upgrading crossovers should come first and foremost!

treitz3

I'd like to take this opportunity to say that throughout my audio journey, I have recently discovered that upgrading the crossovers in your speakers should be first and foremost on the list of upgrades to your rig. While this is just my opinion, it comes with merit. Allow me to explain.

Most of you know that I have gone through a plethora of gear recently in my audio journey. Some changes were good, some bad and yet some were really nice upgrades. While I do know that everything affects everything, looking back at what I know now? I would have changed one aspect of my upgrade path.

That would be the the upgrading of the crossover networks in the speakers I have owned.

I know it has been said that "there used to be a day when an SDA speaker sounded good without a crossover upgrade" and that in some folks' rigs, other things must be addressed first....like running with a 8Ω AVR, feeding a set of 4Ω speakers. Provided you have covered the basic fundamentals of building a rig, it is of my opinion that you should do the crossover upgrades next. Don't hold off on it, do it ASAP.

Here's the deal. I have a set of Tyler Acoustic's Linbrook Signature series loud speakers. Trey [Sid the kid] has a set of Super Towers, also from Tyler Acoustics. His are a smaller, taller version of mine and would be "considered", if you will, a slight downgrade from my speakers within the lineup of Tyler speakers. I have heard his speakers on my amp, his amp, similar sources, MIT cables, no MIT cables, with and without a sub and basically are rigs are relatively similar. They both sounded great and we were both pleased.

Given the smaller radiating surface of his speakers, you would expect a slight reduction of bass output which is exactly what what the end result is. Otherwise, besides room acoustics and surroundings, our rigs sounded very similar no matter the gear swap. Just different flavors of sound. Like when we swapped his SS amps with my tube amp. Just a different flavor 'tis all.

That said, Trey went and upgraded his crossover networks and actually removed them from the speaker altogether while at the same time, mine remained stock. Upon hearing just one speaker running full go when I visited a while ago [one speaker had only a tweeter issue that has since been resolved, so the speaker was running....just not the tweeter on that one speaker], I immediately noticed that the sound had improved on the speaker that was running full tilt. He had done nothing else to his rig but upgrading the crossover network.

A couple of weeks go by and I have a chance to come get my ears on the rig that has the new tweeter installed, so both speakers are running at full capacity. Again, immediately upon entering the audio room, I noticed a great deal of improvement in the sound. Well, I had brought a couple of demo tracks to check out on his rig, so we gave it a whirl. Man, what a difference! I enjoyed the entire listening session and went on my merry way.

Got home and turned on my rig and immediately shut it off for three weeks. It sounded like I had a K-mart rig or some ****.

Three weeks go by and I could finally tolerate my rig again but I really only truly enjoyed it when I was watching a movie. 2 channel stuff just wasn't up to par now. For the first time, it was like a blanket was being thrown over my rig and the enjoyment level just wasn't there as it had been for right about one year now.....and this was with the addition to the Tyler Acoustic subs he had recently slid my way to add to my rig.

So, I go over to his pad this past weekend and give a listen to his rig again. He has had some time to burn everything in and I wanted to hear what it sounded like. HOLY MOLY!!!!

Everything about the sound had changed. Everything. Words can not give you what I experienced. As he says, "there is more weight to the instruments, singers". Um.....yeah! The reproductive quality of his speakers have now taken a listening experience to levels further than what a new amplifier would do, further than improving the source, further than adding a dedicated 20 amp circuit would do.

The difference is so staggering, I do not even want to listen to my rig anymore until I upgrade the crossovers. Funny, seeing that before he did this? We had about the same rig, just slightly different sounds.

So, in conclusion of this rather long post, I wish I had done things differently and started with the crossover network upgrades first. THEN moved on with the upgrade path with the rest of the rig. The difference is simply amazing.

Ricardo, you have owned the same speakers I own now with some pretty stellar gear running it in a dedicated audio room. Can you imagine that system sounding like crap? That's what it's like when comparing the stock X-overs to the upgraded ones. All at a cost of around 9 bills. Had you upgraded the crossovers, I believe your audio journey would have taken a different path.

Some of you might have wondered why I have recently been telling Trey that I hate him. This is why.

