Need a power conditioner / amp. Are low end devices even worth considering?

DefaultGen

Hey guys, new at everything related to audio so bare with me. I don't have high quality stuff, but am trying to reasonably future-proof my setup so if I do upgrade I won't need to upgrade every single component.

As far as power conditioning goes, I've read that unless you're power regenerating by going AC -> DC -> AC, you're not really doing that much more than a surge protector does. I have a Belkin HT surge protector right now, and am wondering if I should add a decent power conditioner to my setup (within a budget of say $600). I was looking at the APC H15 but don't want to blow $250 I should be putting towards something that works a lot better.

As far as an amp goes, I'm looking at the Emotiva XPA-5 (200wpc, 8ohm). It's only $800, but I've seen amps with lower numbers on paper that go for thousands more. Is this just a quality of power thing? Is it worth getting a low end amp, or should I save my money for something better? Price range here is about $800 now, but I could save more.

concealer404

The H15 is a nice unit, and you shouldn't feel bad about buying it. It's not low end, it's also not top of the food chain, but it won't disappoint.

The XPA-5...

You an HT guy? If so, the XPA-5 should be fine. It's entry-level gear, and you get what you pay for. It's not bad. It's not great. It's not a world beater. It sure is LOUD, though.

On the flip side, $800 would go a LONG way on the used market. Sunfire Grand, bigass Adcom multi-channel, etc etc etc.

cstmar01

agreed with the above.

If doing pure HT the XPA-5 is plenty for your set up. Otherwise you could always look for a 3 channel or 2 channel for the front speakers and let the AVR do the work on the back. If your looking at upgrading in the future to say a 4 ohm speaker or don't know the 5 channel would be more future proof as then you don't have to worry at all.

Also if your willing to go used Adcom makes a very nice 5 channel amp that could be found for around that same price or less on the used market.

Also watts don't equal better. its about the quality of the power coming through. Also your side surrounds will vary rarely try and pull the max out of the amp your place on them as there typically isn't that much information that would need to be reproduced if your just HT focused, thats why it could run off the AVR just fine.

DefaultGen

I think I'll keep combing Audiogon for both of these devices in my price range, but the XPA-5 seems fine for my needs.

Also, do I plug the amp into the power conditioner? I see a PS Audio P500 for $700, which is a 500W conditioner. That wouldn't be able to support a 200wpc, 5 channel amp right? If so, a decent power device might be far out of my price range!

concealer404

DefaultGen wrote: »

I think I'll keep combing Audiogon for both of these devices in my price range, but the XPA-5 seems fine for my needs.

Also, do I plug the amp into the power conditioner? I see a PS Audio P500 for $700, which is a 500W conditioner. That wouldn't be able to support a 200wpc, 5 channel amp right? If so, a decent power device might be far out of my price range!

Two schools of thought on that. A lot of people say you shouldn't plug an amp into a conditioner, period.

What i think you should be worrying more about is the amps (as in measure of current) rather than the watts. I'd plug the XPA-5 into a conditioner. Whenever i put an amp on a conditioner, i tend to experience a more "quiet" listening experience. (Blacker blacks.)

I also wouldn't be too worried about trying to break the bank in this case. You have a nice setup in the makings, but to be brutally honest, it's entry level gear. (Not necessarily a bad thing) There isn't a need for you to go out and spend thousands of dollars on a conditioner.

fishbones

I am going through some of the same research right now on AC clean-up.
Most of what I've read says to start at the source first...dedicated lines with their own grounds (done by an electrician). This is said to make the biggest improvement for SQ dollar for dollar (and be similar in cost) - then go from there. Having their own ground will also help protect your equipment better than a shared one.

DefaultGen

If I saw myself staying anywhere for more than 6 months in the next few years, I'd certainly look into having an electrician rewire my place. Unfortunately, I'm only 21 and don't own my own place!

Forgive my ignorance about power regarding current and power, but the purpose of an amp is to give more power to the speakers right? If the conditioner only outputs 500W and the amp is plugged into that, wouldn't it not be getting enough power?

More confusing to me, what's the point of all this fancy power regeneration stuff if the amplifier driving your main speakers isn't plugged into it? Wouldn't that be the most important thing to provide with clean power?

Considering my price range and gear, I'm thinking about just getting the APC H15 for my TV and receiver and putting my amp into the wall.

concealer404

DefaultGen wrote: »

If I saw myself staying anywhere for more than 6 months in the next few years, I'd certainly look into having an electrician rewire my place. Unfortunately, I'm only 21 and don't own my own place!

