Going To Invert Tweeters In My SRS 2's

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ka7niq
ka7niq Posts: 577
edited October 2007 in Vintage Speakers
I feel my 4 new RDO 194 tweeters in my SRS 2's are almost fully broken in now.
As all know, the Dimensional tweeters in the SRS 2's only go up to so far before being rolled off.
This means my dimensional tweeter is not fully broken in like my stereo tweeter is at high frequencies.
Solution ?
Switch places on the tweeters, make sure all tweeters get the same break in signal.
I have a cordless screwdriver, it only takes 15 minutes time.
I will not have to switch back again.
WTF ?
Post edited by ka7niq on
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  • read-alot
    read-alot Posts: 812
    edited October 2007
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    Brilliant just freaking Brilliant, what more can I say.

    Let me get my damn screwdriver out.
    polkaudio SRS (rdo194 x 8)
    Dodd ELP (separate power supply)
    JC 1 blocks ( strapped )
    Rega Apollo
    MIT (speaker cables) Outlaw (ICs)

    polkaudio SDA2(rdo194x4) (front) polkaudio CRS (rdo194x4)(rear) polkaudio 400i (center)
    B&K 505
    Samsung LCD
    VIP 622
    HSU STF-2
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  • ka7niq
    ka7niq Posts: 577
    edited October 2007
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    One thing I like to do is to take and pull all the midrange drivers, and one speaker at a time, listen to one speaker substituting drivers.

    Every driver and crossover is different.
    I have found that sometimes swapping a midrange or tweeter driver to the other side, and vice versa improves sound.

    I did this on my Polk RT 2000P's.

    Drivers can and do vary in electrical and mechanical parameters.

    This cost nothing to do, and just takes a little time.

    Works for me :)
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  • Dennis Gardner
    Dennis Gardner Posts: 4,860
    edited October 2007
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    I call BS................unless you plan to hook up your mids to the high frequencies too to totally break them in.:rolleyes:

    Those tweets with the rolled off freqs will never have to play those rolled off freqs so your end result is simply so you will feel better about it............or raise your post count with ridiculous thoughts making it onto the forum.

    f1nut standin, signing off............
    HT Optoma HD25 LV on 80" DIY Screen, Anthem MRX 300 Receiver, Pioneer Elite BDP 51FD Polk CS350LS, Polk SDA1C, Polk FX300, Polk RT55, Dual EBS Adire Shiva 320watt tuned to 17hz, ICs-DIY Twisted Prs, Speaker-Raymond Cable

    2 Channel Thorens TD 318 Grado ZF1, SACD/CD Marantz 8260, Soundstream/Krell DAC1, Audio Mirror PP1, Odyssey Stratos, ADS L-1290, ICs-DIY Twisted , Speaker-Raymond Cable
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  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited October 2007
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    There is no such thing as a dimensional tweeter or stereo tweeter in the SRS2's.
    _________________________________________________
    ***\\\\\........................... My Audio Journey ............................./////***

    2008 & 2010 Football Pool WINNER
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    Thank God for different opinions. Imagine the world if we all wanted the same woman
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  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited October 2007
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    :rolleyes: :eek: :confused::D
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
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  • ka7niq
    ka7niq Posts: 577
    edited October 2007
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    Dennis Gardner wrote: »
    I call BS................unless you plan to hook up your mids to the high frequencies too to totally break them in.:rolleyes:

    Those tweets with the rolled off freqs will never have to play those rolled off freqs so your end result is simply so you will feel better about it............or raise your post count with ridiculous thoughts making it onto the forum.

    f1nut standin, signing off............
    Oh, the 6510 dimensional drivers were swapped long ago with the 6511 stereo drivers and allowed to play all weekend while I was over at Orlando, FL at Disney!
    As you know, the 6510 drivers are bandwidth limited, and so have never seen a full range signal, UNTIL now :)

    What counts is I feel better about it.

    I switch drivers around until I find the best speaker for them, they do vary ya know ?

    A little trick I learned when I lived back in Seattle at Speaker Lab.

    Pat Snyder and Dave Graebner the owners of Speaker Lab used to hold clinics where audiophiles could go to learn about speakers.
    And Hopefully buy theirs :)

    Dave Graebner sold his interest in Speaker Lab and moved to Nevada.

    He started making ribbon speakers.

    Dave did the ribbons for Bob Carver's speakers.

