Hitmaster/Vocopro

SDA1C

Hello, I've done some lurking and a ton of reading but for some reason I can't seem to find a thread addressing the Hitmaster connected to a wireless mic system. Is this a possibility?

Vocopro 5800 to (4) Hitmasters?

Will it be better to daisy chain or to split a snake quad from the 5800? Maybe split tandem from the source and daisy two on the left and two on the right?

Also I'd like to make the horns on the Hitmasters mono if they aren't already. I' don't yet have the Hitmasters in my hands but I've heard (and have seen on the back panel) that they are stereo config for the horns?

This will be mainly for riser placed choir and or short programs but of course it would be handy to use at home parties.

Thanks for any input or suggestion, 1C

RuSsMaN

The Hitmaster is setup for stereo, dual voice coil woofer, plus two tweeters. You can however use a '1 into 2' rca splitter from your source to make the unit play a mono signal. As far as the wireless system, I don't see why not. The Hitmaster can be used with just about anything that has a line level output.

I do suggest you buy them now, if you want them, as they are no longer in production.

Cheers,
Russ

SDA1C

Thank you sir! I purchased 4 of them about an hour before asking you fine folks(Wal-Mart, 36 bucks a piece?unreal!). My assumption was that the Hitmaster will in essence be just like a powered Peavey concert monitor. Is this correct?

RuSsMaN

Correct, they are intended for home use but still play plenty loud.
Cheers,
Russ

SDA1C

Thanks!

BeefJerky

You can use the Vocopro system with the Hitmaster, but not directly. The Vocopro will output a mic-level signal whereas the Hitmaster expects a line-level signal. I recommend a mixer with 4 microphone channels and 4 XLR cables to connect the Vocopro receiver to it. It is easier to control and balance the channels this way.Then you can connect the mixer with a set of RCA-RCA cables or RCA-1/4" cables depending on the particular mixer. Daisy chaining should be fine in this case.

I use this mixer, and it works well. It is a good value for the price in my opinion:
http://www.guitarcenter.com/Behringer-XENYX-1202FX-Mixer-103845061-i1153503.gc

You might also be able to find one used. I got mine on CL for $50, but I wouldn't have hesitated to pay full price for it.

TECHNOKID

RuSsMaN wrote: »

The Hitmaster is setup for stereo, dual voice coil woofer, plus two tweeters. You can however use a '1 into 2' rca splitter from your source to make the unit play a mono signal. As far as the wireless system, I don't see why not. The Hitmaster can be used with just about anything that has a line level output.

I do suggest you buy them now, if you want them, as they are no longer in production.

Cheers,
Russ

As pointed out by BeefJerky, a mixer is a must as it provides with the needed pre-amp signal for your microphone(s) (and will greatly help with gaming gear or CD-DVD player(s)). I can also attest that the HM performs quite well in this application. Like Russ mentions, simply install ''Y'' RCA connection to the HM to use in a mono application

I do suggest you buy them now, if you want them, as they are no longer in production.

:eek: I guess Polk is giving up pretty quickly! I noticed they were not readily available in Canada (and could be the same elsewhere) but this product is only a year old. Why would Polk dump this product so quickly????

SDA1C

Thanks for the link and reply Beefjerky. Also to you Technokid, your experience is well received.

In light of this info it would appear as though I just purchased 4 powered cabs and should wire/treat them as such? Am I understanding this correctly?

Thanks, 1c

adam2434

SDA1C wrote: »

In light of this info it would appear as though I just purchased 4 powered cabs and should wire/treat them as such? Am I understanding this correctly?

Thanks, 1c

Yes, think of them as a powered monitor without and mixing or preamp functions.

I have the same mixer BeefJerky recommended, and it works well for an inexpensive mixer. The mixer will also allow you to add reverb and EQ the vocals.

As for using a Y splitter and daisy chaining...do you want all vocal mics to come through all Hitmasters simultaneously? If so, you would not need a Y splitter. You could just send the L and R channels from the mixer to the L and R channels of the Hitmaster, while keeping the pan for each mic channel in the center position (which will provide the same vocal mix to the L and R channels, essentially making it a mono vocal mix). Then, you can daisy chain the rest of the Hitmasters with stereo RCA cables.

If you want to create a separate L and R vocal mix and play the L and R channels discretely through the Hitmasters (2 Hitmasters for the L channel and 2 for the R channel), then you will need to use Y splitters for the L and R channels from the mixer.

TECHNOKID

adam2434, I see what your seeing and for some pupose it might be the way to go but if you look closely at what the OP intned to do this is not the best solution.

SDA1C, few things to consider;

* Interconnects is more vulnerable to gain lost at long lenghts, interconnects are made for short distance gear to gear sitting on a shelf. The HM IMO was built with the purpose of connecting maybe 1 to 3 HM together and at somewhat close distance.

