RTiA3 or RTi8??

integ3

I've narrowed it down to either of these two. The RTiA3 with stands are the same price as refurbished RTi8 towers. I'll have a CSi5 center, BIC F-12 sub, and OWM3 surrounds coming off of a Onkyo 606 reciever. In a 11'X12' roome that opens up to a dining room of the same size.

After work i'm headed to listen to them to see how they sound....but I dont think they have a set of RTi8 ondisplay. I'm just worried my 606 wont be enough to power the towers...and the RTiA3 might match up better with the center.

I dont know what to do!

Zeros

In my opinion, the 606 will power the RTi8s fine. I have RTI8s and a CSi5 running of my Denon 890 (and a 790 before that). You should have no problem driving them.

I think the more important question is do you want bookshelves or floor standers?

The RTi8's are a match for the CSi5. They are from the same series. Keep in mind though that the RTia series is very similar to the RTi series though. So the center will really match either ones.

mystik610

I'd definitely get the RTi8's....The extra mid-bass driver in the RTi8's will give you a much richer mid-range, which very important when it comes to balancing the brightness of the RTi line's tweeter.

The RTi8's are pretty efficient, and despite being towers, there's no reason why your AVR shouldn't be able to push them. It when you start looking at full-range towers like the RTi-10 and RTi12 that you want to look at separate amplification. I ran my RTi8's on an Onkyo 606 for a while and never had issues, and while they sound quite a bit better once I added external amplification, they sounded pretty good running off the AVR.

Both the RTi8 and RTi A3 share the same drivers as the CSi5, so they should timbre match damn near pearfectly.

polkfarmboy

I have a pair of rti8 in the flee market thats left over from my rti setup I just sold

I drove a csi5 , fxi3 rti6 and rti8's using an onkyo 607 and it sounded fantastic . I can tell you that the rta3 will sound crap with thecsi5 just like my rti6's did

The csi5 is a heavy humper and your going to need big rti8's to satisfy its needs

Ric5811

For the sze of room you are going into, I would use the Rti a3's. They will match with the center you have. The only difference between the RTi and RTia is the cabinets. But after 25 years in and out of this hobby, I see some things never change. People believe in all kinds of pseudo scientific crap still.

The A3's should match just fine with the center, you just need to set your AVR settings correctly.

I still am bewildered by the idea around here some put forth that the extra driver in the RTi12.Rti A9, or Rti 8 rti a5, make them less brighter than the A3, A7, Rti 10. Just doesn't make sense.

The reason is the cross over settings.

JimAckley

Not sure if it will help any, but I just bought a pair of A3s for my bedroom and they're plenty to fill up the room (which is close to the size of the room you're talking about). I'd definitely add a subwoofer to them though (which you said you have or are about to get, so that solves that). If you have the means to back them with an external amplifier, go for it. They are wall mountable and come with a long screw for each speaker that has more than enough length to anchor down in a stud in the wall, so you don't have to go out and find stands for them and then worry about knocking them off the stands later (been there, done that, gravity sucks). And the fact that they are bookshelves means you can fit them into just about any room easily in the future, whereas a floorstanding speaker requires a more room.

I haven't personally heard the RTi8 so I can't speak for them, but from everything I've gathered, the two lines are pretty much sonically indistinguishable. The CSi5 is match with the RTi8's, but should blend fine with the A3's too. Each set has it's pros/cons, so it's kinda up to you to decide is extra floor space more important or unimporant? Do you listen in a 2-channel mode a lot, warranting the need for larger left/right speakers, or are you going to be mainly listening in a 5-channel mode and be just fine with the pair of bookshelf speakers?

Ric5811

The centers in the Rti and Rti a line are matched throughout.

polkfarmboy

Ric5811 wrote: »

For the sze of room you are going into, I would use the Rti a3's. They will match with the center you have. The only difference between the RTi and RTia is the cabinets. But after 25 years in and out of this hobby, I see some things never change. People believe in all kinds of pseudo scientific crap still.

The A3's should match just fine with the center, you just need to set your AVR settings correctly.

I still am bewildered by the idea around here some put forth that the extra driver in the RTi12.Rti A9, or Rti 8 rti a5, make them less brighter than the A3, A7, Rti 10. Just doesn't make sense.

The reason is the cross over settings.

Ric you should change the batteries in your hearing aid or do you just hold one of them big brass horns to your ear when you test audio equipment

cnoat

the rti 8's are crazy bright.

