GM's loan repaid?

polktiger

Got to love the spin on this. The US and Canada pump $50 billion+ into the company. During the bankruptcy the "loan" was reduced to $8.1 billion. The other $53.4 billion goes to a form of equity.

Now GM is running radio ads talking about what great stewards they are and how they have repaid all the government loans. So, come buy a GM car from a great american company that has paid back all its government loans.

I guess we are supposed to forget the other $50 billion that they hope to "repay" by selling stock in a public offering.

Now, as I have said in other threads, I think GM gets an unfair shake with respect to "auto quality." They make some good cars just like Toyota and Honda can make some lemons. But, this has nothing to do about auto quality. This is just incredibly tacky and intentionally misleading advertising.

Amherst

Corporate theft..... the new way of the world.

concealer404

America, f*** yeah?

heiney9

Thing is..........a lot of people will believe what they are being told and that will translate to more sales.

thebluemonkey

They didnt repay them its just the money they are saving by leting go of some 60,000+ workers

concealer404

Here's a pretty informative story on the subject:

http://www.forbes.com/2010/04/23/general-motors-economy-bailout-opinions-columnists-shikha-dalmia.html

Way to go, GM!

Amherst

Good clarification.

Next step:Ask our legislators why communist propaganda is legally allowed on the airwaves to be fed to our nation of idiots who believe everything thrown at them?

concealer404

I've already submitted a complaint with the FCC. I wouldn't be surprised if GM got a major beatdown from the FCC over all this.

virtualdean

polktiger wrote: »

Got to love the spin on this. The US and Canada pump $50 billion+ into the company. During the bankruptcy the "loan" was reduced to $8.1 billion. The other $53.4 billion goes to a form of equity.

Now GM is running radio ads talking about what great stewards they are and how they have repaid all the government loans. So, come buy a GM car from a great american company that has paid back all its government loans.

I guess we are supposed to forget the other $50 billion that they hope to "repay" by selling stock in a public offering.

Now, as I have said in other threads, I think GM gets an unfair shake with respect to "auto quality." They make some good cars just like Toyota and Honda can make some lemons. But, this has nothing to do about auto quality. This is just incredibly tacky and intentionally misleading advertising.

Equity in a company is the same as money. They effectively sold stock to the govt. The govt will get it back. No harm no foul and a damn site better than letting it go bellyup. Now they paid the loan portion back. They did what they were tasked to do. I say good job.
New us cars are just fine. Ask someone who owns one. Pls no anecdotes about Uncle Fred and his experiences in his 78 volare.
I say buy American. The Japanese love to buy Japanese and the Koreans shun anything foreign if they can do it,,,the Chinese wont buy it if they don't buildit...Patriotism...building their countries up at our expense.
The decline and fall of America...sold out by our corporate leaders and the politicians in their pockets.
I'm out and off the soap box.

phuz

concealer404

virtualdean wrote: »

Equity in a company is the same as money. They effectively sold stock to the govt. The govt will get it back. No harm no foul and a damn site better than letting it go bellyup. Now they paid the loan portion back. They did what they were tasked to do. I say good job.
New us cars are just fine. Ask someone who owns one. Pls no anecdotes about Uncle Fred and his experiences in his 78 volare.
I say buy American. The Japanese love to buy Japanese and the Koreans shun anything foreign if they can do it,,,the Chinese wont buy it if they don't buildit...Patriotism...building their countries up at our expense.
The decline and fall of America...sold out by our corporate leaders and the politicians in their pockets.
I'm out and off the soap box.

They didn't even pay back the loan portion in reality, though. The equity in the company is one thing. It's over 72% government owned at this point.

But the fact that they "paid back" the true loan amount from part of $13.4 billion put into the company as "working capital" in an escrow account is just slimy.

All they're doing is playing a shell game.

I don't buy based on nationality. I buy what i like. Patriotism doesn't mean that i have to buy a car that i'm not happy with.

virtualdean

concealer404 wrote: »

They didn't even pay back the loan portion in reality, though. The equity in the company is one thing. It's over 72% government owned at this point.

