Do you travel abroad? Not writing a book, see inside...

Jstas

I have a friend in Germany. He got married just this past Sunday. I was invited to the wedding but had to decline due to a prior commitment to another friend whose wedding I will be attending and have a part in this weekend. I wasn't able to make the schedule work.

But as I looked at prices for the trip, I was rather surprised at how much the cost has gone up in the past 10 years or so. Something like a 70% increase.

It got me wondering so I started looking around the Internet at travel websites and looked at some sites with statistics. U.S. citizens traveled the world in droves in the mid-80's all the way through the early 90's recession. It started to fall off in the late 90's and then an abrupt stop around 2001 for obvious reasons. Travel picked up again in 2002 and on and started dropping again in 2006-2007 when economic times started kicking us in the collective junk.

But even then, I noticed that the travel rates never got to more than 60% of what it was pre-2001. Granted, doesn't seem like alot but pre-2001, it was something like 20-30 million international trips a year over the entire population for business or pleasure. After, it barely gets to 15 million. That's a BIG difference.

So I talked to my friend to see how his wedding went and so on and we got to talking about the costs and such. He works for Sheraton Suites so he sees hard numbers for most of Europe all the time. He said that it has fallen off drastically and part of the reason Sheraton Suites had layoffs a couple years ago was the lack of travel from the U.S. tourists who tend to be the "spendiest" tourists out there. He also said that there is a question in tourism related travel out there, not just in Europe but the world over, of "Where are the Americans?" We apparently don't go anywhere anymore.

So it got me wondering why people aren't traveling anymore. Aside from the cost, are there other reasons? Is it because of the anti-American attitude that seems pre-dominant in the news media? (BTW, my friend says that's largely manufactured by politicians and not indicative of most of the population in any European country, even France.) Is it a lack of interest? Is it all the security hoops you have to jump through now? Yeah, the economy is a drag but we hit very hard times in the 90's as well and travel didn't drop off more than 10%. What changed this time around?

punk-roc

Well, i haven't researched this, but hasn't the U.S. dollar's value fallen against the Euro significantly during this time period you've mentioned? Not only are U.S. citizens going through harder economic times, but the money we have is not worth as much in Europe as it was even if our economy was perkier.

And this is even less fact-based, but it seems as though U.S. citizens are becoming more and more xenophobic, which would lead me to believe these same citizens would wish to travel overseas less.

Anyway, my thought would be that since the creation of the Euro (and its subsequent appreciation versus the USD) synergistically contributes to this decrease in European travel...

Jason

Jstas

Well, the Euro only enjoyed a large margin over the dollar from about 4th quarter '06 until mid '09 at the latest. During that period, the rate was, at times, over 2 U.S. Dollars to a Euro.

Right now it's 1.27 U.S. Dollars to a Euro and it's been steadily declining with small rallies here and there. So the exchange rate isn't that bad. It's certainly much better than 1.54 dollars to a pound. What is interesting is that the U.S./Canada rate is currently .94 U.S. to a Canadian dollar and that's been steady for a few years now with fluctuation in a pretty tight range from about .88 to .96.

Still, that difference could impact things but it's not that great of a difference. Certainly not one that would cause 50%+ of the travel to drop off. After all, people who travel abroad for pleasure aren't necessarily financially strapped. I see what you are saying though and I think that the major drop off from '06 to early '09 had alot to do with exchange rates as well as other economic factors.

punk-roc

Maybe, we need Chevy Chase to create a sequel to European Vacation.. maybe then we'd get the populace excited to visit abroad again.

I wonder too if travel to other cheaper foreign destinations has picked up. I know many people who have visited (or are planning to visit) SE Asian countries or South American countries.

I was googling around to see if I could find anything and did find some random British travel agency news-brief that discussed the increased travel to Egypt/Turkey/UAE areas (which I assume would fall out of that official "European" zone).

I couldn't find travel stats for SE Asia or South America.. but thats my last off-the-cuff hypothesis for why there might be decreased traffic to Europe-proper

Jason
Perhaps its not so much Euro versus USD appreciation, but Euro's small amount of appreciation compared with how much 1 USD gets you in SE Asia, etc.

cstmar01

punk-roc wrote: »

Maybe, we need Chevy Chase to create a sequel to European Vacation.. maybe then we'd get the populace excited to visit abroad again.

I wonder too if travel to other cheaper foreign destinations has picked up. I know many people who have visited (or are planning to visit) SE Asian countries or South American countries.

