited March 2011
    Tmyckow wrote: »
    The NAD T955 keeps coming up. I also looked at the the Outlaw 7125 or Emotiva XPA-5.

    I don't have much knowledge about Outlaw or Emotiva, these quality brands?

    You will get verying opinions on Outlaw and Emotiva.

    If you want to keep on a budget, which it sounds like you want to do, I would suggest Carver AV-405 or AV-505. Both are 4 ohm stable and are a good start into seperates.


    http://www.vintagehifipgh.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=40_42&products_id=448&zenid=qla1lpgb8mqtlnr7ifbn3sk6n6

    http://www.vintagehifipgh.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=40_42&products_id=4&zenid=qla1lpgb8mqtlnr7ifbn3sk6n6
    Sunfire TGP, Sunfire Cinema Grand, Sunfire 300~2 (2), Sunfire True Sub (2),Carver ALS Platinum, Carver AL III, TFM-55, C-19, C-9, TX-8, SDA-490t, SDA-390t
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  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,598
    edited March 2011
    thuffman03 wrote: »
    You will get verying opinions on Outlaw and Emotiva.

    If you want to keep on a budget, which it sounds like you want to do, I would suggest Carver AV-405 or AV-505. Both are 4 ohm stable and are a good start into seperates.


    http://www.vintagehifipgh.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=40_42&products_id=448&zenid=qla1lpgb8mqtlnr7ifbn3sk6n6

    http://www.vintagehifipgh.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=40_42&products_id=4&zenid=qla1lpgb8mqtlnr7ifbn3sk6n6

    Those are both good amps IMHO. I keep debating buying a second 5 channel amp to run all my tweeters off of.....
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited March 2011
    Welcome to Club Polk. Both Outlaw & Emotiva are good companies that make reasonably priced gear. While the Outlaw will help, the LSI's like all the power that they can get, so I would go for an XPA-5. But first make sure you get a receiver that has preouts so that you can add the amp.

    It might cost you more money up front, but you will have a system that will put a smile on your face for both music & movies for years to come. Do it once, and do it right, sit back & enjoy!
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • HHStuart
    HHStuart Posts: 263
    edited March 2011
    Tmyckow wrote: »
    Besides the Adcom mentioned above is there any other 5 channel amp you guys would recommend. I'm having a hard time finding one that's under $1,500.

    Finding receivers with preamps or just getting a preamp is much easier.

    The NAD T955 keeps coming up. I also looked at the the Outlaw 7125 or Emotiva XPA-5.

    I don't have much knowledge about Outlaw or Emotiva, these quality brands?

    The Outlaw 7125 has been working well for me.
    Front - Polk LSiM 705, Center - Polk LSiM 704c, Rear - Polk LSi 7
    Subwoofer - Epik Legend
    Receiver (as Preamp) - Sony STR-DA3400 ES
    Amplifier - Outlaw 7125
    Television - 58" Samsung Plasma PN58B860
    Blu Ray - OPPO BDP 83
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  • Tmyckow
    Tmyckow Posts: 13
    edited March 2011
    Thank you so much for all your comments.

    I have realized in this rather short amount of time that my budget will just not do and it looks more and more like the 1500 is closer to what I will be ending up at. To be honest I would rather do it right and not worry about it again.

    This just means a little more research and more time to gather the funds.
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  • Tmyckow
    Tmyckow Posts: 13
    edited March 2011
    I believe I'll be moving forward with the Marantz MM7055.
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,077
    edited March 2011
    Tmyckow wrote: »
    I believe I'll be moving forward with the Marantz MM7055.

    Dude, is that amp rated for 4 ohms ? I see 8 and 6 ohms, but no 4. Maybe I missed it somewhere.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • EndersShadow
    EndersShadow Posts: 17,598
    edited March 2011
    tonyb wrote: »
    Dude, is that amp rated for 4 ohms ? I see 8 and 6 ohms, but no 4. Maybe I missed it somewhere.

