PSW505 question...

Grimster74

I noticed that on the Polk Audio PSW505 plate amp there was the BASH logo on it which is the same amps the SVS Subwoofers use. Do you think possibly SVS is rubbing off onto the Polk subs or has Polk always used Bash Plate Amps. Just curious....

Dr. Spec

Doesn't surprise me. I've been noticing Polk is really ramping up the performance level of its subs. More power, better drivers, deeper extension. The competition is costing them sales - period.

Indigo owns the BASH technology patent, and I don't know if the plate amp in the 505 is made by Indigo, or just uses the BASH technology. Klipsch uses it in the Reference series of subwoofers, and so does Cambridge Soundworks and Sonance.

Doc

HBombToo

Originally posted by Dr. Spec
Doesn't surprise me. I've been noticing Polk is really ramping up the performance level of its subs.
Doc

Hey Doc, perhaps Polk needs to pull you into the test and measuring mix? Right up your alley IMO!

HBomb

Ceruleance

BASH technology is pretty standard in the subwoofer market. If anything, polk is taking hints from Harman International, rather than the comparably insignificant SVS. My Infinity subs have BASH amps in them, as do several other Harman products

burdette

I don't think Polk can consider SVS and their relative blast through the marketplace (as well as various forums) as insignificant. There are many men on this forum VERY dedicated to Polk loudspeakers who would never consider buying a Polk sub. That is not something for Polk to take lightly.

Maybe I'm not seeing whatever it is you're referring to, but I don't think SVS is too worried about the competition from subs being put out by Harmon.

shack

I believe what Ceruleance is referring to is the market share of the SVS and Adires of the world. While they are significant in the "hardcore" audio world they are very, very small in the general audio market. The "average" consumer is not going to spend the time and effort to research and discover the SVSs of the world...much less order sight unseen over the internet. The Club Polk Forum is a good example of this. There are almost 15,000 registered members...only about 200/400 or so post regularly and of those only a portion of those have a SVS (or equivalent). And the number of registered users is a fraction of the Polk owners that exist. I would bet that the percentage of Polk Audio owners that even know what a SVS is would be less than 1%.

I don't think SVS is too worried about the competition from subs being put out by Harmon

On the other hand at this point in time Harman is probably not too worried about SVS...for the very reasons stated above. The boutique specialty internet companies will have more of an impact (although still relatively small) on Harman's specialty companies like Revel and Mark Levinson than JBL or Infinity or Harman Kardon.

donahue

To get an idea of the SVS following, go to the AudioReview site and look at the reviews for SVS.

www.audioreview.com

Also, there is quite a bit of chatter on the Home Theater Forum regarding SVS.

The proof is in the pudding!

Ray

Ceruleance

right on Shack, it's all about market share. The fact is, SVS will never be a problem for polk or harman in terms of volume. If SVS really became popular and they started infiltrating retail B&M stores, the distribution costs, dealer markup, etc. etc. would raise the price significantly (possibly 100%). Also, they would need to export their assembly to asia which would lower the quality of the subs (check out SVS' site, they say these things themselves). So even if this eventually happened, what would they have? The customer walks into the B&M listening room and sees A huge ugly black carpet tube that's 2 to 3 times the price of everything else in the store, including the wood finished subs in a choice of colors to match speaker set ups.

shack

Originally posted by donahue
To get an idea of the SVS following, go to the AudioReview site and look at the reviews for SVS.

www.audioreview.com

Also, there is quite a bit of chatter on the Home Theater Forum regarding SVS.

The proof is in the pudding!

Ray

Maybe so, but it is a very small serving of pudding.

You can take all the people that post on Audio Review, HTF, AVS, Ecoustics, Audiogon, Club Polk, etc, etc, etc... and lump them all together...and they would still only make up a very small fraction of the home audio market. SVS makes a great product and they have a large following in the audio and HT circles but they are still insignificant in the global marketplace. Sort of like a flea on an elephants butt. The elephant may know it is there but it is so small that it really doesn't matter. Most of the people on this forum state that Polk's subs are no where near the quality of SVS. I would be willing to bet that Polk produces and sells more subs in a week than SVS does in a year. The same goes for Harman, Klipsch, B&W and so on.

