Upgrading Left/Right Speakers for RM6750 setup

ClubPolkNoob

Hello Club Polk!

I've been looking over the forum, for a couple of weeks now, and I'm impressed by the helpful, friendly community here. I'd really appreciate any advice/suggestions you could share regarding a speaker upgrade.

Eighteen years ago, my buddy invited me to his house, and played some music from his new, Polk Audio bookshelf speakers -- I was blown away! Couldn't believe the clarity and the thump/power coming from the speakers. I knew, one day, I'd have to own a set of Polks for myself. Well, a little over a year ago, after much research, I bought my first receiver (Sony STR-DG810) and Polk Audio's surround-sound speaker set (RM6750). The RM6750 was highly recommended for people on a budget, and for the price, they couldn't be beat.



Now, I've been nothing but 100% pleased with my setup when it comes to listening to TV, movies and video games. And, I've always thought they sounded pretty good when listening to music. However, after visiting my Uncle's house last month, and hearing music from his 20-year-old stereo and speakers, I think my setup could use some help. His old system was delivering music in a much richer, fuller sound than mine. I was "feeling" the music, rather than just listening. So, my question is: how do I best upgrade my setup (value-wise) so that I can hear music in a richer, fuller form?

Let me say this: I am extremely ignorant when it comes to audio systems and speakers. That said, I'm thinking I need to upgrade my left and right front speakers to deliver better sound when listening to music. Yes/no? So, last week, I visited the local Fry's Electronics, and listened to some Polk floorstanding speakers. They had a limited selection, but the wife and I really enjoyed the sound of the TSi 400s. Unfortunately, they are $300/speaker. So, I came home, did hours of research, went to ebay, amazon, polk, newegg, etc., and now my brain is fried.

I'm interested in purchasing a pair of black, Polk Audio, floorstanding speakers for no more than $500 (shipping included). My Sony receiver box says it has output power of 110W per channel driven.

Thus far, I'm most impressed with the pricing on Polk's eBay site (polk direct). It seems as though I can purchase some very nice refurbished speakers at a great price. Is there any reason to avoid refurbished speakers (especially if they're coming from Polk directly)?

My research seems to indicate that M60s/M70s and TSi400s/TSi500s are all great speakers, but I can't decide what to do.

Please forgive me for this onslaught of questions:

1. Which floorstanding speakers would you buy, with regards to a $300-$500 budget?
   
2. Do I remove my current Left and Right speakers, and replace them with the floorstanding speakers?
   
3. When listening to music, is it best to just play through the two floorstanding speakers, and avoid all other speakers?
   
4. Once I connect the floorstanding speakers, do I run the "Automatic Speaker Set Up" that came with the Sony receiver?
   
5. Is there a "break-in" time period for new speakers?
   
6. I bought an Apple TV (hooked up to Sony via HDMI) to stream music wirelessly from iPhone/Computer. Any of you have an opinion on this?

Thank you for reading. I would really appreciate any advice/knowledge/wisdom you could share with me. Thank you very much for your time!

tonyb

Well, first off,through out the thought of just the front 2, that small center will get lost inbetween two floorstanders. Monitor 70's and a cs20 center should serve you well within your budget.

B Run

^+1 go with the monitors if you're on a budget, you'll be just as happy. They're GREAT speakers for the money and you'll notice a big improvement.

larry777

You should also consider another Sub to replace the one that came with the 6750 set unless you already did that. Someone on this forum just mentioned over the last few days about the Polk PSW 505 selling somewhere for $199 new. Its a very good Sub for both movies and music. Just something to consider to give you even more impact and not too hard on the budget.

larry777

Futureshop still has the RTi4's on sale in Canada for $149 Pair. Also the RTi10's for $249 Each.

ClubPolkNoob

Thank you all, for taking the time to provide me with your advice/suggestions. As I said in my first post, I have very little knowledge about speakers/sound systems, so I appreciate all your help.

For watching TV (DirecTV), Movies, and PS3/360... the wife and I are pleased with the RM6750.

