Seeking that Tube Sound

Cpyder
Cpyder Posts: 514
edited June 2010 in 2 Channel Audio
Does anyone know if there is any audio filter software that mimics the sound of a tube amplifier? I think it'd be fun to play around with.
Post edited by Cpyder on
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  • decal
    decal Posts: 3,205
    edited June 2010
    Things that "mimic" other things,will leave you with a false impression!! The only way to truely hear what tubed equipment sounds like is to actually experience it.BTW,not all tubed equipment sounds the same or sounds good for that matter.Oh well,just my opinion.I'm quite sure others will disagree and that's alright by me.Everyone has the right to their own opinion.
    If you can't hear a difference, don't waste your money.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited June 2010
    I have a DAC/Preamp with a tubyness knob, it sounds like crap when enabled.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • sda2mike
    sda2mike Posts: 3,131
    edited June 2010
    get a tube buffer;)
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  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited June 2010
    Tubes are kind of audio filters, kind of a legacy generation 1 DSP if you will.

    The Cambridge Audio DACmagic has some DSP settings on it and I think one of them attempts to sound tubey. I was listening and playing with it at Audio Labs in Des Moines and it didn't do much for me, your experience may vary.
    DKG999
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  • headrott
    headrott Posts: 5,496
    edited June 2010
    Cpyder wrote: »
    Does anyone know if there is any audio filter software that mimics the sound of a tube amplifier? I think it'd be fun to play around with.

    There's an old concept I like to utilize. It's called "actual reality". That means everything you are seeing and hearing is actually coming from the actual device that produces that sound (or video). No mimicking anything. Quite a concept!;)

    Greg
    Relayer-Big-O-Poster.jpg
    Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
    "I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion." :\
    My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....

    "Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson

    "Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited June 2010
    Cpyder wrote: »
    Does anyone know if there is any audio filter software that mimics the sound of a tube amplifier? I think it'd be fun to play around with.

    Nope, just like a blow-up doll probably isn't the same as a real woman.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited June 2010
    headrott wrote: »
    There's an old concept I like to utilize. It's called "actual reality". That means everything you are seeing and hearing is actually coming from the actual device that produces that sound (or video). No mimicking anything. Quite a concept!;)

    Greg

    I agree, but at the same time, I have heard some of this DSP "modeling" sound pretty darned good. In my case, I have two separate plug ins for a recording program. One is a microphone modeler, the other is a guitar amp modeler. Are they as good as the real thing, IMO, no....but if you aren't paying strict attention, or are not made aware ahead of time, you probably wouldn't notice.

    I realize we're talking small nuances here, and I hear most of those traits in the software. I don't consider it a replacement for a primo selection of microphones, or a stable of vintage and high $$ amps, but it sounds great, and gives you a pretty good indication of what a particular model sounds like.

    Sorry for the derail, but thought I'd toss that out there.
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  • quadzilla
    quadzilla Posts: 1,543
    edited June 2010
    My impression is exactly the opposite. I play guitar and have owned several old tube heads and speaker cabs, and have played through a lot more than I've owned. Every single emulator I've heard was complete crap in comparison, just like every sampled guitar I've heard is crap. I'd even say that they emulators were just crap, period. They really don't even sound that similar to what they're supposedly emulating. But maybe that's just me.
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  • headrott
    headrott Posts: 5,496
    edited June 2010
    Hmmm. I can't agree that the nuances are small at all (to my ears anyway). Especially with tube sound, the differences between the analog sound of tubes and the DPS sound trying to reproduce a "tube sound" are quite far apart. DSP itself cannot get the analog sound of anything it's trying to replicate. Granted, if you wish to say that it's my opinion and it's subjective, so be it. But, I still know what I hear.

    Greg
    Relayer-Big-O-Poster.jpg
    Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
    "I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion." :\
    My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....

    "Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson

    "Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee
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  • headrott
    headrott Posts: 5,496
    edited June 2010
    quadzilla wrote: »
    My impression is exactly the opposite. I play guitar and have owned several old tube heads and speaker cabs, and have played through a lot more than I've owned. Every single emulator I've heard was complete crap in comparison, just like every sampled guitar I've heard is crap. I'd even say that they emulators were just crap, period. They really don't even sound that similar to what they're supposedly emulating. But maybe that's just me.

    Yes, with regards to the sampled instruments. I agree with you 100%. I like to use keyboards as an example. There is absolutely no comparison between a Mellotron and a digital sample trying to replicate a Mellotron. They are not even in the same league. The Mellotron is one of my favorite keyboards, and listening to older keyboard players replicating the Mellotron sounds they used to produce makes me sick.

    Greg
    Relayer-Big-O-Poster.jpg
    Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
    "I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion." :\
    My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....

    "Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson

    "Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited June 2010
    headrott wrote: »
    Hmmm. I can't agree that the nuances are small at all (to my ears anyway). Especially with tube sound, the differences between the analog sound of tubes and the DPS sound trying to reproduce a "tube sound" are quite far apart. DSP itself cannot get the analog sound of anything it's trying to replicate. Granted, if you wish to say that it's my opinion and it's subjective, so be it. But, I still know what I hear.

    Greg

    Not to mention the fact that a Telefunken ECC81 and Mullard ECC81 and Valvo ECC81 all sound different and they are in the same family of tube.

    I agree with LessisNevermore in the sense that the emulator does a pretty good job in many instance's, but very, very particular tone's, etc are hard to get. You'll never get Jimmy Page's Les Paul tone from a digital emulator, never. So very specific tone's like that are impossible, but getting a decent Les Paul sound with say Humbuckers one might have a hard time telling the difference. IMO, I put tubes in the same vein and JP's Les Paul sound, not easy to emulate to the fullest degree, if at all. You might get a "tube like" sound but it would still be missing the "soul" of tubes.

    And just so I address this now, Bob Carver's attempt with a resistor on one of SS amps is not an example. That test, experiment wasn't considered a resounding success by all who were in attendance so let's not try and use that as an example, because it's nowhere near conclusive.

    Just my .02c

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,804
    edited June 2010
    http://www.paia.com/tubestuff.asp
    http://www.paia.com/proddetail.asp?prod=9305KEN
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  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,420
    edited June 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    And just so I address this now, Bob Carver's attempt with a resistor on one of SS amps is not an example. That test, experiment wasn't considered a resounding success by all who were in attendance so let's not try and use that as an example, because it's nowhere near conclusive.

    Just my .02c

    H9

    He did manage to fool the guys at Stereo Review.:p

    As to the OP's question, the answer I have found so far in my journey is that no digitized peice of software have been able to fully mimic or duplicate tube-like sound... YET. Maybe someday, but for now they just don't come close. There have been several very good Solid State amps that can do a very good job and can compete with tubes, but nothing that comes off of a soundcard or a program can match the real thing in terms of Tubes. Reproduction of the music itself is another debate.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

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  • zingo
    zingo Posts: 11,258
    edited June 2010
    sda2mike wrote: »
    get a tube buffer;)

    Agreed; Or tube DAC. If you stick some tubes in your system right after your PC, you will probably get the tubey sound your looking for.
    Jake
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,967
    edited June 2010
    Audio filter software ?? Uhg..just the sound of that makes me go..:eek:
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