Parasound vs B&K for RTiA9's?

ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
Hey guys, thanks for the previous responses on amps for my RTi's. I'm about ready to pull the trigger on an amp, just trying to decide between a B&K Signature 4420 for $450 or a Parasound HCA-2200II for $750. Is the HCA going to be a better amp for the money? Especially paired with the RTi's.
Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505

Comments

  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    For reference, I do pretty much 50/50 HT and music, but really only care about music quality in this case. I listen to lots of different music so its hard to pin that part down but I guess electronica and rock (modern and classic) are the top of the list.
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • motorhead43026motorhead43026 Posts: 2,799
    Hca-2200II
    2 channel: Anthem 225 Integrated amp; Parasound Ztuner; TechnicsTT SL1350; Vincent PHO-8 phono pre; Marantz CD6005 spinner; Polk Signature S60's;Cables: Wireworld Eclipse IC; Audioquest Big Sur IC; LAT International speaker cables; PS Audio AC-3 power cords, all into a PS Audio Dectet Power center.

    All TV's sound enhanced by Polk Magnfi Mini's.

    Other; SDA2BTL's, M10 series II, M7C's, Hafler XL600 amp, RB-980BX, Parasound HCA-1500 amp , P5 preamp, all in storage.

    Political memes posted as fact and accepted as fact, are sign language of the ignorant, for the ignorant

    tonyb said " but even socialists can do a good thing here and there
  • cfrizzcfrizz Posts: 13,044
    I can tell you that Polk & Parasound are a winning combination.
    Sunfire TGP III PrePro, Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature 405wpc 5 ch. Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony Bravia KDL-40R510C TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Boston VR-920 Center Channel, SVS NSD-12 SB12 Subwoofer, Polk DSW 400 Subwoofer, Polk FXi-3 Surround Speakers
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    Awesome, thanks. I was leaning toward the Parasound already as it just seems like a higher quality amp. But I thought it would be good to check with the experts here before diving in.
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • gudnoyezgudnoyez Posts: 6,350
    Parasound is what my A9s are hooked up to, so Parasound it is. (At least my opinion), along with the other responses posted above.
    Home Theater
    Parasound Halo A 31 OnkyoTX-NR838 Sony XBR55X850B 55" 4K RtiA9 Fronts CsiA6 Center RtiA3 Rears FxiA6 Side Surrounds Dual Psw 111's Oppo 105D Signal Ultra Speaker Cables & IC's Signal Magic Power Cable Technics SL Q300 Panamax MR4300 Audioquest Chocolate HDMI Cables Audioquest Forest USB Cable

    2 Channel
    Adcom 555II Vincent SA-T1 Marantz SA 15S2 Denon DR-M11 Clearaudio Bluemotion SDA 2.3tl's (Z) edition MIT Terminator II Speaker Cables & IC's Adcom 545II Adcom Gtp-450 Marantz CD5004 Technics M245X SDA 2B's, SDA CRS+

    Stuff for the Head
    JD LABS C5 Headphone Amplifier, Sennheiser HD 598, Polk Audio Buckle, Polk Audio Hinge, Velodyne vPulse, Bose IE2, Sennheiser CX 200 Street II, Sennheiser MX 365

    Shower & Off the beaten path Rigs
    Polk Audio Boom Swimmer, Polk Audio Urchin B)
  • msgmsg Posts: 4,270
    I'm a fan of both brands. I had to look up the Parasound to review. Holy moly that thing's got some fat numbers. If it were the 1500, I'd have said it'd be a closer race with the B&K, B&K offering higher current, but that 2200 has two independent toroids and peaks at 90A.

    http://www.parasound.com/vintage/hca2200.php

    Curious, what do you think of the speaker sound right now with the type of music you enjoy?
  • Inspector 24Inspector 24 Posts: 1,064
    Biased toward Parasound here too. Signature explains it. But either is a massive improvement over just an integrated receiver. They want current. Give them all the currents. In my experience they really wake up around a high current 200wpc rms. Diminishing returns after that but of course it depends on your room, music style, volume, etc.
    Down
    RTiA9 - CSiA6 - FXiA6 - Dual HSU VTF-15H Mk2
    Parasound HCA-3500 - HCA-2003A - Marantz SR7005
    Sim2 D60 - Dragonfly 106" Panny 500