For listening to music, we are realizing that (no matter how many settings I change on the receiver) we are missing out on a richer, fuller sound (best way I can describe it). Listening to music in our Toyota 4Runner, with it's stock JBL speakers, is much more pleasing (fuller sound, bass, etc.).

We were hoping some floorstanding speakers would solve the problem, but maybe we are opening a can of worms.

If we were to purchase floorstanding (left and right) speakers, could I just hook them up to the B Speaker inputs on back of stereo, and leave the existing 5.1 speakers alone? Then, I just switch to B speakers when playing music?

That may be possible (right?), but considering we are watching TV/Movies 90% of the time, it would be a waste of such great speakers ($$$) to only use them for music - correct?

And, if I understand tonyb correctly, if I do replace the current L/R speakers, with floorstanders, then the current center channel will get lost. So, I'd need to purchase a center channel, as well. I would need an updated CENTER because if I was watching tv/movies with the new setup, it would be difficult to hear dialogue without a "beefer" center?

When listening to music, do most people utilize a two-channel setup (L/R)? Or, do they include a center, as well? Is the subwoofer necessary for music? 5.1 is mostly for tv/movie/gaming... correct?

Like I said, I have a $500 budget (maybe pushed to $600), so I'm trying to get the most bang for the buck.

(thank you: tonyb, B Run, larry777, and DSkip)

tonyb

CPN- Sure you could use just 2 speakers for music and the rest for movies. You should be able to set it up in the receiver that way.
The small speakers may do you some use in surround application,but I'll stand firm on suggesting monitor 70's and a CS20 center to get you rolling and stay well in your budget. Wife will appreciate that. Pick up a roll of 14 ga speaker wire at Home depot too, those small speaker wires won't cut it from the RM's.

TECHNOKID

Welcome to Club Polk ClubPolkNoob

We were hoping some floorstanding speakers would solve the problem, but maybe we are opening a can of worms.

Tower speakers is definitely a good way to solve the poor music SQ but as mentioned, if played in conjunction with your present system your center is definitely not a good match and yes, you are opening a can of worm if considering getting both speaker systems to work in conjunction.

If we were to purchase floorstanding (left and right) speakers, could I just hook them up to the B Speaker inputs on back of stereo, and leave the existing 5.1 speakers alone? Then, I just switch to B speakers when playing music?

Yes using the B for the Towers this would allow you to still use your existing 5.1 on A while the B will allow you for better music SQ. For example, the Monitor 70s are self sufficient if you are not bass hungry for music (I believe they go down to 40Hz) and would be your best bang for the buck if you are on a budget.

That may be possible (right?), but considering we are watching TV/Movies 90% of the time, it would be a waste of such great speakers ($$$) to only use them for music - correct?

Out of the 90%, how much is movie watching and what is the size of your room? The small system you presently own is kind of an improvement to TV speakers but if you are a movie buff you can certainly do better (IE: using one of the matching CS center (IE; CSi25 http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/products/recent/csi25/ )

And, if I understand tonyb correctly, if I do replace the current L/R speakers, with floorstanders, then the current center channel will get lost. So, I'd need to purchase a center channel, as well. I would need an updated CENTER because if I was watching tv/movies with the new setup, it would be difficult to hear dialogue without a "beefer" center?

Exactly!

When listening to music, do most people utilize a two-channel setup (L/R)? Or, do they include a center, as well? Is the subwoofer necessary for music? 5.1 is mostly for tv/movie/gaming... correct?

Music listening is best done through dedicated 2 front speakers. 5.1 listening for music is not the greatest unless used as low bacground music when guess at home and talking-discussing has priority over the music.

IMO, using the center defeats the purpose of stereo listening. Unless you are bass hungry, good full range speakers don't require a sub (my personal preference is withouth sub for music) and yes 5.1 should be dedicated for movie and gaming.

Like I said, I have a $500 budget (maybe pushed to $600), so I'm trying to get the most bang for the buck.