Erik Tracy

JimAckley wrote: »

Not sure if it will help any, but I just bought a pair of A3s for my bedroom and they're plenty to fill up the room (which is close to the size of the room you're talking about). I'd definitely add a subwoofer to them though (which you said you have or are about to get, so that solves that). If you have the means to back them with an external amplifier, go for it. They are wall mountable and come with a long screw for each speaker that has more than enough length to anchor down in a stud in the wall, so you don't have to go out and find stands for them and then worry about knocking them off the stands later (been there, done that, gravity sucks). And the fact that they are bookshelves means you can fit them into just about any room easily in the future, whereas a floorstanding speaker requires a more room.

I haven't personally heard the RTi8 so I can't speak for them, but from everything I've gathered, the two lines are pretty much sonically indistinguishable. The CSi5 is match with the RTi8's, but should blend fine with the A3's too. Each set has it's pros/cons, so it's kinda up to you to decide is extra floor space more important or unimporant? Do you listen in a 2-channel mode a lot, warranting the need for larger left/right speakers, or are you going to be mainly listening in a 5-channel mode and be just fine with the pair of bookshelf speakers?

I agree.

I had RTiA3s with a sub in a family room about the same size that also opens onto my kitchen.

I could drive my teenage son out of the room when cranking up some Sabbath - and not cuz it was distorted. If you have clean power w/ reserves, the RTiA3s with a good sub can fill a mid-sized room easily.

I believe that Polk changed the cabinet construction to reduce resonancy - hence better sound - so there may be a sonic difference between the RTi and RTiA series - not just to make them look different.

integ3

Well I pulled the trigger and bought the RTi8 towers and the CSi5 center. overall I think this was the better choice. Later down the road I would have just hated to think "man, I wish I would have bought the towers".

I needed those OWM3 speakers because I don't have much room by my couch....so I couldn't have bought the RTiA3's then moved them to the sourround sound duty later because they just would'nt have fit.

Thanks everybody for your advice, I think I am going to LOVE my new speakers!


Kind of off topic but, what is the proper way to break-in new speakers like these?

packetjones

The only proper way to break them in is to listened to them loud!!!

Enjoy your new speakers

comfortablycurt

I'm gonna go against the grain and recommend the RTiA3's. I've owned both RTi8's and RTi6's(which are the older version of the A3), and I prefer the 6/A3's. They had a much more balanced sound overall to my ears, and didn't seem to be as bright as the RTi8's. For HT use, the difference would probably be negligible, but for 2 channel use, I preferred the 6's.


Also, when I had my RTi setup, I was running the 8's up front with a CSi5, and I was running them off of an Onkyo 606. It did a fantastic job of powering them. So, no worries there. It was an excellent sounding HT system.


edit-Nevermind, I see you already went with the 8's. You'll be very happy with your new toys. Like I mentioned, I used to run almost the exact same HT system, and it sounded GREAT!! Be sure to report back with some impressions when you get it up and running!


As far as breaking them in? Kick back and don't worry about it. Use them as you normally would...they'll break themselves in. If anything, maybe go kind of easy on the volume at first...but I wouldn't worry about it.

mystik610

congrats!

rmknotts123

If you decide on a pair of RTi A3's I have a pair I'm trying to get rid of.

Ric5811

polkfarmboy wrote: »

Ric you should change the batteries in your hearing aid or do you just hold one of them big brass horns to your ear when you test audio equipment

Nah, I am just not running a budget receiver to push quality speakers and blame it on them.

Good speakers only reflect what you put into them. It's inconceivable that one more 6.5 driver will make the csi 5 or a6 a beast compared to the A3's or rti 6's. They were designed to work flawlessly together. Same components.

mystik610

Ric5811 wrote: »

Nah, I am just not running a budget receiver to push quality speakers and blame it on them.

Good speakers only reflect what you put into them. It's inconceivable that one more 6.5 driver will make the csi 5 or a6 a beast compared to the A3's or rti 6's. They were designed to work flawlessly together. Same components.

Won't make it a beast, but it will change the characteristics of the mid-range pretty substancially. I've had the RTi8, CSi3, CSi5, RTi4, and the FXi3 in my listening area at various times. I've also played with the RTi10's and the RTi12's a bit at local shops in the area. The speakers are all timbre matched, but difference in the size of the mids drivers, and how many mids there are in each does make a difference in how the mid-range sounds. 'Brightness' in a speaker is, after all, a bias towards the upper frequencies over the mid frequencies.