But the fact that they "paid back" the true loan amount from part of $13.4 billion put into the company as "working capital" in an escrow account is just slimy.

All they're doing is playing a shell game.

I don't buy based on nationality. I buy what i like. Patriotism doesn't mean that i have to buy a car that i'm not happy with.

The Japanes, Germans and Koreans and Chinese applaud you.

Amherst

concealer404 wrote: »

I've already submitted a complaint with the FCC. I wouldn't be surprised if GM got a major beatdown from the FCC over all this.

Kudos to you.;)

They need to make a retraction of this insult.

Can complaints be filed online?

concealer404

virtualdean wrote: »

The Japanes, Germans and Koreans and Chinese applaud you.

As i applaud them for making cars that i'm actually interested in.

concealer404

Amherst wrote: »

Kudos to you.;)

They need to make a retraction of this insult.

Can complaints be filed online?

Yep.

http://esupport.fcc.gov/complaints.htm

Have at it, cheif!

Amherst

BTW> I happen to own a GM vehicle. But the propaganda has to stop.

concealer404

Amherst wrote: »

BTW> I happen to own a GM vehicle. But the propaganda has to stop.

They ran a full page ad in the Chicago Tribune saying how great they were for paying back the bailouts or something to that extent. I guess they think America is really that stupid?

Amherst

Went onto the FCC site and was unable to find a form for false advertisement. So, I called them on the phone and was informed that false advertisement claims are handled by the Federal Trade Commission, they can be reached by phone at 877-382-4357.

dudeinaroom

If you are complaining to the FCC about this then you better double, or triple up on complaining about BOSE. Talk about lies. Time to get a hold of the FTC

concealer404

dudeinaroom wrote: »

If you are complaining to the FCC about this then you better double, or triple up on complaining about BOSE. Talk about lies. Time to get a hold of the FTC

Yeah, i had a brain ****, sorry about that.

madmax

Ford has been very profitable lately, with NO loans. Never really been much of a Ford fan but if it was a choice for me I'd give my money to Ford now.
madmax

Jstas

Ford posted a $2.8bn profit for last quarter ($2.1bn after adjustments). That's about $.50 a share. But this time last year they had lost $.60 a share.

Ford still has about $35bn in debt though in mortgaged assets and equity loans. But if stock keeps growing and profitability stays high, that will go away quickly I think. Ford took over the top rank in Europe last month and seems poised to challenge VW and Toyota in the U.S. again for top honors. Especially since the new Fiesta is going on sale very shortly and the new SuperDuty is already on lots for the 2011 model year. A new Focus is showing up this summer and a New Explorer next year for 2012 as well. Lotsa new, interesting product that has been getting rave reviews. You could say that it's due to the bailouts, Toyota's woes and the economy but Ford has posted consistent growth since around November of last year. Granted it's not real growth since they took such a huge loss last year but they have sustained the rate of growth. That's not due to the detriment of others. Good product keeps rates high for a while.

The stock is still inexpensive. But it was as low as about $2 a share last year. It's trading at about $13.80 a share now. It's down for the day so far at $.66 but if you bought shares at their lowest point last year and let it ride, you would have made a killing by now. Wish I had the money last year. I would have been in on that. Reinvest dividends, would have made enough to buy my house in cash in a year. Would have been raped on taxes too but I would have own my own little piece of paradise outright as well.

markmarc

No question it was a shell game of accounting. But before I bash GM into the ground I'm going to keep hoping that their sales continue to improve so that the gov't can sell their stock to pay down TARP.

Tony M

I feel the Government should yank the comercials off the air!!!

And I'm not one who wants the Gov. to do much more than provide our protection and allow us to persue our own happiness.

I and my wife tried real hard to FINANCIALLY afford GM cars but through in the towel years ago and bought Toyota. Then another. But I have always had a FORD F-150 to do my hauling needs. All have been very, very dependable.;)

Now what I wrote below might only affect those above 35 or 40 yrs. old.
Any younger and I doubt you'ld understand my lifes' choices.

