Tweeter Install
eprater1
Posts: 175
This is my first ever shot at making some tweeter pods. initally i had them very far out and pointed directly at the opposing head rest on a tiral basis but they were just too bright that on axis for my taste. took the passenger side out and set it up in a much stealthier factory looking position pointing up at the rear view mirror. i initally used some jb weld to hold the 2" pvc into the cutout of the pillar, then went back with bondo and sanded smooth. a local shop (IDC out of Duncan Sc) had factor headliner material and pick up a yard for only 12 bucks. used thier recomended spray glue to attach material. in he pics it looks like completly the wrong color for some reason but in normal light it is dead on and even has the right nap. the second few pics are of the original setup that i still have to redo on the drivers side. the Hybrid audio Legatia Pro L1R2 come with a machined aluminum threaded ring that the tweet threads into. i had planned to use it but with just a bit material that fed into the hole afte trimming made it tight enough to thread the tweeter directly into the pvc.
Post edited by eprater1 on
Comments
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wow that 4th pic came out a little odd after i resized it. it wasnt quite long in actualality. in fact the 1st one looks wierd too like the tweet is pointed out the window.
what you guys think??? -
I'm assuming that the first three pics are from your revised install and the last two were your old install.
What I liked about your old install is the height and the fact that they are a bit more on axis and most importantly they are firing away from the windshield. I just feel that firing the highs off your windshield (as per the revised install) could be an issue while focusing up the highs.
The L1R2 tweets you're running are ring radiators. These tweets have a very narrow, almost beam like dispersion. Running these tweets off axis, like in your revised install, is going to cause FR issues between L/R tweet that you will not be able to correct with your eq. Take this from someone who's been there and done that. There's a thread here on tweeter placement. At the start of that thread I had my tweets off axis. IIRC I posted pics as well. By the end of that thread, I had them on axis and this is something I will not ever change now.
If you find the tweets bright on axis, use the tweet gain at the hu. I have my tweets cut -8db at the hu. The other thing with RR's is don't cross them too low. While the RR's have excellent top end extension 8khz+, they don't do so well playing below like 2khz. Cross the mids and tweets in the 4-5khz range play with the slopes on the tweets. Also use your L/R eq to get a more balanced FR from 3-4khz upwards.
Hope this helps. -
On-axis is generally better for any speaker, but the L1R2 is supposed to have great off-axis performance, even though it is a ring radiator. This particular tweeter is not supposed to suffer from poor off-axis performance. Hybrid Audio makes special mention of this.
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JjOn-axis is generally better for any speaker, but thje L1R2 is supposed to havehhh great off-axis performance, even though it is a ring radiator. This particular tweeter is not supposed to suffer from poor off-axis performance. Hybrid Audio makes special mention of this.
Hit the nail on the head. There is supposed to be ery little difference in resonse at up to 60 degrees per HAT testing graphs. That being said I understand what arun is saying. the pic does a poor job showing it but they are barley pointed fwd if any at all mostly straight accross and upwards. -
The sr tweets also have 'great' off axis response. Thats what the FR graphs say. Yet they sound much better on axis. Anyway, neat install.
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thanks for the input arun. i do plan on starting over on the piliar due to 2 small wrinkles that i have noticed and are diving me crazy. i plan to do a bit of a hybrid of the two. i want as perfect of sound as poss but at the same time do not want the look of a bulging tweet. another thing i got to thinking about is harmfull UV rays. the more i can get the tweets pointed in and level the less likely the will suffer any damage.
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How are you doing with all the tuning functions on the p-800? -
Its going well. I've had the unit for close to 2 years now so I understand the functions inside and out. Centering the vocals and highs has come fairly eaisly but its getting the mid bass centered and leveled out that seems to kill me. Also it seems to vary a lot from song to song. One minute Van Morison is right in center with the highhats right behind him and backup vocals off to the left, next song rolls around and all the giutar is low and to the right with blaring piano to the left, but not ina pleasant seperated sound. Almost seems to be a bad recording but I doubt that's the case. The Frampton Comes Alive CD I'd prob the most consistant to me. Any ideas?
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Its going well. I've had the unit for close to 2 years now so I understand the functions inside and out. Centering the vocals and highs has come fairly eaisly but its getting the mid bass centered and leveled out that seems to kill me. Also it seems to vary a lot from song to song. One minute Van Morison is right in center with the highhats right behind him and backup vocals off to the left, next song rolls around and all the giutar is low and to the right with blaring piano to the left, but not ina pleasant seperated sound. Almost seems to be a bad recording but I doubt that's the case. The Frampton Comes Alive CD I'd prob the most consistant to me. Any ideas?
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The recording quality on CD's varies. A few are well recorded, others are just decent and some are plain crappy. That said, if things are dialed in correctly, your sound souldn't vary drastically if you go from one well recorded / average to another. Maybe just a tweak here and there to compensate for what the engineer is highlighting or cutting.
If one song is recorded with the piano at centre stage and another song has it on the left, thats how you should hear it. If I understand your post correctly, you have issues with maintaing consistent tonality and issues of smearing (seperation).
Tonality, is largely a question of balance within and across the different frequency ranges. Sub bass<
>highs. Each range should be balanced within itself and with those around it. Balanced though, does not mean flat. You're not aiming for say 90 db's on all your frequencies. That would not sound very plesant. Rather, balanced means the ability to hear each instrument and the vocals as lifelike as you can get them. Also keep in mind that to a smaller but audible extent, this balance can also be affected by your TA, crossover points, slopes etc. Lets take an example.
Let's say that on a given song, the piano sounds good but the drums sound dull/woofy (can't think of a better term), the vocals sound just a touch harsh, maybe female vocals are clear but sound a bit stretched.
The drums issue could be a case that your mid/sub bass is hotter than it should be and/or that the integration/balance between them is an issue. It could even be an issue of TA between your mids and sub.
The piano sounding right could mean your mid range-tweets range is better than the lower end. But even here the 70-80hz notes on the piano would sound dull. On the female vocals sibilance / stretched highs / aah...could mean that 6-8khz and 1-5khz need work, on and on and on.
While you're trying to hit the right balance think of cutting something 99% of the time.
Smearing, is normally an issue of L/R balance from your equaliser. Some frequencies are louder from the left and some from the right. Getting as many of them centred as possible will give you that sense of seperation. With p-800 even though you have 16 frequencies for L/R control, there are frequencies that are much hotter on one side that you don't have control over. 160hz is one such example. It's much hotter from the right. So a guitar / bass note that hits this frequency will always drag the note down and towards your far mid.
It may help if you can give a run down on your current settings. Eq settings for L/R, xover slopes, TA and actual measured distances of the speakers, gains at the hu network etc. While the settings would vary based on the internal accoustics of your car, speaker placements etc etc, but based on your settings maybe I can help in setting this up a little differently.
I tried to keep the post short and look what happened lol.
