subwoofer value

acdds · July 2003

I am a new user and proud owner of a few polk speakers. My current system is: Front = Rti100's
Center = Csi40
Rear/surround = Rti38's
Sub = Sony SA-WM40
Receiver = Sony STR-DE545
TV = Sony wega 32in HD
I recently bought the Polk's and want to replace the receiver and sub. I can get a Polk 404 for $280 OB at CC. Any advice whether to buy that or wait a year and get a SVS. Also any advice on a reasonable 7.1 receiver for $800-$1000 range? Thanks any input would be great

gidrah · July 2003

I'm sure you're about to get a whole slew of SVS replies. How big is your room?

acdds · July 2003

The room is 23x15 with 10ft ceilings. I have read these posts for a week now and I get the idea the SVS is definitely a better sub but for $280 would a 404 be that bad for a year or 2. Should I concetrate on a new receiver before I worry about a new sub? I am all HT and very rarely listen to music.

acdds · July 2003

Also is 7.1 necessary since nothing that I know of is coded in 7 channels? Anybody have an idea of when DVD's will have a true 7channels?

Loud & Clear · July 2003

Well, from the audio side of the fence, it looks like you've got a really nice setup there with the weakest links apparently the receiver -- I've owned two different Sony STR-DE's, both the 845 and 915, neither of which measures up to my Denon 2802 in either performance or functionality, but most strikingly in the realm of build quality *ouch* -- and subwoofer, although admittedly I've never heard the Sony sub or seen performance charts (is that wrong?), and only have reviews and list price to view. Still, for the price on the 404 I'd go for it, then maybe when you feel the urge, or have the extra money, think about jumping into an SVS or whatever sub it is that rates out the best at that time.

I got my Denon for $549.00 at one of the online stores roughly a year and half ago; your receiver budget could bring you one very nice receiver, and a 7.1 receiver if need be, that's easily nicer than mine ... and again, I'm so much happier with mine than I was with either of the Sony STR-DE's.

To sum up: flat-out go for it and enjoy life while you still have it. This is what God wants.

Ceruleance · July 2003

even if they do eventually start encoding things in 7.1, you'll have to buy a new DVD player and use its decoder if you want to use the same receiver. I think some movies may have 6.1 discreet channels (Gladiator? can anyone back me on this one?) The real reason to get a 7.1 receiver is that they are capable of upmixing from a 5.1 or even a stereo source to output 7 channels. You may think upmixed channels suck, and if we are talking about Pro Logic I completely agree with you, but if you have ever heard Pro Logic II it is leaps and bounds better. Regardless, my opinion is that with a properly set up 5.1 system you will be completely satisfied and won't really miss the 7.1. I would buy a quality 5.1 receiver and use the money for that SVS. You have a fairly large room and you really need a decent subwoofer if you want to do your movies justice.

fgr41 · July 2003

I have a very similar setup to you and have been working out an answer to your very question for a few weeks. Personally I have decided to go for the SUB first. I think I'm going to go with one I can get from CC so I can do the upgrade on it and move into a higher quality sub in a year or 2. (limited budget while in school)

I have the STR-DE985 receiver, if I put in Eric Clapton Unplugged in and turn it up 100% the speakers draw so much power the receiver lights start to dim and looks like its going to blow.

Due to the fact that I don't blast my system on a regular basis I think my limited $ would be better spent on the sub for now and then upgrad the receiver next.

For $800-1000 you could buy a good, not killer but good, quality sub and a good quality receiver if you shop around.

Good luck!

brettw22 · July 2003

Originally posted by Ceruleance
even if they do eventually start encoding things in 7.1, you'll have to buy a new DVD player and use its decoder if you want to use the same receiver.

You're talkin about if he was to keep the receiver that he has, right? If that's the case, then the reason you'd have to get a new DVD player acdds is to have the DVD Player doing the ecoding, not the receiver that you have........But even that doesn't make sense really.....if you have a DVD player decoding 7 channels, and a receiver that only does 5 or 6, then there's really no point in getting a new DVD player.........(did I help or confuse there)

VTHokies · July 2003

For a 7.1 receiver, I really liked the Harman Kardon AVR-525 receiver. Sounds wonderful for home theater and music and has about every format there is. You can buy a brand new one for about $650 online (ebay/buy it now option). Don't worry about the 70 watts per channel as it powers my system to deafening proportions without any effort.

VTHokies

Fronts - RTi70s
Center - CSi40
Surrounds - FXi50
Subwoofer - SVS PB1-ISD
Receiver - HK AVR-525

brentman0110 · July 2003

The Onkyo TX-SR800 is a great 7.1 receiver. It goes for about 775.00 on ebay.

Double_S · July 2003

I have a Denon 2803. I really like it for home theater and music. I have also heard the Onkyo 800 on a home theater setup and it sounded good too. You might go listen to one and see what you think. I don't think you can go wrong between those two.

Shizelbs · July 2003

I've owned both a Sony DE receiver and that same sub. I would have to say that I would rather get a better receiver first. I am happy with the sub. I know it isnt the greatest, but it works. Its not great for jazz and classical music, but for rap, rock, and home theater it really does the job, especially at the price. Further more, after I got my Onkyo receiver (which replaced my Sony) I noticed that not only did all my speakers sound much much better, also did my sub. It was a much cleaner sound. So, in a sense, if you go for the receiver first, you will, in a sense, also bring new life to your sub.

I would second the idea of getting the Onkyo TX-SR 800. I love my 600, and wish I had the money to go for the 800. I think you speakers would love the change in receiver.