    Up
    LSi15 LSiC - RX-V3000
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    msg wrote: »
    Curious, what do you think of the speaker sound right now with the type of music you enjoy?
    The RTi's are really my first foray into higher end audio. I know they're not anywhere near the high end of HiFi - but the only speakers I've invested decent money in before this have been for PA, not HiFi. Maybe some would call this Mid-Fi? Anyway, as soon as I hooked them up I was amazed at the wide, detailed soundstage these speakers have. I quite like the brightness because it seems to be in a detailed way, not a shrill way (if that makes sense). But, I feel like they could do better in the lower midrange and bass regions. I guess "thin" is the word?
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • chumliechumlie Posts: 8,387
    Can't go wrong either way BUT I wouldn't trade my 1500a for either. Now an A21 is another story.
  • motorhead43026motorhead43026 Posts: 2,799
    The 2200II is an actual John Curl design. Not a Parasound product based on a John Curl design, as many of their amps are.
    2 channel: Anthem 225 Integrated amp; Parasound Ztuner; TechnicsTT SL1350; Vincent PHO-8 phono pre; Marantz CD6005 spinner; Polk Signature S60's;Cables: Wireworld Eclipse IC; Audioquest Big Sur IC; LAT International speaker cables; PS Audio AC-3 power cords, all into a PS Audio Dectet Power center.

    All TV's sound enhanced by Polk Magnfi Mini's.

    Other; SDA2BTL's, M10 series II, M7C's, Hafler XL600 amp, RB-980BX, Parasound HCA-1500 amp , P5 preamp, all in storage.

    Political memes posted as fact and accepted as fact, are sign language of the ignorant, for the ignorant

    tonyb said " but even socialists can do a good thing here and there
  • motorhead43026motorhead43026 Posts: 2,799
    edited July 12
    Yeah, 50 continuous amps, 90 peak. What won't this rock.

    Not sure where you are located, but these are 2 of these for sale on craigslist in Cleveland, OH, look like brand new.

    2 channel: Anthem 225 Integrated amp; Parasound Ztuner; TechnicsTT SL1350; Vincent PHO-8 phono pre; Marantz CD6005 spinner; Polk Signature S60's;Cables: Wireworld Eclipse IC; Audioquest Big Sur IC; LAT International speaker cables; PS Audio AC-3 power cords, all into a PS Audio Dectet Power center.

    All TV's sound enhanced by Polk Magnfi Mini's.

    Other; SDA2BTL's, M10 series II, M7C's, Hafler XL600 amp, RB-980BX, Parasound HCA-1500 amp , P5 preamp, all in storage.

    Political memes posted as fact and accepted as fact, are sign language of the ignorant, for the ignorant

    tonyb said " but even socialists can do a good thing here and there
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    Ok, the Parasound has been paid for. Now I wait...
    In the mean time, since this beast doesn't have a 12v trigger input, has anyone used one of these? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B888VHM/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A19MRELPGC5OXX&psc=1
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • msgmsg Posts: 4,270
    An amp like either of these will offer benefits like impact and control, for example, but in my experience with RTi10s, an amp did not redefine the overall sound of the speaker. In your case, that may be a good thing.

    The reason I was asking how you like the speakers now was because, yes, the RTi/A series has a reputation for being fantastic with HT, but can be fatiguing with music.

    I read that you are enjoying the brighter characteristic of the speaker, so that's a good thing. Some say an amp tames this. That was not my experience. It also did not fill them out or make them produce fuller sound at lower listening levels. It did, however, make them more impact full and less congested, especially at higher listening levels. If this is what you're after, then you're on the right track. Personally, and please excuse the unsolicitedness of this, I think the Signature Series is a better combination-use speaker. Either way, you can't go wrong adding that Parasound amp to any system at this level, and it can carry you a good ways upwards as well, should you decide to allow yourself to be consumed by the obsession. Of that, you may not have a choice B)
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    msg wrote: »
    An amp like either of these will offer benefits like impact and control, for example, but in my experience with RTi10s, an amp did not redefine the overall sound of the speaker. In your case, that may be a good thing.

