Parasound or Pass Labs

cstmar01

So ok. Next year I want to do a big upgrade come the spring/summer time. I decided that I really want to try either of these systems but was looking for imput in terms of what you guys would think would give me a better overall soundstage, detail, ect ect and would mesh better with the speakers I would be using.
At this time if I would go Parasound:
Parasound JC-1
Parasound JC-2
Wadia 830 CD Player or possibly a tubed player
PS Audio GCPH phono pre

The other would be:
Pass X250
Pass X-2
PS Audio GCPH phono pre
Wadia 830 CD player or possibly a tubed player.

The speakers I would try to obtain to have this one would be a pair of Carver AL-III or possibly some SDA's. All this stuff would be bought used to save money but the total budget I was figuring would be around 7-8K which I would not include the speakers in that. I also looked at Krell and McIntosh, but didn't really see anything that I wanted that I could fit into my budget.

Any imput would be great, it would be a big step over what I currently have thats for sure. I like tubes but still like my solid state and think I want to play in that before I would move over to any more tubed gear, possibly a tubed pre but SS amp for sure.

heiney9

In my mind not even a contest. Pass Labs all the way, but as usual it would be nice to hear them both. Nothing against Parasound because I know the JC series is no slouch.

If you're heading this way again you can stop by and get your Pass on.

leroyjr1

Chris

After seeing Ricardo Pass Lab this is the one I've been eyeing.

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?ampstran&1279062491&/Pass-Labs-X-250-Power-Amplifie

danz1906

Go for the Pass Lab!

reeltrouble1

The JC-1 is the E-ticket I would ride between these two, both nice but the Parasound will take top gun in this shoot-out.

One of the greatest bargains in hi-fi along with Maggie 20.1

RT1

Ern Dog

Well, I've never heard the Parasound amp you mentioned, so I really can't offer a fair comparison. I do have the Pass X150 and it is superb, that is if you are looking for a neutral presentation. It is very natural sounding. If you have any gear that is not neutral in the chain, it will stick out like a sore thumb, so careful pairing and synergy is key. For example a bright sounding source would not work well. A tube cdp might work well. I had a Bada HD-22 and it sounded sweet with the Pass amp.

reeltrouble1

well I guess sda or carver was not clear enough.

RT1

dorokusai

I'm a John Curl fan, not a Nelson Pass one.

heiney9

I'm a fan of both, but Nelson more.

Face

heiney9 wrote: »

I'm a fan of both, but Nelson more.

Since when?

dkg999

I don't think you could call either the Parasound or Pass amps a "better" sounding amp, because they are all fantastic. It's going to be the amp that has the best synergy with the rest of the system and your ears. Change the speakers, change the source(s), and either Pass or Parasound could sound better. I don't think you can go wrong either way.

That said the JC-1 amps are my dream amps!

heiney9

I don't dislike Parasound or John Curl. If I'm spending my own money and the choice is between those two..........I will always choose a Pass amp. In fact as narrow sighted as this might be I will probably never own another SS amp that isn't a Pass amp. Doesn't mean I'm not a fan of Parasound.

Now Bob Carver............I respect him as a designer but I will never own a Carver or Sunfire SS amp (or any other gear) I have never heard one that knocked my socks off.

Anyways that's my personal bias, rational or not.

H9

FTGV

dkg999 wrote: »

it's going to be the amp that has the best synergy with the rest of the system and your ears. Change the speakers, change the source(s), and either pass or parasound could sound better.

^^+1

dorokusai

heiney9 wrote: »

I don't dislike Parasound or John Curl. If I'm spending my own money and the choice is between those two..........I will always choose a Pass amp. In fact as narrow sighted as this might be I will probably never own another SS amp that isn't a Pass amp. Doesn't mean I'm not a fan of Parasound.

Now Bob Carver............I respect him as a designer but I will never own a Carver or Sunfire SS amp (or any other gear) I have never heard one that knocked my socks off.

Anyways that's my personal bias, rational or not.

H9

I don't believe there is anything wrong with having a solid opinion and choice in gear. If you've owned examples of both and you found that one has consistently worked better for you, so be it. I believe Pass Labs makes better boutique gear than Parasound by far but the two companies hit slightly different markets and buyers. Both are excellent choices.

The only place you'll find Carver gear is in my trash can or when I drop it off to Goodwill.

cstmar01

Thanks for the info guys. I want to try and demo these if possible but have never found a place that has them. I would really like to pair these with the carvers if I can find a pair or sea 1Cs or 2.3s.
If you guys were doing pass is the pre I selected a good match? Also is there a vry large noticable differance between the 250 and the 250.5 amps?

mewisemagic

dorokusai wrote: »

I don't believe there is anything wrong with having a solid opinion and choice in gear. If you've owned examples of both and you found that one has consistently worked better for you, so be it. I believe Pass Labs makes better boutique gear than Parasound by far but the two companies hit slightly different markets and buyers. Both are excellent choices.

The only place you'll find Carver gear is in my trash can or when I drop it off to Goodwill.

don't throw it away, send the carver stuff to me. i will even pay for ship/handling:D

Ern Dog

cstmar01 wrote: »

Also is there a very large noticable difference between the 250 and the 250.5 amps?

