Why don't Polk make the SDA's anymore?

puunda · December 2005

Forgive me if this question's been asked before. I suspect it's been asked many times. I've done a search on the forum, but can't find an answer.

The SDA Polks seems to hold their value very well, and from the forum, seems like they have a huge following. The concept seems to be a good one, and the price/performance ratio will give any speaker a run for it's money. I would've thought these things would've made the SDA's a great seller! Is this a marketing issue?

SCompRacer · December 2005

Here is one thread about it.

Another.

RuSsMaN · December 2005

They do still make SDA, revamped for todays market - it's called the SurroundBar.

BobMcG · December 2005

And here's another thread on the subject.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27961

BobMcG · December 2005

RuSsMaN wrote:

They do still make SDA, revamped for todays market - it's called the SurroundBar.

Hummm, the SurroundBar....

djf · December 2005

When I spoke to CS the other day, when I called to find out if the RDO194's were still in stock, I asked this very question.

It seems to be almost an aestetic preference of the audience. The SDA mechanism, to work well, requires a wide speaker, to hold both the main drivers and the cancellation drivers. Most folks these days want speakers that are unobtrusive, so the SDA scheme doesn't fit into the modern world.

Pretty sure it was Ken S. I was talking to, and he said he would LOVE it if they started manufacturing them again. I pointed out that there's ALOT of folks out there (not everybody, of course) who have ALOT MORE disposable cash than they did back then. Heck, I coulda picked up a really nice ride in the mid 80's for what I paid for my SRS's!!

Currently: Journey, (best of), Girl Can't help it ........ (totally, mind blowingly awesome!!!!!)

F1nut · December 2005

I pointed out that there's ALOT of folks out there (not everybody, of course) who have ALOT MORE disposable cash than they did back then.

A damn good point actually and the truth is there are many speaker companies making BIG speakers that sell, just not tons of them like Polk does. I have no doubt that Polk could make and sell big SDA's again in a limited production. However, it's more a matter of if they want to.

djf · December 2005

One thing I imagine is if they cranked up production, anybody who owned the original vintage units would immediately see their value skyrocket.

Sorta like the original 60's Mustangs. If you got a Shelby from the 60's, it's worth quite a chunk of change!

TroyD · December 2005

I still maintain that Polk should look at Magnepan. They are WILDLY successful selling a non-traditional speaker.

Gin up the CRS's.....sell 'em online/direct for 500 for a pair (or so) which you can get full credit on a trade in on a bigger pair at a brick and mortar dealer. Win Win.

BDT

RuSsMaN · December 2005

Let's assume, they price them where they make ZERO dollars, nada, nothing. At best, they cover their own build/development costs.

They would sell 100 pair give or take, in 18 months. 20-30 for the hardcore forum members where cash is no problem, that would bounce on them as soon as they were released. Another 10-20 pair to guys that have money, aren't forum members, but want a limited edition, cash no object speaker. Another 50-60 pair through word of mouth, and equally hardcore members without the scratch, that would need to save up.

It is just not feasible, period, for Polk to go down that route. The market COULD be there, but at a SUBSTANTIAL expense and risk. Sure, people buy a lot of 'big' speakers, Vandy's, Maggies, Thiel, etc etc etc - but Polk doesn't choose to support that market demographic - they spend their R&D elsewhere - cutting (not bleeding) edge.

If you want SDA, go buy a pair - the market is literally flooded with used models (hence another reason to not re-release) - even with local pickup, you may have to wait a most of 6 months to find your specific model. Today's SDA? You've got the first model already, the SurroundBar. What should you not expect? Big heavy, SDA of the past speakers. What you SHOULD expect? SDA inwalls, small multimedia / pc style rigs, and home theater solutions ala SurroundBar.

Cheers,
Rooster

djf · December 2005

Well, except for the cabs and xovers, they already got all the parts in stock. Just spend a couple hundred K, get 100 cabs abd xovers done, them sell them on a custom=built basis.

Problem is mission creep. I can easily see that if they decided to remanufacture, they would have a re-design phase.

But that's where most of the cost is.

RuSsMaN · December 2005

They don't have the parts in stock. Call monday morning, try get some 6503 and 2000 replacements. Report back, see if they are 'in stock'.

Of course they would re-design, that's what they have all told me. (and any other half sober Polkie at a gathering). Remember, they USED to be 'The Speaker Specialists'. It AINT happening.

TroyD · December 2005

Here is where I see the challenges:

Getting back into the higher end brick and mortar shops and I'm not talking Tweeter. The hard part would be assembling/maintaining the network of indy dealers.

Ok, the second trick is getting people exposed to SDA. What better way to do it than the same way Maggie does. It works, they have proved it.

I don't even think that it's a question of if they can turn a profit on it...no question they could...the question is, will they make ENOUGH profit on it to justify it. The market is there, it's really a question of if Polk wants to pursue it.

BDT

djf · December 2005

They absolutely could make a profit.

Just start the no-frills units at $9999.99 a pair, and go from there!

BobMcG · December 2005

And here's yet one more post on the subject.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&noquote=1&p=389417

RuSsMaN · December 2005

Profit IS the question. Polk has X amount of resources available, period. They choose to stay on the cutting (just shy of bleeding) edge, period. You did hear Matthew at the last meet, no? Forget the big, cumbersome SDA of the past. Embrace the new, SDA of the future - suited to (almost) everyones needs.

It's not as simple as using some old drawings/schematics, and re-asembling something. Why would they do that in first place, with a flooded (cheaper) used market? Look at the LSi15, if they did ANYTHING, they would use LSi (or similar quality) drivers - not to mention TWICE as many of them to do the SDA dance.

