Trading the 650C with a 740C
mguevarra61
Posts: 55
This question could have been posted a million times before. I know that the 840C is top of the line with Cambridge Audio but I just cannot spend that much money right now. Will trading the 650C with a 740C at least be a step in the right direction? I have never owned any upsampling CDP before. Any feedback?
Post edited by mguevarra61 on
Comments
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Probably. A lot depends if the rest of the gear, including all cables, is good enough to reveal previously unheard details. If the CDP's DAC is doing a better job but the rest of the system can't reveal it then you may as well stay with the 650C.Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
Probably. A lot depends if the rest of the gear, including all cables, is good enough to reveal previously unheard details. If the CDP's DAC is doing a better job but the rest of the system can't reveal it then you may as well stay with the 650C.
Parasound pre-amp model 2100
Parasound stereo amplifier model 2250
Kimber Kable Hero HB interconnects
Polk Audio RTi10 floorstanding speakers L/R
Will it make a difference? -
mguevarra61 wrote: »Parasound pre-amp model 2100
Parasound stereo amplifier model 2250
Kimber Kable Hero HB interconnects
Polk Audio RTi10 floorstanding speakers L/R
Will it make a difference?
They both use the dual Wolfson DAC design.
Major differences for just CDP playback would be the upsampling.
The 740c does have features that the 650c doesn't have - like digital inputs, so if you wanted to use the 740c as a DAC - that's kinda cool.
I've got the 640c V2 and am contemplating the jump up to the 840c.
If it were me - I'd save the coin until I could pop for the 840c.
H9: If you don't trust what you are hearing, then maybe you need to be less invested in a hobby which all the pleasure comes from listening to music. -
Erik Tracy wrote: »They both use the dual Wolfson DAC design.
Major differences for just CDP playback would be the upsampling.
The 740c does have features that the 650c doesn't have - like digital inputs, so if you wanted to use the 740c as a DAC - that's kinda cool.
I've got the 640c V2 and am contemplating the jump up to the 840c.
If it were me - I'd save the coin until I could pop for the 840c.
Thanks for the tip. Just called the audio store and they advised me that I would also be given the chance to trade-in the 740C for a new 840C within six months. That alone I think is a good reason to take the 740C offer. -
You can also buy the Cambridge-Audio DacMagic and use the CD player as a digital transport. The DacMagic is suppossed to be close to the 840C sound wise.Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
You can also buy the Cambridge-Audio DacMagic and use the CD player as a digital transport. The DacMagic is suppossed to be close to the 840C sound wise.
The DacMagic uses the dual Wolfson DACs, but the 840c uses a different set of DACs.
I could be wrong, probably am, but on paper, the DacMagic seems a closer match to what the 740c offers.
H9: If you don't trust what you are hearing, then maybe you need to be less invested in a hobby which all the pleasure comes from listening to music. -
I compared both in the same rig. From what I remember, the DacMagic images better, but the 840C is better in every other way, especially transparency.
But like all Cambridge sources, they all have the same "house sound"."He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche -
Personally, I have never heard the Dac Magic, but I remember a stereophile or the absolute sound review where the reviewer said it was close to the 840C. Close, but not there. However, the Dac Magic is $429 versus $1595 for the 840C. Anyway, it is just a thought for the OP to consider. Of course, after the OP gets a good digital IC he may as well buy the 804C.
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits. -
One other thing about the 840C, there is a suckout in the upper bass. Maybe it's part of their voicing? But I heard it in my room and at a local dealer."He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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Personally, I have never heard the Dac Magic, but I remember a stereophile or the absolute sound review where the reviewer said it was close to the 840C. Close, but not there. However, the Dac Magic is $429 versus $1595 for the 840C. Anyway, it is just a thought for the OP to consider. Of course, after the OP gets a good digital IC he may as well buy the 804C.
This is a really stupid question to ask. Do I have to go with digital interconnects instead of analog to be able to hear the upsampling capabilities of the 740C? I currently have Kimber's Hero HB interconnects from the pre-amp to the amp and also from the CDP to the pre-amp but they are analog obviously. About the DacMagic, the DACs are the same WM8740 from Wolfson so I don't think there is a difference in sound. Not that I'm complaining about the Wolfsons because they are terrific, I think. What did the other poster mean by a suckout in upper bass on the 840C? Help! -
mguevarra61 wrote: »This is a really stupid question to ask. Do I have to go with digital interconnects instead of analog to be able to hear the upsampling capabilities of the 740C? I currently have Kimber's Hero HB interconnects from the pre-amp to the amp and also from the CDP to the pre-amp but they are analog obviously. About the DacMagic, the DACs are the same WM8740 from Wolfson so I don't think there is a difference in sound. Not that I'm complaining about the Wolfsons because they are terrific, I think. What did the other poster mean by a suckout in upper bass on the 840C? Help!