* The way you want to use them is as powered speakers which uses cables very different than RCA interconnects. For example, look at XLR cables, much larger gage and the fact that the cable is balanced also provide for extra gain. As far as unbalanced cables, some like guitar cable using 1/4 connectors also use cable size that will not loose as much gain over long distances.

* If mixer used allow you to provide unbalance signal, you should be able to daisy chain your HM without noticible lost.

* Treat your HM as mono powered speakers, get ''Y''s that provide you with the needed 2 RCA to connect to the HM with single 1/4 male connector Connector which turns your HM into a more powerfull mono powered speaker.

* You can daisy chain using that method. Now, if you want left and right channels, you simply split your 4 speakers in 2 rows of 2 which will allow you to provide for stereo playback if you so wish.

* Even if your intent is solely mono use, using left and right daisy chain is also a good idea since multiple daisy chaining has a slight lost at each and every new speaker connection. Another advantage is ease of troubleshooting if any of the chain was to fail (be cable or speaker).

The Hitmaster is setup for stereo, dual voice coil woofer, plus two tweeters.

Russ, maybe a dumb question;
I realize there are 2 tweeters which are use for stereo signal (which you can clearly see the physical connections when the gut is opened) but I don't get how you can use a single woofer to use 2 voice coils to play stereo signal (when I open the HM gut I was in the impression that the woofer had only a single signal going through it (I maybe wrong))? JUst want to undestand the principle of such dual voice coil on a single woofer for stereo playback purpose, I am honestly puzzled...

Cheers!
TK

BeefJerky

Since it seems some of you have experience using these Hitmasters, let me ask you a question. Some friends and I like to do karaoke on occasion and I'm wondering if the Hitmasters might be a better option in my current setup. My current setup is as follows:

JBL (Harman/Kardon) receiver putting out 100w RMS to 3 Polk R150 speakers. Two are run from the left and right channel and are used to provide sound for the audience. One is run from the center channel and is setup to be used a monitor speaker for the singer. I run the receiver in all channel stereo mode, which keeps the left and right signals directed to the left and right speakers and provides a summed mono to the center (monitor) speaker. I have the monitor speaker on it's side on the same mount I use for the lyrics screen. I have it tilted up and pointed at the singer.

Now, do you think a Hitmaster would be better, worse or the same if used as a monitor speaker? Same question for the left and right speakers.

Thanks!

adam2434

TECHNOKID wrote: »

adam2434, I see what your seeing and for some pupose it might be the way to go but if you look closely at what the OP intned to do this is not the best solution.
TK

Sorry, but I don't follow you.

The OP said he wants the Hitmaster's tweeters to play mono. So, I'm trying to determine if he means a mono vocal mix played by all Hitmasters simultaneously, or if he wants to use the Hitmasters as separate L and R speakers to play discrete L and R channels. What he wants to achieve will determine whether he needs to use a Y splitter. In all cases, he will need to run RCA/unbalanced to the Hitmasters, since they only have RCA inputs.

I personally use 1/4" to RCA adapters at the mixer and run standard RCA cables to the 1st Hitmaster, then daisy chain with RCA cables to the next Hitmaster. Since all my mics are in the center of the pan position on the mixer, all mics are equally blended to the L and R channels, effectively giving a mono vocal mix, since the L and R channels have the same signal.

Good discussion here - hopefully we will be able to help the OP achieve what he wants to do.

SDA1C

I've heard the cup runneth over with knowledge and intent on this site but man! This is more like being dumped out of a 5 gallon bucket

My main intention is to provide amplification of singing (and/or slight cue music for the youngsters) from risers for approximately 40 voices. Mono reproduction is exactly what I"m looking for with no synthesizer or stereo effects.

However, I do intend to use this at parties and gatherings i.e. local mountain bike races and such where a strong PA system really helps but doesn't take a semi to deliver and a week to set up. I have looked into the 1202 and am in contact with an old buddy from Musicians Friend to acquire one. Again, thanks for the info. I fully understand the wiring concepts you folks have set fourth and appreciate the help immensely.

Mostly my questions were referring to how, if possible, can I eliminate the need for an external mixer and use only the Vocopro while keeping the highest possible fidelity. Clearly this isn't an option if quality sound is what I'm after. The last thing I want (or can tolerate for that matter) is hums and feed back...no how no way LOL.

It would seem at this point the best route is going to be the use of your suggested 1202.

Thanks, 1c

SDA1C

The Hitmaster is setup for stereo, dual voice coil woofer, plus two tweeters.



Russ, maybe a dumb question;
I realize there are 2 tweeters which are use for stereo signal (which you can clearly see the physical connections when the gut is opened) but I don't get how you can use a single woofer to use 2 voice coils to play stereo signal (when I open the HM gut I was in the impression that the woofer had only a single signal going through it (I maybe wrong))? JUst want to undestand the principle of such dual voice coil on a single woofer for stereo playback purpose, I am honestly puzzled...