Having said that, I have gone cycled through various receivers and amps with my set-up, and amplification certainly has a big effect on how the RTi speakers sound. They're pretty efficient, but not VERY efficient, and even the smaller speakers in the RTi line benefit pretty substancially from external amplification. The mid-range on the entire RTi line is actually very rich and detailed...but it takes more power than your average AVR will deliver, and some nice warm components to bring out their potential in the mid-range.

Ric5811

mystik610 wrote: »

Won't make it a beast, but it will change the characteristics of the mid-range pretty substancially. I've had the RTi8, CSi3, CSi5, RTi4, and the FXi3 in my listening area at various times. I've also played with the RTi10's and the RTi12's a bit at local shops in the area. The speakers are all timbre matched, but difference in the size of the mids drivers, and how many mids there are in each does make a difference in how the mid-range sounds. 'Brightness' in a speaker is, after all, a bias towards the upper frequencies over the mid frequencies.

Having said that, I have gone cycled through various receivers and amps with my set-up, and amplification certainly has a big effect on how the RTi speakers sound. They're pretty efficient, but not VERY efficient, and even the smaller speakers in the RTi line benefit pretty substancially from external amplification. The mid-range on the entire RTi line is actually very rich and detailed...but it takes more power than your average AVR will deliver, and some nice warm components to bring out their potential in the mid-range.

I agree wholeheartedly, I was responding to farmboy who said that the A3 would sound like crap with the csi5. Mids are the same size and cabinet volume is about the same. And he was using his experience to justify that, but powering with a 90wpc budget Onkyo that has more bells than power I wouldn't expect anything less than what he observed.

In addition, you shouldn't hear any diff in HT mode, MAYBEEEEE in 5 chan music mode, but I doubt it.

polkfarmboy

Ric5811 wrote: »

I agree wholeheartedly, I was responding to farmboy who said that the A3 would sound like crap with the csi5. Mids are the same size and cabinet volume is about the same. And he was using his experience to justify that, but powering with a 90wpc budget Onkyo that has more bells than power I wouldn't expect anything less than what he observed.

In addition, you shouldn't hear any diff in HT mode, MAYBEEEEE in 5 chan music mode, but I doubt it.

Ric unless you have been a fly on the wall you could not possibility know what gear I have played with besides the onkyo has plenty of power to make a good observation . While we are on the subject of calling other peoples gear budget in a snotty tone.... I think you should be mindful of your signature because your not exactly a high end guru

I would expect more from some one who claims to be an enthusiast to the hobby for more than 25 yrs.

mystik610

Ric5811 wrote: »

I agree wholeheartedly, I was responding to farmboy who said that the A3 would sound like crap with the csi5. Mids are the same size and cabinet volume is about the same. And he was using his experience to justify that, but powering with a 90wpc budget Onkyo that has more bells than power I wouldn't expect anything less than what he observed.

In addition, you shouldn't hear any diff in HT mode, MAYBEEEEE in 5 chan music mode, but I doubt it.

The problem is, most of the entry and mid-level Onkyo models aren't really driving 90wpc with 5 or 7 channels driven...its probably closer to 30 watts per channel in real world performance. Polk recommends 20-250 watts for the RTi line, so while an entry level AVR will adaquately drive a speaker like the RTi8 or RTi A3 without damaging it, its providing close to the bare minimum to drive it.

A separate amp is a necessity to drive the woofers in a full-range tower like the RTi12 and RTi10.....but the smaller speakers like the 8's definitely benefit from external amplification too. It takes some extra juice to get those mid-ranges really singing, and the mid-range on the RTi's have the potential to image beautifully. About a month back a fuse on my amp blew and I went a few days running my system via the AVR and it sounded flat out harsh compared to what I was used to. People who think the RTi8's are too bright, should probably feed them more power.

So I agree with you, but there are a lot of factors that affect the timbre/sound quality of a system. Driver configuration, amplification, processor, components and cabling all can have a pretty significant impact (some more than others).

kevhed72

I say get the A3s...that way, someday you can move them to your surrounds and then look at the RTiA7 or A9 if you want to upgrade the fronts. Then use the OWMs as rear surrounds (7.1 setup) or somewhere else in the house (5.1 setup). See how good we are at spending someone else's money

As far as external amps go, definitely look into this sometime down the road...

nhhiep

yep. people here are right about the 8s being bright. I've powered it with top of the line HK AVR 7000, Sony 444ES, and currently HK pa5800 5 channel amp in Bi-amp mode with the Sony 444ES (4 channels to Rti8s, 1 to CSi 5). Sony powers the rears.