I was googling around to see if I could find anything and did find some random British travel agency news-brief that discussed the increased travel to Egypt/Turkey/UAE areas (which I assume would fall out of that official "European" zone).

I couldn't find travel stats for SE Asia or South America.. but thats my last off-the-cuff hypothesis for why there might be decreased traffic to Europe-proper

Jason
Perhaps its not so much Euro versus USD appreciation, but Euro's small amount of appreciation compared with how much 1 USD gets you in SE Asia, etc.

I think that besides economy ect that has something to possibly do with it. People would want to go to maybe "other hot areas" that people didn't used to think of traveling too.

Think about it, when I grew up (not all that long ago) I remember a lot of people always talking about their Euro vacations ect now, it seems like a lot are opting for going to Brazil, South America, Africa, Japan, ect to see things, or even keeping it local. With the prices rising for cost of traveling I've seen more families that want to stay more local and maybe just go to a different state as there is always fun things to exploer and see for history right here in the US, and can even be cheaper.

concealer404

I don't travel cuz e'erthang i want is in 'murica.

snow

anonymouse wrote: »

Economy + airfares + quality of travel experience

Flying is just horrendous these days. The airport security experience is horrible, airline service standards are just terrible, there is no leg space even on international flights, there are no free alcoholic beverages on US-Europe flights any more... it all adds up to... why bother?



Do I travel internationally? Extensively - but the travel is the part I dread. The destinations are always interesting.

Agreed I use to look forward to traveling now its something I dread, the cancellations the delays the security measures the cutting back on amenities etc it all ads up too I dont want to travel unless I have too.



REGARDS SNOW

punk-roc

Gosh, it must be that I'm younger and didn't get to travel much before 3-4 years ago.. While I'm not stoked to fly by any means. I don't see the security or lack of amenities as a deterrent to travel, since I'm used to our current level of cramped quarters, delays, and mediocore service!

Now I wish I had flown back pre-deregulation when people were pampered!

Jason

mdaudioguy

Not to make this political at all (becasue, of course, that's not allowed), but this makes me think of the staggering, incalculable costs that the 9/11 attacks have had, and continue to have. Sorry, that's depressing.

However, when I can afford it and have the time, I won't hesitate to travel. I'd love to see the world. Of course, there are just some places one can't go. Places like Iran, Afghanistan, and parts of South America and Africa are unfortunately off limits to American tourists. I'd love to visit Europe and Down Under.

Sherardp

I travel way too much..Costs have gone up and have come down. The thing I see most is US carriers pulling stupid moves. I mean having to pay for one bag is costing 25-50 bucks depending on airline. Good thing I stay in the Excutive cardholder's class or I'd be spending alot of coin on that. I try to save company funds where I can at least, but to charge for bags is just silly to me. YMMV.

munk

I think travel is down in many areas because of crime, terrorism and or kidnapping. Add narco terrorism to that list.... NO one's going to Juarez.

And it doesn't help that we're told the world hates us. I'm glad the dollar is doing better against the Euro, but we're still in the hole with canadian money. Probably the troubles in Greece and Spain injured the euro, but that may change when our own credit rating loses it's triple A status in a couple years.

And a lot of us hate flying now with all the hassle. My mother was on her death bed and I flew to AZ. I'd hastily thrown a couple days clothes supply, a toothbrush and paste into my small suitcase.

The security gal looked at the toothpaste. She had plastic gloves on in case there was AIDs or tuberculosis on the container.

"This is too big, the memo went out."

(sorry I didn't get the memo....) "Then throw it out." I told her.

That's how I found out how much a tube of toothpaste cost when my Mother died.

polktiger

For us reason #1 is cost and reason #1a is flying.

A couple, without being extravagent can easily spend $10,000 for a 10 day trip to Europe (without doing a bunch of shopping). For us, that is a chunk of change to plan for.

Also given are experience flying over the last 2 years, we have had zero interest getting on a plane unless it is absoluely necessary. Even smaller, less expensive trips here in the US (Yellowstone, Mt. Rushmore, Glacier, etc) have been put off because we have no interest putting up with the hassle of flying. After Southwest gets here, and we see if there is any improvement, we may consider leasure travel by plane. But there were 3 trips over the last 24 months that we could have driven (10 to 14 hrs each way) faster than we flew due to delays and cancellations which in turns brought their overbooking into play.