Cheers!
TK
Last edited by TECHNOKID; Today at 01:50 AM..


It goes without saying ..correct me if I'm wrong...but I think I get how this is set up. I'ts the same as a speaker level trigger on a sub amplifier. You input left and right speaker level signal (only in this case its a line level signal) and it filters and fires the single woofer. I'm not totally sure it can be accurately classified as true stereo through the single woofer but the signal activating its portion of the amplifier could be. I must also admit I don't fully understand the dual voice coil with two different signals either unless its as I mentioned and processed to mono before it reaches the woofer.

Thanks, 1c

mdaudioguy

TECHNOKID wrote: »

I guess Polk is giving up pretty quickly! I noticed they were not readily available in Canada (and could be the same elsewhere) but this product is only a year old. Why would Polk dump this product so quickly????

Seems to be in line with today's news that Activision is shutting down Guitar Hero development and production, and that music game sales in general have tanked. The fad is over, I guess.

TECHNOKID

I personally use 1/4" to RCA adapters at the mixer and run standard RCA cables to the 1st Hitmaster, then daisy chain with RCA cables to the next Hitmaster.

As I pointed out this setting puts you at a disadvantage since RCA cables (interconnects) will have greater lost with longer lenghts. Interconnects aren't met for long distance but rather to go from gear to gear on a rack. When you need to go for long distance and daisy chaining you need to use better cables than that.

Clearly this isn't an option if quality sound is what I'm after. The last thing I want (or can tolerate for that matter) is hums and feed back...no how no way LOL.

That is the purpose of a mixer (adjustable pre-amp) as you have to solo each inputs in order to override the natural electronic noize and bring your pre-level high enough so that the built-in amp of the PA (HM) as strong enough signal to amplify.


SDA1C, I am trying to understand how 2 voice coils can activate a single cone. There are 2 separate tweeters so this is fine but logically I can not see how a single driver can provess 2 signals at once within the same mechanical driver.

SDA1C

SDA1C, I am trying to understand how 2 voice coils can activate a single cone. There are 2 separate tweeters so this is fine but logically I can not see how a single driver can provess 2 signals at once within the same mechanical driver.
Last edited by TECHNOKID; Today at 08:51 PM..



My thoughts exactly Technokid. I don't believe it to be possible, mechanically....without some smoke haha.

I do however see the possibility electronically. For instance, I have a plate amp that drives a subwoofer. It will accept both line level and speaker level input. When using the speaker level inputs the signal that activates that amplifier is an average of both left and right speaker level signals.

If you were to remove either of the left or right speaker level inputs you would still have a signal for the sub to run on. If using the rca or lfe its clearly processed at the source.

To my knowledge this is the only way to use a stereo signal to a dual voice coil, without cooking something, and in essence by the time it reaches either coil it is a processed mono signal anyway...not stereo.

I believe it could also have been stated "It has a dual voice coil woofer and stereo tweeters" It is my opinion, the DVC, and of course the fact that it a POLK, is why this little box kicks serious booty.

Thanks, 1c

SDA1C

Just a follow up to this thread.

I received the 4 HM's today. Man them little dudes sound good. Unfortunately I have nothing to report as far as the connection to the vocopro. That equipment is across town and I just didnt have time today to run over there.

I can say they kick it with zone 2 on my receiver. I did notice the daisy chain part of the whole affair is a bit dismal especially with my Envy. I wont be trying that at concert time I'll tell ya that lol. When I split prior and dont daisy they do much better. With the 1202's output level this will be a little sleeper pa system. I'm gonna bring a camera to get the looks when these little guys fire up the first time. HeHeHe!

I purchased 4 50' male to male and plan to do a little soldering soldering next week. I guess im stuck with 4 50' runs but it is what it is and if its anywhere close to what my little receiver will do its plenty. ( I just realised there are 1/8 jacks, final decision on connectivity to be determined...CRAP!:rolleyes:)

Anyway, so far we love everything about these little Gems! They have far exceeded the 36$ price tag to say the least. Man the box is even :cool:!

Thanks, 1c

djDK

i just bought a HM, i use this to practice dj-ing through my mixer.

imma try the mono connection to see if they produce richer bass.

becuase in stereo, the bass seems kind of flat, not much depth to it

SDA1C

It's ALIVE lol. The sound is great and very large for how compact the package is. I received the 1202 today. Nice versatile compact mixer as well.

This is definitely enough for a party as well. I have a sub out on my sacd player so my next fun run will be integrating the sub into the mix.

For now I have a larger task at hand...seems someone decided to blow a channel at the complex. Ahh well keeps me busy. I'd attach a pic of the ceiling stack(size of a dumptruck lol) but the lights are messing with the photo chi on my phone.