    The reason I was asking how you like the speakers now was because, yes, the RTi/A series has a reputation for being fantastic with HT, but can be fatiguing with music.

    I read that you are enjoying the brighter characteristic of the speaker, so that's a good thing. Some say an amp tames this. That was not my experience. It also did not fill them out or make them produce fuller sound at lower listening levels. It did, however, make them more impact full and less congested, especially at higher listening levels. If this is what you're after, then you're on the right track. Personally, and please excuse the unsolicitedness of this, I think the Signature Series is a better combination-use speaker. Either way, you can't go wrong adding that Parasound amp to any system at this level, and it can carry you a good ways upwards as well, should you decide to allow yourself to be consumed by the obsession. Of that, you may not have a choice B)

    I guess filling out the sound of the speakers (but without losing that detail in the high end) was what I was hoping would happen by getting an amp. But more impact was on the list too. Looking forward to getting it set up B)
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • msgmsg Posts: 4,270
    Could happen - others seem to love the line! Plus, I had the earlier RTi line, not RTiA.
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    edited July 23
    The brown Santa sleigh brought gifts today:
    sgr85gw9g8qi.jpg
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • msgmsg Posts: 4,270
    OPEN IT! OPEN IT!!!
    C'MON!!!
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    msg wrote: »
    OPEN IT! OPEN IT!!!
    C'MON!!!
    Ok ok fine :D

    Looks like we have a Parasound HCA-2200ii, a Sony UHP-H1, and one LSiM705 (the other one should be here tomorrow). UPS was not kind to the amp or the speaker but thankfully the damage is minimal.
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 4,813
    UPS shipments are insured, so if there is damage of any sort, I would recommend you do the needful.
    Got Dayens?
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    Clipdat wrote: »
    UPS shipments are insured, so if there is damage of any sort, I would recommend you do the needful.
    Oh yeah, I've already contacted both sellers since they usually have to contact UPS.

    I hooked the amp up to the RTi's. Still trying to decide what I think of the new sound but it is definitely an improvement. When the other LSiM shows up I can compare and decide which I want to keep*

    *Ok fine, thats a lie. I'll probably keep both and put one set in the bedroom setup
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • msgmsg Posts: 4,270
    Crap, is the amp damaged, or are we talking box damage on the speaker and amp?
    Those big Parasound amps are unwieldy to handle in shipping.

    When I ordered my first Parasound, it was a not-so-pretty 2205. Box looked like a cardboard boulder by the time I got it. Not sure there was a square edge on it. Pretty sure they wrapped it in a tumbleweed at UPS in California, and gave it a nudge downhill toward the east coast.

    I noticed that an amp handled authoritatively the RTi10s I had at the time. It was amazing, the improvement in control and impact.
    ab0tj wrote: »
    When the other LSiM shows up I can compare and decide which I want to keep*

    *Ok fine, thats a lie. I'll probably keep both and put one set in the bedroom setup
    Yeaht, you're a junkie alright, and you've come to the right place.

  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    msg wrote: »
    Crap, is the amp damaged, or are we talking box damage on the speaker and amp?
    Those big Parasound amps are unwieldy to handle in shipping.
    The seller actually went above and beyond in packaging it. I'd hate to see how it would have worked out if he didn't. And the box didn't even look too bad... But one corner of the front panel is bent and scraped, like the box was dropped (upside down, at that). I looked at the pictures from the ad and it is definitely something that wasn't there before shipping. It works great, however. Apparently the damage is only cosmetic.

    The speaker is basically a non-issue... A couple of the spacers between the base plate and the speaker itself are a bit busted, but once I put the screws back in, it doesn't look or work any different than it should.
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • msgmsg Posts: 4,270
    Yeah, my seller did, as well, fortunately. Must have take me 20 minutes at least to get it unwrapped.