This certainly can be achieved with a pair of Monitor 70s. If you involve the 70s in the 5.1 set-up you then have to increase your budget to acquire a matching center along with a more powerfull sub. However, keep in mind your 70s would be capable of decent bass and if set to full range could be used for the bass in conjunction with your existing sub. However, you also have to keep in mind that doing so would be more demanding on your receiver.

For watching TV (DirecTV), Movies, and PS3/360... the wife and I are pleased with the RM6750.

Then this should answer part of your question and lead you toward the best set-up for your specific needs (you are lacking on the music side, right?).

Another option would be to purchase Monitor 70s and center to create a 3.0 or 3.1 set-up and either sell the RMs or use them in a kids room or small bedroom.

All in all, your goal while on a budget should be to upgrade with the intention of being satified for a few years. Do you know anyone that owns HT set-up that you could audition? Like for the music, that may lead you to realize your system is lacking? If at all possible, I would do that before making any move.

CPN- Sure you could use just 2 speakers for music and the rest for movies. You should be able to set it up in the receiver that way.
The small speakers may do you some use in surround application,but I'll stand firm on suggesting monitor 70's and a CS20 center to get you rolling and stay well in your budget. Wife will appreciate that. Pick up a roll of 14 ga speaker wire at Home depot too, those small speaker wires won't cut it from the RM's.

I've just noticed Tony's latest post, very sound advices!

Cheers!
TK

ClubPolkNoob

DSkip -- I very much appreciate your suggestions. Those sound like great speakers, for the price, but I'm leery about buying used, because I don't know how to gauge their true condition (whether they've been manipulated).

tonyb & TECHNOKID -- Thank you for your suggestions. Techno, thanks for thoroughly answering my list of questions (I have a much better understanding of things now). Appreciate it!

Our entertainment system is in a living area that is open to the kitchen, so it's not a small room, AND we have vaulted ceilings.

That said, based on your recommendations, we are looking to purchase a pair of M70s to ADD to the existing 5.1 (thus, removing the small L/R speakers). It would just seem like a waste to buy nice speakers, and only use them for music.

In addition, as suggested, we will need to upgrade the Center speaker. The cheapest I could find the CS20 was $150 from Newegg (but, it's out of stock). And, if I google the CSi25, I can only find a used one from San Diego.

I'm strongly considering buying M70s tomorrow, on Polk's eBay site (polkdirect) for $299 + $80 ship ($380 total). They are refurbished. Any problem with buying refurbished? Do you like the price...I haven't been able to find them cheaper?

Any more suggestions on an appropriate Center for my setup? So many to choose from, and I have no idea what's the best "value-play" for my system. Is $200 too much to pay for the CS20?

tonyb wrote: »

Pick up a roll of 14 ga speaker wire at Home depot too, those small speaker wires won't cut it from the RM's.

The current 5.1 system is wired with 16 gauge Monster speaker cable. Would that be sufficient?

ClubPolkNoob

Ok, great! Thanks, DSkip.

I just found the CS2 on Polk's eBay site for $100 refurbished.

QUESTION: Is the CS2 the same as CS20?

And, I'm also seeing CS2 SERIES II -- are they a newer model from regular CS2s?

Thank you.

TECHNOKID

ClubPolkNoob wrote: »

Ok, great! Thanks, DSkip.

I just found the CS2 on Polk's eBay site for $100 refurbished.

QUESTION: Is the CS2 the same as CS20?

And, I'm also seeing CS2 SERIES II -- are they a newer model from regular CS2s?

Thank you.

Actually, the CS2 is the matching center for the Monitor series while the CS20 is the matching center for the TSi series. As pointed out, you can't go wrong with Polk's eBay. Never been too keen about buying on eBay but this is Polk. Polk will provide you with the same outstanding customer service be buying from their site or their eBay store or any authorised dealer. You are buying decent product at great price but over that, their customer service attitude is definitely a big plus :cool:

Yet, you seem to be doing great upgrading your system! Enjoy to the fullest!

ClubPolkNoob

UGH!