You do not have to use digital interconnects w/ the 740c - the upsampling and D/A conversion is all internal to the unit - so you can still use your Kimber Heros.
I've never read about bass deficiencies in the 840c. It certainly makes me want to get 'ears on' a unit before I buy one.
The 640c V2 is certainly not deficient in bass. Compared to the standard Oppo 83, my AVR's DACs, and a Bel Canto DAC2 - the 640c has some tight punch for bass. Although, the 840c uses different DACs and is a different beast altogether.
All goes into the pot for simmering and consideration, eh?
H9: If you don't trust what you are hearing, then maybe you need to be less invested in a hobby which all the pleasure comes from listening to music. -
I've had the DACmagic since it came out and was auditioning the 840c around the same time. I did not notice the bass suckout Face mentioned. I found the 840c to be extremely precise and transparent. To me it was almost a little too clinical. The DACmagic is a step down from the 840, but for me, the difference in performance wasn't enough to justify the difference in price at the time.
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I've had the DACmagic since it came out and was auditioning the 840c around the same time. I did not notice the bass suckout Face mentioned. I found the 840c to be extremely precise and transparent. To me it was almost a little too clinical. The DACmagic is a step down from the 840, but for me, the difference in performance wasn't enough to justify the difference in price at the time.
This really makes me very curious about what the difference in sound is between the 650c and the 740c. I hope the upsampling capabilities of the 740c can flesh out more details and nuances in recordings. It has got to be a better player than the 650c. The audio store will give me another chance to trade-in the 740c with a 840c eventually within six months. I'll get to the 840c eventually. -
It's always a tough call trying to decide between two pieces of gear that are very similar. If I remember correctly, I couldn't really hear a difference between the 192kHz and 384kHz upsampling on the 840c. Maybe with some extended listening sessions. I do like the ability to use the 840c as a stand alone dac. I know this probably doesn't help much. It's going to come down to whether or not you notice a difference with your gear and how much you want to spend.
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Replaced my separates with an 840C earlier this year. Best move I ever made. Cambridge rocks.McIntosh MA-7000 Integrated
Cambridge Audio Azur 840C CD
B&W 805s
Logitech Transporter Wireless Link
Mac Mini Music Server
Furman Elite Power Conditioning
Signal Cable, Magic Power Cables
Signal Cable, Silver Resolution Balanced Interconnects -
When I first listened to my 740C the bass really jumped out at me. Can't say that I've tried the 640 or 840, but as Erik said, the DACs are different in the 840. If it were me, I would not move to the 740 unless you plan on using it as an external DAC. Otherwise you're just spending more money for the upsampling which not everyone prefers. I tend to not make marginal upgrades (because there is usually some transaction cost), so I would either stick with the 640 or jump up to the 840C.MAIN: Polk Lsi9s; Polk PSW505; Lsic (in box); Onkyo SR-875; Parasound 2250; Cambridge Audio 740C; LG BD370
OFFICE: Polk Lsi7; REL T3; HK 3490; CA 840W; Onkyo C-S5VL
BENCHED: CS20; OWM3s -
You might want to try monitoring Audiogon for a bit. You can probably find an 840C used, but in like new condition. Probably for less than you can purchase the 740C new.
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Just pulled the trigger on the 740C. Phenomenal sound. Definitely a step up from the 650C. Which is not in the least bit a let-down on the 650 since that CD player always managed to surprise me. Thanks for all the fabulous tidbits guys.
But.....I know that in six months, I have got to have the 840C. Come hell or high water. -
mguevarra61 wrote: »Just pulled the trigger on the 740C. Phenomenal sound. Definitely a step up from the 650C. Which is not in the least bit a let-down on the 650 since that CD player always managed to surprise me. Thanks for all the fabulous tidbits guys.
But.....I know that in six months, I have got to have the 840C. Come hell or high water.
Glad to hear! I have often wondered whether I would have been just as well off with the 640/50. Nice to know there is a noticeable difference.MAIN: Polk Lsi9s; Polk PSW505; Lsic (in box); Onkyo SR-875; Parasound 2250; Cambridge Audio 740C; LG BD370
OFFICE: Polk Lsi7; REL T3; HK 3490; CA 840W; Onkyo C-S5VL
BENCHED: CS20; OWM3s