Regardless of which amp I use, it's always too bright for music, but kick-**** in movies. For music, I usually have to turn down the Treble -2 on the AVR. even thought this Sony AVR and HK amp are considered on the warm side

Ric5811

polkfarmboy wrote: »

Ric unless you have been a fly on the wall you could not possibility know what gear I have played with besides the onkyo has plenty of power to make a good observation . While we are on the subject of calling other peoples gear budget in a snotty tone.... I think you should be mindful of your signature because your not exactly a high end guru

I would expect more from some one who claims to be an enthusiast to the hobby for more than 25 yrs.

Never claimed to be, and just started back up after being out of the game for years, (moving around a lot for a gov't job kinda screws you). But since the 80's I have had NAD, Carver, Polk, Thiel, Counterpoint,Nakamichi,Energy (Ref Conn 22" now those were speakers!) and many others, not to mention the countless days I spent in my best friends listening room auditioning everything from Nak amps to Levinson to McIntosh. Along with $15k B&O's, Maggies, Martin's, KEF and about every reference speaker out there at listening parties the local Hi Fi shop had. There were no internet forums back in the day, people had to seek each other out, actually listen THEN give their opinion.

So yeah, doing a major remodel on house crimps the HT budget..hell, everything crimps the HT budget:D!, but There are very few things out there new that I am impressed with. HT receivers are way overpriced for what they give you in sound, as far as 2 chan. They are great for HT alone, but that's about it.

Now, one thing I have learned over the years, is the more expensive the system, the less flexible...meaning stuck to very limited type of music and recordings. Did I love the megabucks speakers and amps, sure, but did they play the Boss well? Hell no!

Always came back to Polk, Carver, NAD. And since Counterpoint is gone now...just really never saw the justification in those super high end systems, dollar vs. improvement.

Not trying to be snooty, but being so absolute in your assessment when you are doing the comparative equivalent of driving a BMW M5 with a Ford Focus engine!:D


BTW, that Denon I have was $1k new in 1996, what is that in today's dollars? And I would put it up against anything Denon or Onkyo makes now in sound quality for the same price and 100wpc. Now it works as a pre and will for a little bit longer because of it's versatility, 5.1 analogs in, pre out etc.

And I will take that "vintage" Carver over most of the new stuff today. And I can be a cheap **** sometimes, so that CS 10 I got for $60? Does the job just fine for HT right now, plus it fits, Csi a6 is too big until the HT room gets done,and the Tsi 100's? Perfect for surrounds...

One thing I learned all these years? Keep it simple and it can sound better than no oxygen in the air priced gear. The audio gear movement has always been full of marketing BS and plenty of people to buy it. $200 cables, $1k speaker wire, isolation mounts for cd players, all hocus pocus when done blind. But people psych themselves out for that crap. They convince themselves they hear something better. When all the scientific testing has proven otherwise in 30 years.


So don't take it personal, I've seen and heard most of it before.

polkfarmboy

Well ric if what you say is true I may as well buy monster cables and an emotiva amp and be done with my searching

Ric5811

polkfarmboy wrote: »

Well ric if what you say is true I may as well buy monster cables and an emotiva amp and be done with my searching

No, you find the sound YOU like. As a former musician, one thing I learned, ACOUSTICS play a big part in how the sound is.And the other is pure, raw unadulterated power.

Before you spend $200 on a miracle cable, look at your acoustics and placement. Add power, and the one thing is most overlooked is source material. Highly compressed recordings either from CD's or ITunes will sound bright also. Most modern CD's suck in the mastering or over compression. There are still good recordings out there, even through ITunes, but it's tricky.

As far as Emotiva, never heard one, and don't want a war to start here, and yes I have been lurking for awhile..

As far as Monster Cable..eh, it's overpriced for the most part, some people swear buy it, have I used it? Yes, as far as cabling, the length of the run is more important than the marketing BS.

Have a good one and rock on!

integ3

Well I got everything hooked up. I'm coming off of a CS1 center and monitor 50 towers, and replaced them with the RTi8 towers with a CSi5 center. I'm no audiophile, so my description may not be the best, but overall I am really impressed. These speakers are nowhere near broken in yet, but the top end sounds much cleaner, and the mids are more pronounced.

I'm not sure how much of this is due to the excitement of having new speakers...but I really like them. Thanks again for everyones advice. Now I have to start researching an external amp. This damn hobby is bleeding me dry!

Does anyone know of a good external amp FAQ? Since I know nothing on the subject.