Crossover upgrades coming soon to a rig in my living room. I may hate the little **** but I thank him profusely for showing me the way to elevate my audio journey to areas well beyond what I had ever envisioned. Way to go, kid. Way to go.

ohskigod

strongly considering upgrading the crossovers on apair of LSi9's, I keep hearing good things. I was initially afraid i wouldnt like the change as I love how the LSi series sound as is, but I;m starting to realize my fear might be unfounded. now if i only had skills with a soldering iron. Maybe this is my chance to develop them.

I sent the Skiing Ninja guy n email for a quote on his crossovers with external enclosure asking how it would work hooking them up, I think he got the impression I was probing him for info to do it myself. Funny, as the concept of me building a crossover is laughable at the moment.

is it that hard to do if I never had experience soldering?

ben62670

I have done quite a few LSi XO's. It is not the XO you want to learn on. Why would you want an external XO? Every XO I have done(and that is a lot)Polkies have been very pleased with

treitz3

No, actually a crossover is a good learning experience for the novice solderer. It's when you get into surface mounted items, point to point in tight spots and removing multiple pin IC's that become a daunting task to the novice.

I have no experience with the LSi X-over, though. That may be a **** to do because of room constraints but you are talking to someone who is not afraid of building a board by scratch or even modifying a board to make something fit, going so far as to adding another board on top of the existing board to make things fit correctly.

When I re-do mine? They will become external. There are several reasons to do it this way that I have learned of, but that's for another thread in the near future.

ben62670

Not the LSi's. It is a whole different animal. The copper traces are on the same side as many of the components and the traces lift easily. If you are handy with a soldering gun then doing something with some room like the monitors or smaller SDA's isn't bad. People really should practice on something other than their gear. A bad solder joint can lead to big headaches.

treitz3

Ben, you have a pic of the X-over by chance? I've never seen an X-over that would be challenging to a novice before. I'm just curious as to what you are talking about.

Face

Other than the LSi7, the LSi series can be a little time consuming. The LSi9 and LSiC boards has to be flipped over to make room for the HF film caps. It doesn't help that Polk likes to use plenty of hot glue to ensure nothing is removed easily. And if you want to replace all the caps, a daughter board will be needed.

And Ben is 100% correct about the traces on LSi series boards, they lift very easily.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74096

FTGV

edit

ben62670

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=84363&highlight=lsi+crossover
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72273&highlight=lsi+crossover
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73233
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85058&highlight=lsi+crossover
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71515
Here are a few. The search function works well. Also keep in mind that the circuit boards are covered in hot glue, and if you don't get it clean then your joints won't stick.

treitz3

Ahhh, gotcha. Lou, have someone else do it for you. This is not something a novice wants to deal with.

VR3

I would like to note I also lined the enclosure with no Rez... Put the spkr on a 18" tile and added diffraction be gone

Outfitter03

Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »

I would like to note I also lined the enclosure with no Rez... Put the spkr on a 18" tile and added diffraction be gone

So what is your opinion on the diffraction be gone? I know were doing this around the same time as the crossover upgrades. Do you think this tweak would work well with Polk speaker also?

Conradicles

Tom, I feel you because I too am hooked on crossover upgrades. I just got a set of LSi9's and am saving $ to buy some decent caps and resistors to really make this upgrade shine.

I have seriously thought about a point to point DIY upgrade but that is a little over my head and I will need some help!

VR3

I took the dbg off for a week and was very happy when I put it back on... I think any speaker can benefit from it

Toolfan66

Whats crazy in my short journey is the only SDA's that I have really spent any time with stock is 2B's that I sold a long time a go. my 1.2tl's saw very little play as well as my 1C's,I went straight into upgrades with them and have yet to look back. I started with the speakers and worked my way from there.

And no I never thought that was the way to start I just went crazy!!! It just worked out that way and now everytime I sit and listen I still have a permagrin on my face,and I still find myself in awe..

All thanks to this place!!! even though my new drug sits in my garage and I have been cheating on this place and hanging out at the Camaro5 forum pages,I still hunt for good audio deals...

But having the speakers you want and working the gear around them worked for me in a crazy kind of way only because when I joined here I had no clue what the hell I was doing..lol..

george daniel

Where is the crossover located in the Tylers,,I'm kinda bored,and was thinking about a project while the VTL's are out? IIRC,,Ty kinda makes it difficult to get at them IIRC? Also,,as I recall,, they are not on a printed circuit board?

VR3

Usually behind the woofers on some mdf

george daniel

hmm-- sounds easy enough--I'll take a peak--thanks