    I learned a LOT from Dave and Pat.

    Back in the day, the old Peerless dome tweeter was widely used by speaker builders.
    Speaker Lab measured a nasty resonance in it.
    Solution ?
    Poke a pin hole in the dome :)

    This took care of a lot of it.

    Same with the old Peerless midrange driver used in the Gale speakers from England.
    Do you remember them ?

    The trick was to simply take a tennis ball and place it inside the rear driver enclosure.

    Made an ordinary midrange into a really good one.
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  • ka7niq
    ka7niq Posts: 577
    edited October 2007
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    HTrookie wrote: »
    There is no such thing as a dimensional tweeter or stereo tweeter in the SRS2's.
    No, you are correct.
    It is more correctly called a rolled off tweeter.
    Polk does this to avoid interference effects like comb filtering
    The dimensional drivers are MW 6510's.

    BOTH the dimensional drivers, and ONE tweeter are bandwidth limited.

    In any driver, we want it to be as smooth as possible inside and outside it's pass band.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,092
    edited October 2007
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    HTrookie wrote: »
    There is no such thing as a dimensional tweeter or stereo tweeter in the SRS2's.

    Absolutely correct. Progressive point source
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,092
    edited October 2007
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    ka7niq wrote: »
    BOTH the dimensional drivers, and ONE tweeter are bandwidth limited.

    In any driver, we want it to be as smooth as possible inside and outside it's pass band.

    Bandwidth limited doesn't correlate to being a dimensional driver.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,100
    edited October 2007
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    this is the worst thread ever...

    Or one of the top 10 of the worst technical threads ever..
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • ka7niq
    ka7niq Posts: 577
    edited October 2007
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    heiney9 wrote: »
    Bandwidth limited doesn't correlate to being a dimensional driver.
    No, it does not.
    But in the SRS 2's the dimensional drivers are bandwidth limited, as is one tweeter.

    The RDO 194's were really sounding nice, UNTIL I switched em.
    The bandwidth limited tweeter is now in the full range tweeters place.
    I can hear the difference, not as much top end extension/air.

    No surprise really since it has never seen much above 2K in it's brief life.

    It is in other room, hissing away with Pink Noise.

    I noticed this in my SL 2000's that were originally in the SRS 2's.

    When I switched tweeters, suddenly the highs were there again.

    Perhaps after 20 some years, the top tweeters dome/magnet/coil fatigued from being run full range ?

    The bottom tweeter lived an easy life in comparison, only ever going out a little past 2K.

    For SURE it is best to replace the SL 2000 with the RDO 194 IMHO.

    But if one can't do this right away, better sound is to be had by simply switching the stock SL 2000 tweeters from top to bottom position.
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,092
    edited October 2007
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    Both tweeters are bandwidth limited, one just more than the other. In order to obtain a progressive point source the 2 or 3 or 4 tweeters have to work together to achieve a single line source. This is achieved by rolling each tweeter off.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • ka7niq
    ka7niq Posts: 577
    edited October 2007
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    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    this is the worst thread ever...

    Or one of the top 10 of the worst technical threads ever..
    Thank you for your opinion
    Care to expand upon it a little :confused:
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  • ka7niq
    ka7niq Posts: 577
    edited October 2007
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    Here is a chart showing driver changes w/break in
    http://vikash.info/audio/audax/break-in.asp

    Here is also an interesting read about production driver variances http://forum.stereophile.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=27574&Main=26557

    It is important to remember in a doped paper cone driver that is 20 some years old changes can take place.
    These changes may not necessarily take place in all the identical drivers in a system.

    One speaker may have sat near a window, and one near a wall.

    The sun shining on one speaker only over the 20 years and not on it's mate may have effected the paper in the cone, or the elasticity of the damping.

    I know when I swapped my drivers around, I could hear differences.
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  • ka7niq
    ka7niq Posts: 577
    edited October 2007
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    heiney9 wrote: »
    Both tweeters are bandwidth limited, one just more than the other. In order to obtain a progressive point source the 2 or 3 or 4 tweeters have to work together to achieve a single line source. This is achieved by rolling each tweeter off.

    H9
    I have SRS 2's, only two tweeters.
    One runs full up to 20 k, one is bandwidth limited.

    I guess in the bigger SDA and SRS speakers with more tweeters progressive roll off happens to acheive transition from line to point source ?
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