    Bummer on the faceplate. Definitely sounds like it was dropped. I think I heard the toroids can shift when this happens, so check for loose hardware, but take lots of photos first before you do anything. Also, get permission in writing before taking even the cover off.

    You should be able to get replacement parts for the speaker cheaply or even free. I had a broken power port on one of my RTi10s from the Polk Ebay store, and they sent a free replacement. Same with a broken grill.
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    msg wrote: »
    Yeaht, you're a junkie alright, and you've come to the right place.
    Maybe I should start a drug habit instead, it would be cheaper.

    I spent some time swapping RCA cables around last night. I think I prefer the cheap KabelDirekt vs. the Mogami+Neutrik cables I built. That is not what I expected and frankly I am not happy about it. I wanted to like the ones I made :D
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • gp4jesusgp4jesus Posts: 1,181
    edited July 28
    ab0tj wrote: »
    In the mean time, since this beast doesn't have a 12v trigger input, has anyone used one of these? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B888VHM/ref=ox_sc_act_title_2?smid=A19MRELPGC5OXX&psc=1*
    consider a Furman Miniport 20 (see my sig) to turn on that beast of an amp. Designed to switch/handle 20 amps compared to the above* 15 A.

    Tony

    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED
    Outlaw Audio 975 Pre/Pro
    Samsung BDP, DirecTV Rcvr, Xbox 360, Dennon LDP, Phillips CD chgr

    Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside; CC outside
    BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside & out
    8 ga Powerline - LR woofers, inside & out

    LR: tri-amped RTi A7. Woofers, Rotel 98X amp; M & T, P'sound HCA-1000
    CC: Rotel RB985 -> tri-amped CSi A6
    5 Audio Pro Subs: 1 B1.39: 1 Evidence at each corner
    Surrounds: Hafler XL280 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3*
    Power Conditioning & Distribution:
    3 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 4 Furman Miniport 20s
    *Bi-amped by years end
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    gp4jesus wrote: »
    Designed to switch/handle 20 amps compared to the above* 15 A.
    I bought the kit version and built it using a 14 gauge IEC cord. It actually has a relay rated for 30A in it, so that's nice.
    I will definitely look closer at the Furman after I recover financially from this and the LSiM's it is currently powering...
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
  • gp4jesusgp4jesus Posts: 1,181
    ab0tj wrote: »
    gp4jesus wrote: »
    Designed to switch/handle 20 amps compared to the above* 15 A.
    I bought the kit version* and built it using a 14 gauge IEC cord. It actually has a relay rated for 30A in it, so that's nice.
    so what* did you go with? You got my attention w/30A switching

    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED
    Outlaw Audio 975 Pre/Pro
    Samsung BDP, DirecTV Rcvr, Xbox 360, Dennon LDP, Phillips CD chgr

    Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside; CC outside
    BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside & out
    8 ga Powerline - LR woofers, inside & out

    LR: tri-amped RTi A7. Woofers, Rotel 98X amp; M & T, P'sound HCA-1000
    CC: Rotel RB985 -> tri-amped CSi A6
    5 Audio Pro Subs: 1 B1.39: 1 Evidence at each corner
    Surrounds: Hafler XL280 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3*
    Power Conditioning & Distribution:
    3 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 4 Furman Miniport 20s
    *Bi-amped by years end
  • ab0tjab0tj Posts: 40
    gp4jesus wrote: »
    so what* did you go with? You got my attention w/30A switching
    I bought one of these: http://powerswitchtail.com/powerswitchtail-ii-kit

    The instructions say it has 20A switching capacity, but they relay they use is rated at 40A/240VAC, so I assume the 20A rating has to do with the circuit board itself.

    I built the kit using the resistors specified for 12-24V trigger voltage, and measured less than 3mA operating current. The power cord is a beefy 14AWG one from an old server, which I cut in the middle and wired into the PowerSwitchTail. I may upgrade to a more "audiophile grade" power cord at some point.
    Marantz SR6012, Parasound HCA-2200II, LSiM705 L/R, S35 center (yeah, I know...), 2x PSW505
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