My tweeters keep shutting down I say! With rant.
FheBlackPassat
Posts: 42
As the title says.
I was doing some spirited listening. (ok it was friggin loud)
Going by the meters on my amp, at around 50 watts my tweeters completely shut down.
I did some investigation last night and discovered there some very questionable terminations inside the speaker cabinets.
I also discovered the SDA array is not functioning on the right channel. The connections on the inside of the binding post cup for the SDA array are completely jazzed up.
I was aghast at how sloppy the wiring is inside the cabinets.
And the wires themselves are just a mish-mash of wire types.
Is this the way Polk really did things or has somebody been inside of these previously. I purchased the speakers from the original owner and he claims nothing of the sort. (whatever)
And the crossover itself is held together with a bunch of plastic snap pins to the aluminum plate. Most of which aren't even holding the damn thing down.
Such a fine speaker on the skin but absolute cheesy-ness inside.
When I get some free time I will definitely be 'fixing' these issues with some ideas I have from previous cabinet builds.
Anyway, about the tweeters shutting down. Why would the protection be cutting in so soon?
It's not the amp. I tested with another source and it nets the same result.
Or is this just the result of age and upgrades are in order?
Sorry about the rant and winded post.
I was doing some spirited listening. (ok it was friggin loud)
Going by the meters on my amp, at around 50 watts my tweeters completely shut down.
I did some investigation last night and discovered there some very questionable terminations inside the speaker cabinets.
I also discovered the SDA array is not functioning on the right channel. The connections on the inside of the binding post cup for the SDA array are completely jazzed up.
I was aghast at how sloppy the wiring is inside the cabinets.
And the wires themselves are just a mish-mash of wire types.
Is this the way Polk really did things or has somebody been inside of these previously. I purchased the speakers from the original owner and he claims nothing of the sort. (whatever)
And the crossover itself is held together with a bunch of plastic snap pins to the aluminum plate. Most of which aren't even holding the damn thing down.
Such a fine speaker on the skin but absolute cheesy-ness inside.
When I get some free time I will definitely be 'fixing' these issues with some ideas I have from previous cabinet builds.
Anyway, about the tweeters shutting down. Why would the protection be cutting in so soon?
It's not the amp. I tested with another source and it nets the same result.
Or is this just the result of age and upgrades are in order?
Sorry about the rant and winded post.
Post edited by FheBlackPassat on
Comments
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Polyswitches go bad over time and trip at low levels. do yourself a favor and do a proper re-build of the Cross-overs, you can thank me latter
BTW what SDA's do you have? any pics? -
I'll second what Kevin said re: the polyswitches...I had the exact same thing happen in my RT-11T's at higher volumes and replaced them-problem solved.2 channel rig: MMF 2.2 turntable, Adcom GFP-715, Adcom GFA-555, Adcom ACE-515, Carver M-1.0t, Denon 5900 CD/SACD, SDA-SRS 2.3s (Zardoss modded), AQ Diamondback & King Cobra IC's and AQ Type 4 speaker cables
HT rig: Panny 50" G20 plasma, Directv DVR, Insignia BRD/DVD/SACD/DVD-A, Denon AVR-890, Fronts: Polk Monitor 70's, Rears: Deftech Mythos Gems, Center: Polk CS1, Sub: Polk PSW-505 -
OP does not say what his amp is. I agree poly switches are most likely the problem but the amp could be exasperating the situation.Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs -
FheBlackPassat wrote: »As the title says.
I was aghast at how sloppy the wiring is inside the cabinets.
And the wires themselves are just a mish-mash of wire types.
Is this the way Polk really did things or has somebody been inside of these previously. I purchased the speakers from the original owner and he claims nothing of the sort. (whatever)
And the crossover itself is held together with a bunch of plastic snap pins to the aluminum plate. Most of which aren't even holding the damn thing down.
Such a fine speaker on the skin but absolute cheesy-ness inside.
When I get some free time I will definitely be 'fixing' these issues with some ideas I have from previous cabinet builds.
Sorry about the rant and winded post.