Lsi9 · July 2003

Look How sweet this sub is....

I have a HSU research Sub for years and it is truly amazing...>Click<

"the [$850 SVS 16-46PC] is not quite so clean at higher levels [compared with the VTF-3]...the SVS sub was 4 or 5 dB down from the Hsu [VTF-3] at 20 Hz...this allowed the Hsu to have a slight edge with really super-clean, super-deep bass program sources...the VTF-3 is the current champ of the low-priced super subwoofer class"
-Howard Ferstler, The Audiophile Voice (10/02)

[comparing the SVS 25-31PCi, Axiom EP-350, and VTF-3] "I would give the advantage to the HSU on classical music because it seemed the most accurate...Just for fun I played with some low test tones to see how each sub performed. The HSU easily won the battle, in playing the lowest audible frequencies below 20Hz"
-Brian Mitchell, Ecoustics(120/02)

acdds · July 2003

Thanks everybody for your input. I think I will wait on the sub and buy a good receiver first. I was looking at the Denon 2803 and the 3803. Is there a big difference between the two? The salesman tried to explain component switching and upcoding as the main differences. Is $1150 for the 3803 and $799 for the 2803 a good price? Thanks,

acdds · July 2003

Also, I looked at a NAD T762 that sounded fantastic, but it wasn't with Polk speakers (they were Definitive Technology). That receiver was $1300. Is that fair price and which is a better choice? Any ideas?

fireshoes · July 2003

The two Denon's are both nice receivers. $799 is regular retail for the 2803 and $1199 is retail for the 3803. You should be able to do better than that. If there is an Ultimate Electronics in your area, I know they are running 10% off through the end of July if you aren't financing. Online will be even less of course, but Denon doesn't really support online sales, so you most likely would not have a manufacturer's warranty. I would lean towards the 3803 since you have pretty good sized room.

Dr. Spec · July 2003

Originally posted by Lsi9
"the [$850 SVS 16-46PC] is not quite so clean at higher levels [compared with the VTF-3]...the SVS sub was 4 or 5 dB down from the Hsu [VTF-3] at 20 Hz...this allowed the Hsu to have a slight edge with really super-clean, super-deep bass program sources...the VTF-3 is the current champ of the low-priced super subwoofer class"
-Howard Ferstler, The Audiophile Voice (10/02)

[comparing the SVS 25-31PCi, Axiom EP-350, and VTF-3] "I would give the advantage to the HSU on classical music because it seemed the most accurate...Just for fun I played with some low test tones to see how each sub performed. The HSU easily won the battle, in playing the lowest audible frequencies below 20Hz"
-Brian Mitchell, Ecoustics(120/02)

Regarding quote #1:

That was the original SVS PC subwoofer with the 190 watt Fidek amp and the original 12" driver.

The current production 16-46PCi costs $649 ($200 LESS than the original), and houses the significantly stronger and lower distortion "Improved Standard Driver", and a 320 watt Indigo BASH amp. The 16-46PCi is capable of at least 4 dB more clean output at all frequencies above 16 Hz than its predecessor.

Whenever HSU devotees want to make HSU subs look superior to SVS subs, they dredge up that quote. The hard truth is the $825 SVS PC-Plus will crush the HSU VTF-3 in all measureable performance parameters: output, extension, THD, - you name it. The VTF-3 and the TN1220HO are great subs - but they are not in the same league as the SVS Plus subs.

Regarding Quote #2:

The $550 SVS 25-31 PCi goes head-to-head with the $850 VTF-3. That the two subs are even in the same room competing is a credit to SVS. Furthermore the 25-31 enclosure is tuned to 25 Hz - the least extension SVS offers. A better match-up extension wise would have been the $600 20-39PCi - that's Mitchell's fault, not SVS'.

Regardless, the SVS wins this competition overall:

" If you haven't figured out already, the SVS emerges as the winner of this face-off. You'll also be surprised to learn it is the least expensive of the group! It just goes to show you that more expensive doesn't always mean better. At just $549, the SVS is the best bargain in bass."

Furthermore, the same reviewer (Brian Mitchell) tested the 20-39PC-Plus later on and had this to say:

"Although the 25-31PCi is a great subwoofer, the 20-39PC-Plus is noticeably better. I have come to conclude the only thing better than a SVS sub, is another SVS sub."

"I tested the HSU VTF-3 previously, but I preferred the SVS 25-31PCi over it. The SVS 20-39PC-Plus betters them both."

"At its price point, I don't know of any sub that can compete against it. All contenders are welcome. The other subwoofer companies better watch out, SVS is coming!"

I never have anything bad to say about HSU subs - they're excellent. If SVS didn't exist, I'd own one. But I'll put up like-priced SVS and HSU subs anytime and I KNOW which one will come out on top - SVS - all day.

Doc

Double_S · July 2003

Originally posted by fireshoes
The two Denon's are both nice receivers. $799 is regular retail for the 2803 and $1199 is retail for the 3803. You should be able to do better than that. If there is an Ultimate Electronics in your area, I know they are running 10% off through the end of July if you aren't financing. Online will be even less of course, but Denon doesn't really support online sales, so you most likely would not have a manufacturer's warranty. I would lean towards the 3803 since you have pretty good sized room.

I agree. They should have room to work. I got my 2803 the first week they came out and got 10% off.

Double_S · July 2003

Originally posted by acdds
Also, I looked at a NAD T762 that sounded fantastic, but it wasn't with Polk speakers (they were Definitive Technology). That receiver was $1300. Is that fair price and which is a better choice? Any ideas?

I believe the NAD is only 5.1

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

subwoofer value

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