Plumbing / Heating Folk

bobman1235

Hey all

I know we have a few HVAC / plumbers in da house, so I figured it couldn't hurt to at least ask an opinion.

I have an oil-fired boiler at home. It keeps resetting (the little red safety button pops up), maybe 2-5 times a day, depending on the day.

I've had a repairman out a few times, they've tried replacing the ignitor, the ignition module, and the sensor for the flame, to no avail. Basically, at this point they think the boiler is toast - it is indeed at the end of its life cycle (~20 years). His theory is a crack in the boiler is causing air to extinguish the flame occasionally.

My only question is is there really no way to VERIFY this hypothesis? I mean, it's an educated guess, and they tried replacing things first, but it seems ridiculous to me that they can just say "well, it works 95% of the time, but our guess is it's dead and it's time to drop 7 grand on a new boiler! Good luck!"

So if there's a crack in your boiler, is there a way to test it before you go the drastic route of replacing the boiler? Because that would have to wait until the spring as I don't have thousands laying around right now in ANY form, and I'd prefer not to go my whole winter pushing this stupid button 3x a day and waking up to a freezing house every morning.

gdb

Sounds like your primary control is on the fritz. At most, you need a new burner gun, or the controls for the one you've got. Beckett is the best there is. Most guys that service burners........shouldn't !

Amherst

Surely anything can be tested, whether the tech has the equipment or skill is another matter.

I had an old boiler that kept popping the reset and if I remember corectly the fuel line was the issue. Think clogged.

bobman1235

Haha, the guy that came out seemed to know his stuff, but lots of people SEEM competent.

I was talking to my dad and he has a cousin who has been doing this stuff for years, hopefully he can come by and give me another opinion.

gdb

If you can, have the guy install a DeLavan "Protec" nozzle/valve combo. It's a check valve system that really cuts down on start-up and shut-down smoke and rumbling!

jimmydep

Have they checked the oil filter and nozzle to see if they're clogged, or most likely the electrodes need to be adjusted or replaced. Seems as though they replaced the cad cell and transformer\ igniter. I'm assuming they confirmed that the motor and pump are working properly, that the fuel flow is adequate, and that the boiler flue passages are clear.
The whole leaking air from a cracked boiler theory just doesn't sound right to me.


Jimmy D
Master Plumber.

obieone

If this was a gas furnace, what he said would make sense, since a cracked heat exchanger will cause the high-limit to trip. Oil fired is a different set-up, so, I can't yay, or nay his prognosis.
Sorry.

gdb

The big question is, is a flame established and does it contine to burn up to the time of lock-out. If it does's, it's the eye/sensor or the primary control most likely.There's usually a test that can be performed by "jumpering" between two terminals after flame is established, depending on which p. control you have. Lots on the subject on the "tube"

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=oil+burner+service&aq=0

bobman1235

Just to clear up :

When this first started happening I had it all tuned up, they checked the flow, changed all the filters, all that stuff. They also did all the temperature, oxygen and efficiency readings, adn everything was good, which is even MORE evidence to me that it's not getting some "extra" air in the mixture, right?

Anyway, they have replaced the CAD sensor, the ignition module (the thing with the relay / button), and the transformer (The thing that arcs and actually lights the fire).

Things that HAVEN'T been replaced are the oil pump (might have a dead spot, no?) or any of the stuff associated with the power vent (it doesn't go into a chimney but rather a power vent).

It happens so rarely that it's really hard to "catch" it. THe only time I actually caught it try to turn on and fail, I heard a "click" when the boiler reached that threshold where it needed heat, then there was maybe a 30-second pause, and then the red button popped up. I waited the requisite 45 seconds for the lockout, pushed teh button, and it fired right up.

Oh, and the burner is all Becket stuff.

mrbigbluelight

jimmydep wrote: »

I'm assuming they confirmed that the motor and pump are working properly, that the fuel flow is adequate, and that the boiler flue passages are clear.
The whole leaking air from a cracked boiler theory just doesn't sound right to me.
Jimmy D
Master Plumber.

It's been too many years since I've messed with home oil-fed boilers (and been spoiled with gas fed Cleaver Brooks commerical) so the only suggestion I'd make is this: Jimmy D's feeling about the "cracked boiler" stuff is dead on, IMO.

Just sharing a gut feeling with you here, but I'll venture the thought of air in your fuel line.

I'm sure you will, but am very interested what this problem turns out to be.

obieone

Well, IF you are going to change out the boiler, you might want do it soon. That $1,500 tax credit ends 12/ 31.
Any chance, in the past 20 years, that LNG has made it down your street?

amulford

When it called for heat, (the clicking noise) you should have heard the pump kick on. i would check the electrodes.

You should be able to put in a new burner set. It won't cost as much as a new boiler (800-1200, depending on the model). You can get the one with higher efficiencies than you getting right now.

bobman1235

obieone wrote: »

Any chance, in the past 20 years, that LNG has made it down your street?

Nope, but I have toyed with teh idea of putting a large propane tank out back and doing the conversion. So many high-efficiency options with gas, like the on-demand water heaters and the like.

jimmydep

Even if your power vent system was working erratically, it wouldn't cause the burner to go into manual lockout (having to press the reset button)....from your description, I'm confident that your problem is with the burner and not the boiler.

Have the service company send out a different technician.

By going to propane or natural gas, you'll have a multitude of energy efficient options.

Keep warm....Jimmy

amulford

Keep in mind the propane can be expensive, too. The upside is the equipment is much more efficient, so you get more btu for the buck. You may get up 88% out of your oil fired, and that's as high as you can get, whereas you can get into the 90's with LPG.

You can get oil fired on demand water heaters/boilers, if you wanted. But like I said, your going to top out at 88%. It will still save on your oil consumption, though. Which will save you money.