...My Dad was always working and fixing his american cars as I grew up. Then he would pass them to me and I would always spend MY weekends trying to keep them up. Only when I bought a Toyota did I get weekends to do what I wanted!!!..And I'm Serious!!
Granted, cars are a little more dependable from OUR guys but I spent 1000 weekends (years ago) being my own mechanic to go back. I tried staying with American cars, I truly did.

PhantomOG

virtualdean wrote: »

Equity in a company is the same as money. They effectively sold stock to the govt. The govt will get it back. No harm no foul and a damn site better than letting it go bellyup. Now they paid the loan portion back. They did what they were tasked to do. I say good job.
New us cars are just fine. Ask someone who owns one. Pls no anecdotes about Uncle Fred and his experiences in his 78 volare.
I say buy American. The Japanese love to buy Japanese and the Koreans shun anything foreign if they can do it,,,the Chinese wont buy it if they don't buildit...Patriotism...building their countries up at our expense.
The decline and fall of America...sold out by our corporate leaders and the politicians in their pockets.
I'm out and off the soap box.

Oh, don't worry. You like what happens in China, that is the road we are going down. The government propaganda machine is just getting going. Sounds like you are ready to line up and believe what you are told. :rolleyes:

Buying American / patriotism has nothing to do with these commercials. Its straight up lies. I will never, ever consider buying a Government Motors vehicle after they pulled this stunt. If they had put their head down, worked hard, and come out the other side of this a stronger, better company I could have at least applauded the company despite the fact I didn't agree with the bailout in the first place. This behavior is just plain despicable.

Airplay355

My Subaru was made in Indiana I guess I'm a communist...

wz2p7j

concealer404 wrote: »

They didn't even pay back the loan portion in reality, though. The equity in the company is one thing. It's over 72% government owned at this point.

But the fact that they "paid back" the true loan amount from part of $13.4 billion put into the company as "working capital" in an escrow account is just slimy.

All they're doing is playing a shell game.

I don't buy based on nationality. I buy what i like. Patriotism doesn't mean that i have to buy a car that i'm not happy with.

Businesses survive on cash. GM was in a cash crisis when the gov't stepped in and loaned 'em some working capital to help them through a tough period.
Now GM has improved it's expenses and cash flow and is paying the gov't back because they can survive on their own working capital.

An analogy is, I'm your friend and can't pay my heating bill for a few months. So you help me out by loaning me some money with the agreement I'll pay you back in 6 months. But I get my job back or whatever and pay you back the dough in 3 months. Then you turn around and call my slimy for doing exactly what we agreed to do only better.

Chris

nooshinjohn

Airplay355 wrote: »

My Subaru was made in Indiana I guess I'm a communist...

And I or my brothers at the plant built it for you.:D

Thank you Comrade!:rolleyes:;):p

audiobliss

concealer404 wrote: »

Here's a pretty informative story on the subject:

http://www.forbes.com/2010/04/23/general-motors-economy-bailout-opinions-columnists-shikha-dalmia.html

Way to go, GM!

Just read that.

Still trying to pull the dagger outta my heart.

concealer404

wz2p7j wrote: »

Businesses survive on cash. GM was in a cash crisis when the gov't stepped in and loaned 'em some working capital to help them through a tough period.
Now GM has improved it's expenses and cash flow and is paying the gov't back because they can survive on their own working capital.

An analogy is, I'm your friend and can't pay my heating bill for a few months. So you help me out by loaning me some money with the agreement I'll pay you back in 6 months. But I get my job back or whatever and pay you back the dough in 3 months. Then you turn around and call my slimy for doing exactly what we agreed to do only better.

Chris

Uh... what?

1) The dough hasn't been paid back
2) What they paid back came out of money that was loaned to them by the government. They used loaned government money to pay back a government loan, and now we get to listen to that Ed Whitaker f***stick every few minutes on TV tell us what great people they are. All that's missing is a bigass "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED" banner in the background. What ISN'T slimy about that?

nooshinjohn

wz2p7j wrote: »

Chris

The only true portion of your statement is this...

GM is owned by the taxpayer now. The loan will be paid in full when the government owns ZERO SHARES of stock in this company AND every penny used to buy said stock or otherwise bail the company out has been returned to the treasury...WITH A SHITLOAD of INTEREST.:)