Check the retail for the 15's, then tell me you'd plunk down at least a 1/3rd more, if not twice the asking, for 'new' SDA's.

Cheers,
Rooster

RuSsMaN · December 2005

djf wrote:

They absolutely could make a profit.

Just start the no-frills units at $9999.99 a pair, and go from there!

Yeah, and sell 42 of them, just like the SRT. :rolleyes:

Dennis Gardner · December 2005

I see Troy's comparison to Maggies, but their "cult" following has always been bigger than the SDA believers, hasn't it?

djf · December 2005

I suppose a big part of the problem is that in order to sell speakers, you have to have them at the retailer for people to listen to.

So that by itself means you have to put together a couple hundred pair just to sit at Sears or whereever.

And for all intents and purposes, ya gotta eat that as a loss.

As far as the SRT's go, I got my SRS's in spring 86. And after that, I kinda fell out of the audio info arena, cause I got hitched.

I never even heard that there was such a thing as the SRT's till I saw it here.

But who knows? E-commerce opens up some whole new approaches.

I know if I dropped 10K on a new set of speakers, I'd at least want free gas for a month!!

TroyD · December 2005

I hear you...L&C and I'm not disagreeing with a lot of what you are saying.

We, the forum SDA lovers are not who need to be wooed.

Ok, let's just say for the sake of argument that Matt does want to re-introduce SDA and I'm in charge.

One, I'm going after folks that are already interested in good sound (maybe not 'audiophiles' but someone who places a premium on good sound) and has decent disposable income. In my mind, I have it as someone who is interested in Magnepan, I draw a lot of similarities to thier customers. Different technologies but similar market concept.

Now, that said, can Polk produce an intro-level SDA speaker that they can sell direct for 500-700 price point? No question they can. Engineering SDA isn't, inherently, any more expensive than engineering LSi or RTi or anything else. Actual production, same thing.

To me, it's a matter of getting SDA exposure. IMO, that's the easiest way to do it. There are LOTS of loudspeakers sold at the 3-5K price point (which is where I would estimate an SDA floorstander). SDA, like Planar technology requires proper exposure. Selling direct is easy, relatively. The HARD part is assembling the indy dealer network.

I don't see that this has to conflict with selling SDA inwalls (which are a great idea), computer speakers or what have you.

I'm just saying IF Polk wanted to do it, that's how I would do it. All the while remembering, it ain't US that are likely to buy them.

BDT

TroyD · December 2005

Dennis Gardner wrote:

I see Troy's comparison to Maggies, but their "cult" following has always been bigger than the SDA believers, hasn't it?

Absolutely, but the general theory behind it is the same.

The way I look at it, there are lots of companies, Thiel, Vandy...****, there are LOTS of speakers sold in the 3-5K price range. The market is there but it is not US. We are already converts. We don't really count. I think that's the problem is we keep trying to think on how to sell SDA to US. Forget that.

Think about it, how did we come to love SDA? We HEARD it. Now, SDA is like a planar speaker i(even more so, IMO) that if it's not set up correctly, you aren't going to interest anyone. I maintain, that the way Maggie does it, would be the way I'd market new SDA's and try and go after the same market segment.

BDT

Now, having said all that? I don't think it's going to happen. Speaker sales are plummeting. That's why Polk is branching out into different areas. A huge risk on a shrinking market? I doubt that's a move that Polk will ever make. THAT is the reason we will see the SDA inwalls. Custom Install is a growth market.

djf · December 2005

My feeling is that the old marketing methods are a thing of the past. For instance, here on the west coast, there is a large retail chain that sits on I-5. It caters to truckers, mostly.

They all seem to have lounges. You plunk one single pair in a place like that, next thing you know, you got HUNDREDS of folks auditioning your speakers per day!

Or find a Starbucks that gets alot of business. Drop a pair in there!

(I would never hear them as I hate Starburnt's, but that's another story!)

TroyD · December 2005

uhhhhhhhhh.....ok.

I think Big Ted just lost his nickname.

BDT

F1nut · December 2005

TroyD wrote:

uhhhhhhhhh.....ok.

I think Big Ted just lost his nickname.

BDT

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Say it ain't so!!!
HARRRRR

shack · December 2005

Unfortunately unlike some of you, I did not get the opportunity to talk directly with Matt at the Polkfest (since I wasn't there

). But I seem to recall talking with Al or Paul and them saying that Matt found the "bring back the big SDA phenomenom" flattering...but the bottom line was that he just wasn't interested in taking the company back in that direction. Sort of the been there...done that...let's go forward philosophy. As long as that's the direction Matt wants to go...I think your chances of seeing more "small SDA" technology like the soundbar over the "old SDA" are a given.

Tour2ma · December 2005

I was getting more of a profitablity issue read. If they thought they could get fat off of an SDA line, I think they'd do it...

Pure business model decision based upon research done up through 2004 (guessing here). That said... If SB's take off big time, they might stimulate enough public interest, but I wouldn't hold my breath. A number of hurdles have already been sited above.

RANDOM SIDE QUESTION...
Anybody ever try Sonic Holography with a pair of Maggies?

dorokusai · December 2005

No, but I tried Sonic Holography with some SDA's and went back in time.

BobMcG · December 2005

dorokusai wrote:

No, but I tried Sonic Holography with some SDA's and went back in time.

LMAO!!!!!!

Tour2ma · December 2005

I always thought he was wise beyond his years... now I know why.

HBombToo · December 2005

Tour2ma wrote:

RANDOM SIDE QUESTION...
Anybody ever try Sonic Holography with a pair of Maggies?

No but I ran my RTA8T's from a Carver CM1090 that had SH and miss it. What an outstanding combo but to the best of my recollection I'll take the 2B's any day.

HBomb

Why don't Polk make the SDA's anymore?

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