    You didnt, I looked over the whole manual and it only lists 210 wpc @ 6 ohm. No listing for 4 ohm power ratings, but it doesnt specifically say it wont work with them.....
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,077
    edited March 2011
    Sometimes it more important to pay attention to what is not said. In 2 channel, It may be Ok, but the OP is looking to drive 5 LSI's, a considerable amount of current would be asked from on a borderline capable amp. Questionable in my book.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • Tmyckow
    Tmyckow Posts: 13
    edited March 2011
    Must of miss read something - thanks for the catch.

    I guess Emotiva xpa-5 or Outlaw 7125 it is.
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  • PSOVLSK
    PSOVLSK Posts: 5,291
    edited March 2011
    For HT, I have an XPA-5 with a full LSi setup and I think it works great. That being said, there are other options for the same money, especially on the used market.
    Things work out best for those who make the best of the way things work out.-John Wooden
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited March 2011
    It looks like he wants to purchase new so an Emotiva would be his best shot.

    I can't stress enough how important it is to give the LSI's all the power that you can with an amp at 8ohms so that they have more than when the amp has to push them. That is why I alway recomment getting an amp of 200wpc @ 8ohms like the Emotiva XPA-5, Or a good choice with used would be a Sunfire amp. The Rotel will just barely squeek by for power at just 125wpc. You run the risk of having it go into protect mode during strenuous passages of music & movies.
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • PSOVLSK
    PSOVLSK Posts: 5,291
    edited March 2011
    cfrizz wrote: »
    It looks like he wants to purchase new I missed this part so an Emotiva would be his best shot. I agree.


    Guess I should pay more attention to what the OP wants:redface:
    Things work out best for those who make the best of the way things work out.-John Wooden
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  • slk55amg
    slk55amg Posts: 305
    edited March 2011
    I have been learning for years, thanks to all of you. So after reading and paying attention this is what I now have as my system.A sony ES 5300 as a pre/pro, Emotiva XPA5, LSI 15.s LSIC, monitor 70,s side surrounds, FXI3,s as rear surrounds,Polk Micropro4000, Velodyne DSQ10. It took 3years, very satisfied, everybody tells me, " its the best sound they ever experienced". So as my first question,very few folks mention using SONY ES , true mine is only driving the FXI3,s the rest powered by the XPA5, however its an outstanding piece of gear( bulit like a bank vault) again thanks for all your help!
    Emotiva XPA5, Sony ES 5300,: Lsi 15,s LSIC, Monitor 70,s, ( side surrounds) FXI 3,s, (rear surrounds)Micropro4000, Velodyne DEQ 10, Sony 55inchXBR 930D Sony BDP 790 Bedroom rig SonyES 3200 RTIA1,s CSIA4 FXI3,s polk PSW 10 SONY 34inch XBR960:cool:SONY BDP550
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  • slk55amg
    slk55amg Posts: 305
    edited March 2011
    if I posted in the wrong place, please excuse the mistake............
    Emotiva XPA5, Sony ES 5300,: Lsi 15,s LSIC, Monitor 70,s, ( side surrounds) FXI 3,s, (rear surrounds)Micropro4000, Velodyne DEQ 10, Sony 55inchXBR 930D Sony BDP 790 Bedroom rig SonyES 3200 RTIA1,s CSIA4 FXI3,s polk PSW 10 SONY 34inch XBR960:cool:SONY BDP550
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  • Tmyckow
    Tmyckow Posts: 13
    edited March 2011
    I have been doing as much research as time allows but I have not been able to find much used gear that would work, specifically amps. I'm most likely going to purchase a new amp but I haven't made up my mind about the pre.

    Still not sure if I should get new or used and if I should get a preamp or a receiver to use as a preamp. I see many people love the HK AVR254 for its quality and price point. Since I'm looking at replacing my equipment anyway maybe I should just get a preamp instead. Not really sure at this point I'm looking at the Emotiva amp and preamp combo as serious contender.

