Improving my Squeezebox Experience - DAC?

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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited November 2010
    To the OP, Google a phenomenon called Jitter which is one of the byproducts of digital transmission that degrade the transfer or 1's and 0's.

    H9

    Ahh okay - thanks for pointing me in the right direction.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited November 2010
    Jitter isn't as much of an issue now days. Most products have a jitter buffer built in that will 100% eliminate jitter.

    Jitter is a timing variance of the 1/0's being sent out. I doubt with today's products that it will be an issue (especially where there is no CD transport involved).
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited November 2010
    Yeah CD players were what I'd heard in reference to jitter.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,395
    edited November 2010
    jinjuku wrote: »
    Jitter isn't as much of an issue now days. Most products have a jitter buffer built in that will 100% eliminate jitter.

    Jitter is a timing variance of the 1/0's being sent out. I doubt with today's products that it will be an issue (especially where there is no CD transport involved).

    Well it still is a very real unless you are into uber $$$ gear. It's better than in 1984, but it's still a real issue that needs to be addressed. More often than not lower priced gear has poor jitter supression vs. higher priced gear. I'm speaking in GENERAL.

    Everything matters.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited November 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    Well it still is a very real unless you are into uber $$$ gear. It's better than in 1984, but it's still a real issue that needs to be addressed. More often than not lower priced gear has poor jitter supression vs. higher priced gear. I'm speaking in GENERAL.

    Everything matters.

    H9

    Shades of gray here. We will have to disagree.

    Two things have really made Jitter a non-issue when it comes to modern streaming devices: No wonky mechanicals like a CDP and a bit of buffer. In the digital domain really no more than 10-15ms of lead-in or lead-out buffer.

    BTW, as a simple example, the Behringer SRC2496 is a fully balance sample rate converter/DAC that offers jitter elimination for $170.


    SRC2496_P0141_FrontTopMontage_XL.jpg

    SRC2496_P0141_Rear_XL.jpg
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  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited November 2010
    I should add that for Jitter removal you need to use the wordclock function. Still don't believe you will need this with a single source like the SQB Touch.

    It's really meant for when you are going from something like DAT to CD, DAT to DAT etc...
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  • praedet
    praedet Posts: 314
    edited November 2010
    Make a battery power supply like this ;)

    113fed5b.jpg
    49e579a3.jpg
    119d7f71.jpg
    HT: Ninja Master LSi9s, Ninja Master LSiC, Slightly Modded LSiFXs, Modded LSi7s, Outlaw LFM-1 EX and Polk PSW125
    Outlaw 970 Preamp, Outlaw 7700 Amp, Velodyne SMS-1, Oppo BDP-83,
    2 APC H-15s and a Panamax 5400 for good measure ;)
    Stereo: DIY Alix Music Server, DODD Audio Battery Tube Buffer, Modded DAC-60 and MF V-Link (for now), DIY Silver ICs, Battery Powered Class D SDS-254 Amp, and GR-Research N2X Speakers
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  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited November 2010
    praedet wrote: »
    Make a battery power supply like this ;)

    113fed5b.jpg

    Now that is what I call a nice 'toy'... Wow:eek:

    Remember use this to only power a toy:biggrin:
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  • praedet
    praedet Posts: 314
    edited November 2010
    Thanks!
    HT: Ninja Master LSi9s, Ninja Master LSiC, Slightly Modded LSiFXs, Modded LSi7s, Outlaw LFM-1 EX and Polk PSW125
    Outlaw 970 Preamp, Outlaw 7700 Amp, Velodyne SMS-1, Oppo BDP-83,
    2 APC H-15s and a Panamax 5400 for good measure ;)
    Stereo: DIY Alix Music Server, DODD Audio Battery Tube Buffer, Modded DAC-60 and MF V-Link (for now), DIY Silver ICs, Battery Powered Class D SDS-254 Amp, and GR-Research N2X Speakers
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited November 2010
    @praedet

    very nice!

    Okay - well I ended up getting a Cambridge DAC magic - after ready a couple of reviews a comparison w/ other DACs in the price range, it seemed to fit the bill - especially since they cover distortion, jitter, etc.

    The DAC, SBTouch, & blue jeans ICs all came in today. I hooked up the SB3 to the Yamaha in my sister's room, so it'll still have a life. Early impressions are that sound quality is significantly better w/ the external DAC than with the receiver's..but I only hooked everything up about 30 min ago.

    Praz.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited November 2010
    PrazVT wrote: »
    @praedet

    very nice!

    Okay - well I ended up getting a Cambridge DAC magic - after ready a couple of reviews a comparison w/ other DACs in the price range, it seemed to fit the bill - especially since they cover distortion, jitter, etc.

    The DAC, SBTouch, & blue jeans ICs all came in today. I hooked up the SB3 to the Yamaha in my sister's room, so it'll still have a life. Early impressions are that sound quality is significantly better w/ the external DAC than with the receiver's..but I only hooked everything up about 30 min ago.

    Praz.

    Enjoy and:

    useless_without_pics_2.gif
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited November 2010
    LOL ... ok ok here are the pics:

    DSCN5234.JPG

    DSCN5229.JPG

    DSCN5226.JPG

    DSCN5235.JPG
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • Ern Dog
    Ern Dog Posts: 2,237
    edited November 2010
    Very cool. Can't wait to hear about your impressions after you have spent some time w/the new gear.
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited November 2010
    Initial reaction ... pure ear candy. Warm, clear ... great bass response. Probably the 2nd biggest improvement since getting amps :)

    Once again you guys prove your usefulness lol
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • jinjuku
    jinjuku Posts: 1,523
    edited November 2010
    If you feel like experimenting you could get a 12v battery and pigtail and run the DAC magic off it and see if you noise floor improves.

    Are you feeding it via TOSLink from the SQBT?
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited November 2010
    If you feel like experimenting you could get a 12v battery and pigtail and run the DAC magic off it and see if you noise floor improves.

    Are you feeding it via TOSLink from the SQBT?

    I think the eventual next step may be something along those lines jinjuku.

    As for the connections - SB Touch to DAC via digital coax; DAC to Denon CD input via RCA ICs. Just using blue jeans for both. Running the receiver in pure direct.
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,545
    edited November 2010
    Wicked, sounds like a good match! You picked a nice DAC.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Source: Rotel CD14MkII CD Player - Speakers: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • PrazVT
    PrazVT Posts: 1,607
    edited November 2010
    Thanks!
    Dali Optikon 1Mk2
    NAD D3020 V2
    Schiit Bifrost 2/64

    ..the rest are headphone setups.
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