Went to Newegg, clicked on "Latest Deals" tab, and found these promos:

Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II Floorstanding Loudspeaker (Black) Each -- $169 (free ship)

and

Polk Audio CS2 Series II Center Channel Speaker (Black) Each -- $99 ($2.99 ship)

PERFECT!!!!! Great deal, and I'm finally ready to pull the trigger!!! I'm ecstatic!!! Got the credit card out.... LET'S DO THIS!!!

Entered promo codes, but they expired prior day -- :frown::frown::frown:


Now, I guess, I'll just have to wait it out. I assume these promo-deals go in cycles. I just can't stomach buying them at their current prices, considering the bundle was $240 less 24 hours ago.

TECHNOKID

ClubPolkNoob wrote: »

UGH!

Went to Newegg, clicked on "Latest Deals" tab, and found these promos:

Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II Floorstanding Loudspeaker (Black) Each -- $169 (free ship)

and

Polk Audio CS2 Series II Center Channel Speaker (Black) Each -- $99 ($2.99 ship)

PERFECT!!!!! Great deal, and I'm finally ready to pull the trigger!!! I'm ecstatic!!! Got the credit card out.... LET'S DO THIS!!!

Entered promo codes, but they expired prior day -- :frown::frown::frown:


Now, I guess, I'll just have to wait it out. I assume these promo-deals go in cycles. I just can't stomach buying them at their current prices, considering the bundle was $240 less 24 hours ago.

What a bummer and yes newegg has deals like that on a repetitive cycle (but keep your eyes open on other sites also). GL

ClubPolkNoob

Thank you again, TECHNOKID. I really appreciate you taking the time to guide me, and answer questions. I'm locked into what I want now, so I'll just wait for the deals to come around again. I'll let you know how it goes.

comfortablycurt

Everyone's recommending that you replace the center and the sub as well as the front L/R...but one thing that you should bear in mind, is that this can be done over time. Yes, your current center channel would be overshadowed by a pair of Monitor 70's, but your setup on the whole would still sound vastly better. There's no reason that you couldn't replace the front L/R right now with a pair of floorstanders/bookshelves, and then a few months from now when your bank account recovers...go ahead and replace the center channel. Then after that's upgraded, get the ole bank account back in shape and then get a subwoofer. You don't have to buy it all at one time.

Seriously, some of you guys are making it sound like his system will sound absolutely horrible if he gets a pair of Monitor 70's and doesn't replace the center at the exact same time.:rolleyes: I assure you, this won't be the case.


Personally, I'd look into the possibility of getting a pair of RTi6's and a PSW505 sub. You could get the 6's and the sub both for around $500. IMO, the RTi line is a LOT more musical sounding than the Monitor/TSi line...especially the 6's. The RTi6's are really a fantastic sounding, very musical speaker. Excellent imaging, and they're not plagued so much by the brightness issues that some people complain about with the RTi series.

The 6's with a PSW505 sub would make for an excellent sounding, very musical combination.

But...it sounds like you're looking more at floorstanders...in which case, the Monitor 70's would be a good choice. If you shopped around a little bit, you could probably find a pair of RTi10's for around $500...which would be better sounding than the 70's IMO.

Another option to consider is a pair of RTi8's with a sub.


Regarding your question about the CS2/CS20/CS2 Series II....

They're all basically the same speaker. The CS2 Series II is basically old stock from the CS2 being revamped a little bit...but it's essentially the same speaker. The CS20 is the new version of the CS2. There are some differences, but in most respects they're the exact same speaker. The primary differences are cosmetic.



Have no fears about buying refurbs from Polk's ebay store. There product quality is top notch, and their refurbs are basically new speakers in most respects.

cascius

Hi ClubPolkNoob, welcome to the forums.

I just started undergoing the same process and thought my experience might be of interest to you:
I had a basic HTIB from Onkyo and wasn't that satisfied with the sound. I know what a good home theater sounds like and this setup was clearly lacking clarity/depth/... So I asked a similar question as yours on these forums and decided to do the upgrade in increments:
1st step:
- replaced center with CS2 series 2
- replaced fronts with Monitor40s
2nd step:
- replace fronts with Monitor70s
- move Monitor40s to surround.