    Any ideas would be appreciated. The Emotiva UMC-1 preamp is $700 so lets assume that as the max price.
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  • dcmartinpc
    dcmartinpc Posts: 844
    edited March 2011
    I ran an HK AVR354 as a pre for a while and it worked very well for me. As far as amps go, I encourage to continue to look at the used market.

    http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?ampsmult&1304980166&/Parasound-HCA-2205A-5x220w-pow

    I know this is right around the same price as the Emotiva XPA-5, but I can tell you from experience, this amp will outpace the XPA-5, and I don't even hate Emotiva :) The Parasound 2205AT is basically the predecessor to the Parasound Halo A51. They sound phenomenal and are built like tanks... JMHO... The transformer is almost double that of the XPA-5 and it has over double the capacitance. It is a rock solid performer and I think a better overall amplifier that would serve you well for many years to come. I have been running one for a couple years and have been more than happy with it.

    Don't get me wrong, I think the XPA-5 is a decent starter amp, but if you look at the used market, you can pick up something around the same price that, I think, would be a better long term solution.

    Don
    Living Room: Adcom GFP-750 (Upgraded), Squeezebox Touch, Oppo BDP-83, Pioneer DV-79AVi, Parasound HCA-3500 (Upgraded), SDA SRS 2 P/B (Gimpod, Sonicaps, & Mills)

    Theater: Denon 4311ci, Oppo BDP-93, Parasound HCA-2205+HCA-2200II, Polk LSi9, LSiC, LSiFX, LSi7, Custom 18" TC Sounds sub with 2 18" PR, Sharp XV-Z12000, Pioneer Kuro KRP-500M (isf Enabled)

    Bedroom: HK AVR354, Pioneer DV-47a, Parasound HCA-1500a, Polk LSi9
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 33,077
    edited March 2011
    Good call Don, and a nice amp to boot.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited March 2011
    That's a great deal to jump on. You will have a great deal more choices via used amps. Parasound, Rotel, Sunfire, B&K, the list goes on & on.
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited March 2011
    May be a little out of your price range. But that Parasound is a KEEPER that will serve you for many many years and sound 'great' with LSIs!

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 937
    edited March 2011
    Adcom GFR-700 AV receiver

    I have this and it runs my full Lsi Set-up with no issue and sounds great.


    Total Harmonic Distortion 0.009%
    Amplifier Output Details 145 Watt - 8 Ohm - 5 channel(s) 265 Watt - 4 Ohm - 5 channel(s)
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  • dcmartinpc
    dcmartinpc Posts: 844
    edited March 2011
    acmf74 wrote: »
    Adcom GFR-700 AV receiver

    I have this and it runs my full Lsi Set-up with no issue and sounds great.


    Total Harmonic Distortion 0.009%
    Amplifier Output Details 145 Watt - 8 Ohm - 5 channel(s) 265 Watt - 4 Ohm - 5 channel(s)

    Keep in mind that those are EIA/CEA ratings, not RMS. RMS it is 226 x 2 into 4 ohms. That is going to drop off drastically if you start pushing a full set of LSi's.

    The EIA measures power only at 1000 Hz at 1% distortion 1% clipping.

    Most external amplifiers are rated 20 Hz - 20 KHz.

    Not saying it doesn't work and sound decent, but I can't find that receiver for much less than $1000. IMHO, there are better options for only a little more money in separates.

    Also, I having trouble finding full specs on the amplifier section in that adcom. Can't find transformer size, capacitance, or full range power ratings. Can someone point me to some more complete specs?
    Living Room: Adcom GFP-750 (Upgraded), Squeezebox Touch, Oppo BDP-83, Pioneer DV-79AVi, Parasound HCA-3500 (Upgraded), SDA SRS 2 P/B (Gimpod, Sonicaps, & Mills)

    Theater: Denon 4311ci, Oppo BDP-93, Parasound HCA-2205+HCA-2200II, Polk LSi9, LSiC, LSiFX, LSi7, Custom 18" TC Sounds sub with 2 18" PR, Sharp XV-Z12000, Pioneer Kuro KRP-500M (isf Enabled)

    Bedroom: HK AVR354, Pioneer DV-47a, Parasound HCA-1500a, Polk LSi9
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