Dr. Spec

Originally posted by Ceruleance
So even if this eventually happened, what would they have? The customer walks into the B&M listening room and sees A huge ugly black carpet tube that's 2 to 3 times the price of everything else in the store, including the wood finished subs in a choice of colors to match speaker set ups.

Apparently you have not been to SVS' website recently. Witness:

B4-Plus
PB2-Ultra
PB1-Plus
SS cylinder

All furniture grade wood finish. The B4-Plus and SS will be customed finished in any stain/color you desire. The PB2-Ultra and PB1-Plus come in a choice of five popular finishes.

Also, the PB1-ISD, while still a textured finish, has now has five color options in addition to black.

SVS has always recognized the appeal of the box subwoofer and the furniture grade wood finish. They simply had to prove themselves first on the performance front with the cylinder subwoofer and get the cash flow and capitol needed to exand into that market.

SVS has no desire to have its products distributed in retail stores. The superior cost/performance ratio of the SVS product IS because they are internet sales only. The world is increasingly going the way of e-tail, and do not discount the power of word of mouth. It is only a matter of time until SVS is a household name with the informed audiophile and home theater enthusiast.

Doc

burdette

Well... maybe it isn't true... maybe I think this only because I own Polks, and bought them at a time when they WERE only available in specialty boutiques... but I consider Polk in a different class than Infinity and JBL. Don't get me wrong, I have a general soft-spot for solid American speaker manufacturers. And I honestly believe that I could find a set of Infinity OR JBLs that I'd be happy with. But there is just something... I don't know... *something* about the 'feel' of a conglomerate like Harmon that is different, and not as positive, as a manufacturer dedicated to loudspeakers, as Polk is. And, honestly, anything carried by Best Buy has a couple of strikes against it from the start. Best Buy makes me want to wash my hands, even compared to CC, sort of like K-Mart is to Target. But, I worked at a BB long ago, and came away with generally a slimy opinion of it and the way it does business.

Ceruleance

Originally posted by Dr. Spec
It is only a matter of time until SVS is a household name with the informed audiophile and home theater enthusiast.

Doc

Maybe so, but that's a lot of qualifiers. First of all, polk and harman products cater to the non-audiophile, the casual listener, per se. Also, it must be the informed audiophile, as SVS doesn't really advertise, do they? (They can't really afford to). SVS will never be able to do volume sales and keep the same price/performance ratio, so they will never get their product into B&M demo rooms. There's no way an audio company is ever going to succeed in volume if consumers have to trust word of mouth and reviews and lay down close to a grand for most of the packages, without even hearing it for themselves.

Don't get me wrong though, Im saving up to finally hear my own SVS for the first time..

Ceruleance

Oh additionally, I have been to SVS' website and I know they have wood finishes coming out, but besides the PB1, all those subs are close to 2K NOW. Think of how much they would cost if CC ever carried them. The subs that even have a chance of making it into a volume market are the carpet finished tubes.

Dr. Spec

They are also coming out with a $300-$500 box sub within 60 days. Looks like they will be shoring up against the new HSU offerings.

It's funny, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, and the new HSU STF (single tuning frequency) 8", 10", and 12" subs look so much like the SVS PB1-ISD it's uncanny. Except HSU is offering a 10" and 8" version with higher tune points. See the HSU at the What's New section on their website.

You are right about the wood finish jobs being a grand or more. That's big $$ but if you look at a company like REL and compare performance and features, the SVS starts to look almost like a bargain. I guess it's all a matter of perspective.

I think SVS will be profitable regardless of its size, and hopefully will never grow to the point where it loses the personal touch and CS that has made them famous thus far.

I don't think you'll ever see any SVS model in a retail environment, even the cylinders. It's just not in their game plan. You are right, they would simply cost way too much money and would lose the great bang for the buck quotient they currently enjoy; they simply beat the snot out of comparably priced big name OEM subs.

What model are you potentially looking at?

Doc