Everything is unfortunately built to a price-point in manufacturing, and to be competative corners are cut when it's not a cost-no-object product. Also, many older products just weren't thought out as well as newer stuff. To that end I did a lot of securing of wiring so it won't rattle on the cabinet, as well as installed 1/2" thick felt/wool matting on the bottom half of my 2.3's. It made the bass much tighter. Next step is crossover rebuild, higher grade connectors, maybe better internal wiring as well. Also want to try some tweeter lens rings. These are great speakers, but like most anything there is room for good mod's.HT: Polk SDA SRS 2.3 main fronts, Klipsch RC-25 center channel, Polk RTi-150 rears, M&K V1B sub, Denon AVR-5800, Samsung 52" LCD, Sony BDP-S550
2 Channel: Carver ALS Platinum, Audio Research LS-2B preamp, Counterpoint SA-100 amplifier, Integra CD player, Denon SL7D tt, TC750 phono pre, Nikko tuner -
Polyswitches go bad over time and trip at low levels. do yourself a favor and do a proper re-build of the Cross-overs, you can thank me latter
BTW what SDA's do you have? any pics?
I have the SDA SRS circa 1986 -
OP does not say what his amp is.
Onkyo M506-RS dual mono block with matching M306-RS pre-amp
(European versions) -
The amp should be fine as long as its common ground, 200 watts continuous right? you could use more power though for higher levels. My guess would be the polyswitches in your cross-overs.
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Ok. I'm on board with upgrading the crossover's. And yes I'll do them 'proper'. I don't cut corners.
I was searching for upgrades and ran accross one of the forum members who was providing his services.
How much $ for a full on top of the line upgrade?
And as long as I'm at it. Where can I get the upgraded tweeters? -
you can get them from Polk CS, you can also upgrade then to 1.2"tl" status if I am not mistaken, Larry you want to chime in on this one?
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mention you are member of this forum for a discount on tweeters
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anddual mono block
will not work.SDA SRSPolitical Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
and will not work.
Why?
It's a dual mono block on a single chassis WITH common ground. Confirmed with an ohm meter. -
I just read throught DK's thread on his upgraded crossovers for the TL's. What if I just remove the polyswitch with a jumper for now, as DK did?
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If you jump the polyswitch, there will be no tweeter protection. Reasonable volume will be required in this configuration. You probably should go ahead and order new tweeters to replace the ones you blow.>
>
>This message has been scanned by the NSA and found to be free of harmful intent.< -
My interconnect cable is Blade/Blade.
And why won't my amps work?
I have already heard conflicting opinions and or facts on this topic. -
because of the interconnect cable With mono amps won't work.
Polk had to make it so that it would and so they designed a new interconnect cable and jack.
For the complete explanation you need to ask somebody like F1nut, ben62670, Darqueknight. Because I dont understand electronics that well.
OK. Maybe I'm missing something. I'm new to these speakers so I certainly don't know everything.
Sorry if I affended or came accross a little harsh. I'm just getting a little frustrated because this issue goes back and forth and a solid explanation has not been spelled out yet. -
FheBlackPassat wrote: »Why?
It's a dual mono block on a single chassis WITH common ground. Confirmed with an ohm meter.
Ok, since you confirmed it is common ground, you're good to go, but then your amp really isn't dual mono.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Other things to add to your list to check. Verify the positive and negative binding posts are really +/-. Some speakers were wired reversed inside and the SDA effect is lost. Check the solder connections on the two square inductors on the XO boards. They can break loose in shipment and either MW array will not drive.
Ask how I know about these.'65 427 Shelby Cobra
'72 Triumph TR-6
__________________
'88 Polk SDA SRS 1.2, with upgraded XO caps and Erse SDA inductors
'86 Polk SDA CRS+
'84 Polk Monitor 10A (Peerless tweeters)
'05 HSU VTF-3 Sub (Original OEM)
'20 HSU VTF-3 Sub (three more, 100% cloned)
'93 Carver TFM-35
'88 Carver M-1.0t
'88 Adcom GFT-555
'88 Adcom GFP-555
'88 Adcom GFA-555 (upgraded/restored)
'88 Adcom GFA-555 (a second one upgraded/restored)
'05 Onkyo DV-555 media
'89 Fosgate 360 Digital Space Matrix
'89 Fosgate 360 Digital Space Matrix, internal surround amp bridged to drive only a center channel
'91 Kenwood Basic M1D Amp
'89 Pioneer Laser Disc media
'89 Sony SuperBeta HiFi media
One PGA2310 based custom built remote volume control
Four Polk T-15's
Four Polk TSi-200's
Four Polk TSi-100's
Two Polk CS-10's -
Where to start?