I just completed the first step last night, and the result is just plain amazing. The sound is much richer and deeper already. As a starter this upgrade was so cheap thanks to Newegg ($230 shipped) that I HAD to do it! Second: I demoed it to my girlfriend last night and she was amazed at the improvements and when i told her about the plan to get 70s, her only comment was: "what are you waiting for?". Lol

Now I'm also waiting for Newegg to have another deal on the 70s, which happens fairly often for what I see (every other week or so). I should be able to snatch these for $370, shipped. Which would put the grand total at $600. i know it's slightly above what you have in mind, but from what I've heard it's a no brainer

As far as the sub is concerned: I'll wait to have the 70s in place before deciding. Right now it doesn't sound bad at all and my neighbors are probably getting ready to complain, so I think i don't think it's a necessary upgrade at this time.

Hope this is helpful,

- Olivier

TECHNOKID

Wise man cascius very good way to upgrade your system withouth breaking the bank and allows you to be right there for the special deals :cool: That is exactly how I built my system, one piece at the time waiting for the right time to buy while the product was on sale. I don't think I ever paid MSRP pricing or even near for any pieces I acquired through the years.

ClubPolkNoob

comfortablycurt - Thanks for your suggestions. I will definitely wait for a subwoofer to see how the new floorstanders & center work first. I'll research those RTi10s while I'm waiting for promos to cycle through again.

cascius - Thank you for sharing your experience. I can't wait to upgrade, as I know even the modest of upgrades (compared to my current HTIB) will improve my listening experience greatly. Richer and deeper sound is what I'm looking for.

The M70s series II were actually $169 (free ship) a couple days ago on Newegg, but I missed the opportunity.

Do you have any other suggestions on sites to look at? Newegg, Amazon, eBay....???

Please let me know if you find a deal on the M70s, as I'll do likewise. Thanks!

TECHNOKID

Why don't you put a bid on them, you don't have anything to loose and potentially everything to gain, right?

http://cgi.ebay.com/PAIR-Monitor-70-BLACK-Towers-HOLIDAY-SPECIAL-150-OFF-/390276260355?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item5ade472203

http://stores.ebay.com/Polk-Audio-Direct/_i.html?_nkw=center&submit=Search&_sid=686154689

ClubPolkNoob

TECHNOKID wrote: »

Why don't you put a bid on them, you don't have anything to loose and potentially everything to gain, right?

http://cgi.ebay.com/PAIR-Monitor-70-BLACK-Towers-HOLIDAY-SPECIAL-150-OFF-/390276260355?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item5ade472203

Well, I was sold on going the Polk direct/refurbished route for the M70s, but with $80 shipping, the total cost would be $380.

Under the Newegg promo, they were selling New, M70 Series II, speakers for $169 ea. (no shipping). So, I'd be getting new speakers, and Series II, for $340. That's $40 saving I could put towards new center.

TECHNOKID

Humm, make sense. Just be patient, new deals may come along. Don't put your eggs in the same basket, keep an eye open for both the Tsi (usually more expensive but you never know) and the Monitors. Rti's were also metioned, not as familiar with them they sure do look good so if they can be had at decent price and pleases your needs.

ClubPolkNoob

Newegg just sent me a promo with the PSW505 (recommended by a few of you) for $199 (ship free). And, upon further review, I've noticed Newegg charges zero sales tax for Arizona residents -- big savings! How do I NOT go with them? Can any other online retailer compete?

All this for $640 total:

Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II Floorstanding Loudspeaker (Black) Each -- $169 (when on promo)

Polk Audio CS2 Series II Center Channel Speaker (Black) Each -- $99 (when on promo)

Polk Audio PSW Series PSW505 12" Powered Subwoofer Each -- $199

...I know I don't need to buy them all at once, and it pushes my $500 budget, but I feel like I need to grab them when they're on sale at these prices.