I found a large difference between the X150 and the X150.5. In a nutshell, the X series is totally neutral and natural from top to bottom. It may sound lean in the bass because it is so tight and clean. The X.5 series sounds more tube like in that it is warmer, fuller bass and smoother on the top.

Bottom line is that they are both exceptional amps and it is more about system synergy and what kind of sound you are looking for.

cstmar01

thanks for the info Ern Dog. Also what do you guys think about the pre that I suggested with it or is there a better pairing to use with a Pass Labs pre?

cstmar01

Speakers have been decided!

Carver Amazing Silvers.

I'm leaning hardcore towards the Parasound set up still, however would still be open to suggestions....

concealer404

Onkyo M510. Denon POA-8000s.

I also heard that the XPA-2 is a monster of an amp.

cstmar01

concealer404 wrote: »

Onkyo M510. Denon POA-8000s.

I also heard that the XPA-2 is a monster of an amp.

Emo's will not enter my home again.....unless it was free and being used as an HT amp...then sure...otherwise..no. hahaha

heiney9

cstmar01 wrote: »

Speakers have been decided!

Carver Amazing Silvers.

I'm leaning hardcore towards the Parasound set up still, however would still be open to suggestions....

Ask Ricardo about his Pass X250 and Maggies.

H9

concealer404

cstmar01 wrote: »

Emo's will not enter my home again.....unless it was free and being used as an HT amp...then sure...otherwise..no. hahaha

Alright alright... maybe the other two?

And yes... i'm weird. If i were in your shoes, i'd just start buying amps willynilly and trying them.

heiney9

concealer404 wrote: »

If i were in your shoes, i'd just start buying amps willynilly and trying them.

Or just buy a Pass Labs and your search is over.

H9

concealer404

heiney9 wrote: »

Or just buy a Pass Labs and your search is over.

H9

Where's the fun in that? I'm all about the journey to perfection. Take away the journey, and i wouldn't have any reference to know what i ended up with.

heiney9

I already walked the path for you. Find a new journey :D

H9

concealer404

heiney9 wrote: »

I already walked the path for you. Find a new journey :D

H9

D'oh!

Yes, sensei.

cstmar01

concealer404 wrote: »

Alright alright... maybe the other two?

And yes... i'm weird. If i were in your shoes, i'd just start buying amps willynilly and trying them.

eh I kinda want to have a system that I'm not tempted to switch out gear so much with. I know it can be fun but I'm looking at this and want to put a lot of money (for me that is) into it to get a great system that Maybe I would upgrade here and there but for the most part feel like ok this thing rocks, and not constantly looking to change stuff out again.

Brock, do you know of any dealers anywhere close that has the newer Pass stuff? I ask as I've never ever seen it in person, only read the reviews online. Also do you feel the newer Pass is better designed ect over the older or is it more of a toss up?

I know the .5 series are more high current but also carry a higher price tag, just wondering as well if the extra coin makes that much of a difference.

heiney9

Better is such a relative term. Some of the earlier stuff is "classic" and the .5 series is really a lot better (or different sounding) just ask Erndog who has an X150 and a new X150.5.

If I were going to get a new Pass amp I'd get a .5 series amp if I could afford it. For my SDA's my next amp will probably be the XA30.5. All the benefits of single ended class A and more reserve than what I have now. The XA30.5 is the Aleph meets the X series......an Aleph on steroids if you will.

For a speaker like the Amazings I'd probably go with an X150.5 or X250.5 or even X150 or X250. Ricardo LOVES his X250 with his Maggies, told me it may well be the last amp he needs to buy.

As far as dealers, it's the same as any other high/boutique manufacturer, very few outlets. Again, you are more than welcome to make a road trip to hear my Aleph if that will help you decide. I know Reno HiFi in Vegas is a big Pass dealer and they sell and locate lots of slightly used units and have a great rep and customer service. I believe they have an in home demo too. I believe Tim is the guy to talk to at Reno HiFi

http://www.renohifi.com/

And they are having a July sale!!!!! They have a used refurbished X250 for $2295......pretty damn good deal.

First Watt stuff isn't for your type of speakers

H9

Joe08867

For Carver Amazings I would go with Pass Labs. You do need to hear both for a true comparison.

My personal preference is Pass over Parasound. Not that Para is bad by any means. But the Pass seem more realistic to me.

woodguru

Put Pass Labs in the same room for side by side comparisons in equal systems and you will be looking for a used 350-A at about $1500+/-, two used as monoblocks will toast a pair of Pass X-600's, and the proof of that came when I had a guy trade me a pair for a pair of 350-R monoblocks.

Comparison statements like this are hard because in no way am I dogging Pass Labs, I love Pass equipment and kept the X-600's for over a year before I couldn't justify keeping them for grins and giggles. It's hard to make credible comparison statements when comparing great products like big Jeff Rowland monoblocks, BAT VK-150se mono's, Audio Research, etc. They all sound fantastic but sometimes there is something that just comes out doing it all better with no weakness and the Belles 350's do just that.

So if you are willing to spend somewhere in the $1500 to $2000 for the last amp you'll buy, (short of the additional one you will inevitably get sooner or later) read up on them, there isn't any negative to be found on them.

You've narrowed down to good stuff any of which can make you a happy camper.

By the way, I've had Parasound on my floor between speakers and they are nice. There's a whole lot of good equipment out there that can make great sounding systems, some just steps a bit beyond the realm of good.