1. It is ENTIRELY possible to make a "dual-mono" stereo amplifier using a single chassis and with common ground. The Aragon 4004s and 8008s are/were similarly spec'd, as are numerous other stereo amps. Sharing sheetmetal and a ground path doesn't negate the fact that the insulated side of the circuits, from (at least) the transformer secondary, to the + output jacks--share nothing. (Some designs use separate transformers, some designs use a single transformer having dual secondary windings.)
2. With the SRS-2 using blade/blade interconnect; you can "upgrade" to the RDO198 tweeter by replacing the 4.4uf capacitor in the crossover with a 5.8uf capacitor; and buying at least two but preferably four 198s. The blade/blade SRS-2 and the SDA-1B are practically the same speaker; with the SRS using a slightly larger cabinet and larger passive radiator; and with a single resistor different in the HF crossover. You owe it to yourself to read up on inspiredsports crossover upgrade to his SRS-2. I did, and performed the same capacitor change on my 1Bs, although I was cheap and only bought 198s for the primary tweeters, keeping the SL2000 for the secondaries.
It's a multi-page thread; but it's good especially from page 4 onward.
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74946
3. With quality amps that aren't over-driven, the polyswitches are redundant. If I was making and warrantying the product, I'd put in protection too...but I'm not, so I yanked 'em out and haven't looked back. Far as I'm concerned, my 1Bs need every bit of the treble boost that removing the polyswitches provide. In fact, I think they need more boost. I added a quasi-ribbon "super tweeter" crossed in at ~10Khz. Others will disagree. -
Where to start?
1. It is ENTIRELY possible to make a "dual-mono" stereo amplifier using a single chassis and with common ground. The Aragon 4004s and 8008s are/were similarly spec'd, as are numerous other stereo amps. Sharing sheetmetal and a ground path doesn't negate the fact that the insulated side of the circuits, from (at least) the transformer secondary, to the + output jacks--share nothing. (Some designs use separate transformers, some designs use a single transformer having dual secondary windings.)
Yet, others would argue that sharing the ground is not dual mono. A true dual-mono amp should be two fully independent mono amps in one chassis.2. With the SRS-2 using blade/blade interconnect; you can "upgrade" to the RDO198 tweeter by replacing the 4.4uf capacitor in the crossover with a 5.8uf capacitor; and buying at least two but preferably four 198s. The blade/blade SRS-2 and the SDA-1B are practically the same speaker; with the SRS using a slightly larger cabinet and larger passive radiator; and with a single resistor different in the HF crossover. You owe it to yourself to read up on inspiredsports crossover upgrade to his SRS-2. I did, and performed the same capacitor change on my 1Bs, although I was cheap and only bought 198s for the primary tweeters, keeping the SL2000 for the secondaries.
It's a multi-page thread; but it's good especially from page 4 onward.
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74946
Which still has not been "approved" by Polk.3. With quality amps that aren't over-driven, the polyswitches are redundant. If I was making and warrantying the product, I'd put in protection too...but I'm not, so I yanked 'em out and haven't looked back. Far as I'm concerned, my 1Bs need every bit of the treble boost that removing the polyswitches provide. In fact, I think they need more boost. I added a quasi-ribbon "super tweeter" crossed in at ~10Khz. Others will disagree.
I'm not trying to be a smart ****, but have you had your hearing checked?Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
You are correct sir. Bryston also uses this dual mono approach with several models such as the 2B and 3B which I happen to own.Where to start?
1. It is ENTIRELY possible to make a "dual-mono" stereo amplifier using a single chassis and with common ground. The Aragon 4004s and 8008s are/were similarly spec'd, as are numerous other stereo amps. Sharing sheetmetal and a ground path doesn't negate the fact that the insulated side of the circuits, from (at least) the transformer secondary, to the + output jacks--share nothing. . -
Well, after reading through all of the responses here, I have decided to tear into the speaker cabinets and do XO upgrades and fix all the stuff I consider not worthy on the inside, which is pretty much everything. I have a few other projects currently (2 vehicles getting major work done to them) but as I chug along I'll certainly post pics of my progress.