I'm an AUDIO IDIOT, can my receiver power these speakers & subwoofer?


100 watts x 6 into 8 ohms (20-20,000 Hz) at 0.09% THD

Thanks.

ClubPolkNoob

cascius wrote: »

Now I'm also waiting for Newegg to have another deal on the 70s, which happens fairly often for what I see (every other week or so). I should be able to snatch these for $370, shipped. Which would put the grand total at $600. i know it's slightly above what you have in mind, but from what I've heard it's a no brainer

cascius -- just a heads up, Newegg is offering the M70s today for $179 (thru 1/19, I think)

I'm about to pull the trigger on a pair of M70s, and the CS2 center. Doing some last minute deliberating with the wife.

ClubPolkNoob

And, it is done:

1 Polk Audio PSW Series PSW505 12" Powered Subwoofer Each ($199)

2 Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II Floorstanding Loudspeaker (Black) Each ($179.99 ea)

1 Polk Audio CS2 Series II Center Channel Speaker (Black) Each ($129.99)

Geoff4rfc

ClubPolkNoob wrote: »

And, it is done:

1 Polk Audio PSW Series PSW505 12" Powered Subwoofer Each ($199)

2 Polk Audio Monitor70 Series II Floorstanding Loudspeaker (Black) Each ($179.99 ea)

1 Polk Audio CS2 Series II Center Channel Speaker (Black) Each ($129.99)

Congratulations!!!!!!!!! You will be very happy, I too just upgraded my system to 70 seriesII and CS2 seriesII. I have the 30's seriesII and by this next month will have the 40's seriesII and replacing my two low budget subs with an Epik Empire..........

PrazVT

Congrats!! Let us know how you like 'em and put up pics!

tonyb

DSkip wrote: »

Congrats on the purchase. I expect you to be very happy and be blown away at the improved performance over the RM6750.

Ditto that....he may even have to change his shorts. Well...just toss them, you don't want anyone to know.

z3r0m4g3

I did the same thing upgraded step by step and am still in the process.

TNHNDYMAN

Welcome to the club and congrats on your upgrade. I'm sure you will be astonished at the difference from the small sats. I'm considering the 505 sub myself so look forward to your opinion once you have it all up and running. No one really commented on your receiver, but I think for now it will be fine for HT and music use. If you are like most of us though, once you get started it really is hard not to want to keep improving your system. Have Fun!

ClubPolkNoob

Thank you guys, and thanks for all your help. I will definitely post pictures once speakers arrive and are setup. Thanks TNHNDYMAN for your answer regarding my receiver.

Now that I've pulled the trigger, and the speakers are on their way, I need to figure out how to set them up. So many questions..... (lol)

I've started a thread in the Setup section if you'd care to help me out: http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112560

ClubPolkNoob

Speakers up and running... with some calibrating left to do! Even without fine tuning the setup, they sound awesome. I imagine after some calibrating/fine-tuning, AND after they've had a few weeks to "break in," they'll sound even better. First song was Michael McDonald's, "I Keep Forgettin'" -- oh my the bass!

CS2 is a beast of a speaker -- used shelf/3 brackets/anchors/wood stud and it's on the wall solid now.

SETUP:

1. Front L/R speakers -- 9 feet apart, and 9 feet from primary listening position.
2. Center -- obviously above TV (wonder if I should have it tilt down a tiny bit, for direct line to listener?)
3. Subwoofer -- placed in left corner. Used LFE in, Low Pass 120 Hz (max), Phase 0 degrees (bass sounded tighter - yes/no?) and volume 1 o'clock.

Following the setup/installation process, I ran Sony's auto-calibration program. Seemed to work fine. Then, as suggested, I went to look at the speaker settings, and the calibration set the Front Speakers as Large... so, I changed them to small. Now, it's small for all speakers.

Now, I need to find out how to make the speakers 80Hz across the board (as many have suggested). I'll have to look at receiver manual to figure this out. Does the auto-calibration already take care of this Hz stuff (sorry, I'm an audio newb)?