Thinking about going to Europe, for us requires connecting at least once, with the way flights are delayed we really have little confidence we will make our connection going across the Atlantic. You have then lost a valuable day (ignoring the hard cost).

TORI3

That's a common question many Europeans (and Canadians) asked me when I was spending time in East and South East Asia.

I think a lot has to do with our culture, media, values, educational system, and simple availability/means to travel. I don't think there's one independent variable that explains it all, but instead a whole host of variables that contribute to the lack of travel Americans embark on an annual basis.

When I got back stateside, I asked my friend who's a Sociologist the same question. He immediately said it was due to our consumerist culture. We simply value material goods, instead of purchases that lead to experiences -- I'm sure if I were to ask an Anthropologist the same question, I'd get a different answer.

I don't think either of us were completely correct, but it made for a great conversation. I'd love to see a peer-reviewed article that ponders this question.

joeparaski

polktiger wrote: »

For us reason #1 is cost and reason #1a is flying.

A couple, without being extravagent can easily spend $10,000 for a 10 day trip to Europe (without doing a bunch of shopping). For us, that is a chunk of change to plan for.

*****************************************************************************

You certainly aren't kidding there. I've got a 15 day trip to Italy planned and direct expenses are in the $6,000 range, and at the point we haven't visited anything or shopped yet. And we've got have price on 13 of the 15 nights accommodations because my wife works for a chain of hotels.

Joe

apphd

For me it's that flying sucks these days. Everyone above (anonymouse, snow, Sherardp) has already hit on the big reasons, add the fact I smoke, and many (domestic) airports do not even have a bar you can smoke in. All my travel would involve connecting flights, and going out and back through security is a pain. Probably better for my health but I don't like it. Add long term parking, and don't forget the other passengers that let to the Steven Slater moment of fame.

I remember flying in the late 70's early 80's and really enjoyed it, except for one flight back east from LAX with a woman next to me with a small cage and birds for her carry on. She talked to them the whole way. But I guess it could have been worse she could have been talking to me instead.:)

TroyD

From what I've seen, there are a couple of issues...one, travelling SUCKS. It's inconvenient and expensive. Flight availability ain't what it was.

While the reality of the strength of the dollar may be one thing....the perception across the board is that you get more bang/buck by staying home....

Throw in some post 9/11 skepticism...and there you go. I've gone abroad on both business and pleasure and either way, the travel portion of the program is a SERIOUS deterent for me.

BDT

cnh

TORI3 wrote: »

That's a common question many Europeans (and Canadians) asked me when I was spending time in East and South East Asia.

I think a lot has to do with our culture, media, values, educational system, and simple availability/means to travel. I don't think there's one independent variable that explains it all, but instead a whole host of variables that contribute to the lack of travel Americans embark on an annual basis.

When I got back stateside, I asked my friend who's a Sociologist the same question. He immediately said it was due to our consumerist culture. We simply value material goods, instead of purchases that lead to experiences -- I'm sure if I were to ask an Anthropologist the same question, I'd get a different answer.

I don't think either of us were completely correct, but it made for a great conversation. I'd love to see a peer-reviewed article that ponders this question.

Some interesting observations. I should add that there is an entire subsection of anthropology called the "Anthropology of Tourism", do a University library search on this....major journals include the American Anthropologist, American Ethnologist, Cultural Anthropology, etc. Although some of the articles are unreadable to the lay person...you can find some of interest.

As East Asia becomes an Economic Engine...Asian tourists are finding both Europe and North America attractive tourist destinations. One thing you will notice about Chinese tourists is that they MUST TAKE THE OBLIGATORY FAMILY PICTURE IN FRONT OF EVERY IMPORTANT CULTURAL/HISTORICAL SITE...

cnh

TORI3

Thanks, CNH!

I'll definitely check that out. You even listed the journals, which is gonna make it even easier.

This might not pertain directly to this thread, and I don't want to come across as hijacking this thread either, but I found it very interesting that people perceived China as the next superpower. All the Korean businessman and European tourist highlighted this "fact." When asked when this would happen, the responses usually ranged between 5 and 10 years.

Anyways, take it for what it's worth. I just find it interesting in how we're (and China) are perceived internationally.

Great thread.

exalted512

For me, its strictly cost.

I do hear funny stories of how people perceive America...especially Texans, but I could really care less. I don't travel to talk to other people on their perception of me, I go there to see the sights and have fun.

-Cody