Forgive my ignorance about power regarding current and power, but the purpose of an amp is to give more power to the speakers right? If the conditioner only outputs 500W and the amp is plugged into that, wouldn't it not be getting enough power?

More confusing to me, what's the point of all this fancy power regeneration stuff if the amplifier driving your main speakers isn't plugged into it? Wouldn't that be the most important thing to provide with clean power?

Considering my price range and gear, I'm thinking about just getting the APC H15 for my TV and receiver and putting my amp into the wall.

I'm not an electrical engineer, so i hope someone else will chime in, but i don't see the APC H15 choking the XPA-5 at sane listening levels.

For what it's worth, i had an Adcom GFA-5802 plugged into an APC H10, and i didn't notice any problems, and that's a juggernaut of an amp.

mole'

check out Vanns.com

they are having some good sales on the APC Power Conditioners

DefaultGen

There's actually an H15 for $200 shipped on Audiogon, I think I'll go with that. Thanks for the help guys.

mole'

the S10 is now 200 from vanns shipped new

concealer404

Dohoho!!!! Dilemma!

I'd probably go with the S10. Unless you really don't want silver face (i wouldn't).

DefaultGen

mole' wrote: »

the S10 is now 200 from vanns shipped new

The S10 is an H10 with battery backup right? What's the main advantage of this? If some power event happened, wouldn't everything live on the H15 anyway?

mole'

concealer404 wrote: »

Dohoho!!!! Dilemma!

I'd probably go with the S10. Unless you really don't want silver face (i wouldn't).

i got mine when it was 299

its 199 shipped now.

im gonna paint the face of mine black. the whole face plate comes off like a car stereo deck

mmadden28

DefaultGen wrote: »

The S10 is an H10 with battery backup right? What's the main advantage of this? If some power event happened, wouldn't everything live on the H15 anyway?

Battery backup would be useful if you're TV or projector require a cool down period, or if your playing XBox/PS3 and wanted to do a graceful shutdown of the game, etc. It can also be useful for a DVR or if you're using a HTPC.
You can do the same thing with an H10 and a separate UPS, but its just more convenient, and that is one helluva hot price for that unit--I'm considering jumping on it (even though I have 3 H15s already) just for the UPS.

As far as the Silver face? Just paint it. Others have done it for the H15s with success. They were blowing the silver H15s out last year for $99-it was a no brainer, esp. when a little spray paint resolves the issue.

The Emotiva amps are designed to NOT require any protection, that is direct from the lead engineer. But you can if you want to-I chose not to for my amps.
Some conditioners can restrict current flow, so just watch out for that--Also keep in mind the draw required by all your other gear as well. I don't remember the exact #s right now, but my setup was drawing 9-11 amps when I was testing out some of the extremes of my setup, but I never use my HT rig under those extremes normally.

As far as the XPA-5, I don't know what speakers you have, but I have an XPA-5 in my Family Room Home Theater setup driving my RTi-12s, a CSiA6 center and FXi3 surrounds, and I am very happy with its performance--But even more so since I installed dedicated circuits for it and the rest of my HT gear (in my case that did make a difference-I had some significant voltage drop/distance to the mains issues).

mmadden28

DefaultGen wrote: »

There's actually an H15 for $200 shipped on Audiogon, I think I'll go with that. Thanks for the help guys.

On the H15's, just keep in mind, as I mentioned in my post above, that they were being blown out for a few weeks for just $99 for the silver ones (and that was shipped/no tax). I've seen a lot go up for 'resale' for $200 or higher almost immediately after that and it still continues. Yeah I'm sure some of them may have paid higher and are just trying to recoupe a fair value, but I can't help thinking about it.

mole'

when i got my S10 over a week ago. it was 299, a few days later it dropped to 249 and not its 199.

Conradicles

concealer404 wrote: »

Dohoho!!!! Dilemma!

I'd probably go with the S10.

No kidding. That thing is huge though...make sure you have the room.
$199 with free shipping is a steal!:cool:

mole'

if they drop to 150, im gonna get a second one

Conradicles

The J10 is $150 I think, which is a good deal too.

mole'

http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/item/features/753883232/apc-s10?s_c=site_search

Krazyz1

For audio I LOVE A.R.T. Pro products. For A/V I like APC.