Eric Clapton

Micah Cohen · July 2005

And, just to be fair, I include current tours by 70s and 80s metal bands like Judas Priest and Def Leppard and LA Guns and whomever.

GO HOME.

Stop making me hate you!

MC

audiobliss · July 2005

Originally posted by Micah Cohen
Come on. Compared to the original, Clapton's "I Shot The Sheriff" has about as much soul as I do.

And I have no soul.

It's a prime example of Clapton at his most boring, most white-bread, most exhausted.

Just listen to the original again, and you'll be like, "Eric, who?"

I'm TELLING you!

MC

There you go again!! You are telling someone else what moves them! You can't do that! Ya hear me?! LOL You just can't do that! I can't tell you that you like vanilla and you don't like chocolate. I can't tell you that you like Eric Clapton and you don't like Stevie Ray Vaughan.

In the same way you can't tell ND13 (or anyone else) that they don't like a certain song! It's about what moves them. And you crrtainly can't dictate for someone else what moves them!

Micah Cohen · July 2005

Thus, you can't tell anyone else what is boring;

Sure I can. I've been doing it for three pages of posts already, and I'm eager for some other sucker to post something about some other band I think sucks so I can get into the ring then, too!

You have to be both critical and listen for fun. The two are not necessarily independent. You have to be critical of your fun. You have to take your fun seriously, or you will have crappy fun.

Good for you, exploring Cream. Great band. Stick to the live stuff and you'll have fun. (The studio just never did them justice.)

Get some Hendrix. But don't go overboard cause you'll be selling the CDs back soon. Get "Experienced."

Then get some SRV. Anything, really. It's rollicking good stuff. You'll hear Hendrix, and you'll hear the difference.

Then get The Allman Brothers "Live At The Fillmore East." Deep Purple's "Made In Japan." "Creedence Cronicles." Blah blah blah, etc etc.

We're all waiting for you to catch up.

Be critical. Be fun.

Play air guitar with PASSION!

MC

ND13 · July 2005

Bliss, definitely get the Allman Bros "Live At the Filmore East", because MC is correct in that respect. It's great stuff.

As far as the older bands still touring, I don't have a problem with them doing a short, large city tour, I have a problem with paying $150 a ticket to see them. We all weren't old enough or even born in some instances, to enjoy alot of these bands. With that being said, though, they do need to know when enough is enough(Stones, Aerosmith). Oh, and Bruce Springsteen SUCKS!!!

audiobliss · July 2005

Originally posted by Micah Cohen
Sure I can. I've been doing it for three pages of posts already, and I'm eager for some other sucker to post something about some other band I think sucks so I can get into the ring then, too!

My bad. You're right. That's exactly what you've been doing. However, you still can't do it. It's not possible for you to dictate what is boring to someone else. Sure you can tell them, but all it is is a waste of breathe and a lot of meaningless words.

It's just like when Constantine made Christianity the official religion of Constantinople. You can't make someone be a Christian. Or when the Muslims made their victims convert to Islam. You can't do it. It's not genuine that way.

Originally posted by Micah Cohen
You have to be both critical and listen for fun. The two are not necessarily independent.[/B]

You're right that they are not mutually exclusive. However, they are also not mutually inclusive. For someone like me with a very non-critical ear, crappy equipment (a receiver, for crying out loud), and very little experience (so far) dedicated to developing a taste and knowledge of music, I can listen very noncritically and still have great fun.

Great fun gained from listening to music isn't always derived from saying 'ooh, I can see the guitarist standing in that corner; he just played an awesome (insert some kind of sequence here); that drummer sure knows what he's doing!; man, the vocals are so pure!!' I get enjoyment out of my music, 99% if not 100% of the time, by letting the ensemble of the whole masterpiece envelope me, take me to the place that led the artist to write his song, and reliving the artist's experiences. Just like reading is thinking someone's thoughts after him.

If you don't get my point after reading the two previous sentences, then you just won't ever get it (at least not by something I say).

audiobliss

Micah Cohen · July 2005

First of all, lookit:

because MC is correct

I'm correct. Got that?

Second of all, make sure you get the correct version of The Allman Bros "Fillmore" set... It's been remastered a couple of times, and one time it got all botched up by bad production and crap. Get this version.

Third of all, hey man, I can tell you want some guidance, that you have "very little experience." I'm here for you. I will guide you.

Stellar equipment is not a requirement. Even having "an ear" is not so important. I got neither. I'm tone deaf, in a small house, working with second tier equipment. The problem with "listening noncritically" is that you end up with a lot of crap that doesn't stand the test of time. I won't stop you from doing it, tho.

I just know fun when I hear it, and I'm happy to share. I want YOU to have fun, too.

G'head. Ask me anything.

MC

VR3 · July 2005

Sit back and relax, because Micah is back.

If you want to have some fun, look up Micah's old SN...

Which is - Micah

audiobliss · July 2005

:eek: :eek: :eek:

That's what he meant by "Micah's back"!!

I certainly didn't know who I was dealing with! A legend is as close as I've ever come to the man. And to think I've been arguing with him!

It's such an honor to meet a man whose reputation extends so far before him, Mr. Cohen.

Micah Cohen · July 2005

What's a "SN"?

(Gad, am I pathetic or what?)

MC

VR3 · July 2005

Screen Name

Micah Cohen · July 2005

Wow. So you can look me up, and see what I done, huh?

Scary.

Hey, I frigging helped BUILD this forum and I didn't know about that. Shoot.

Bliss, where you from in NC?

MC

audiobliss · July 2005

And that's why you keep calling it 'your' forum. Well, it all makes a little more sense, now.

I'm right dead in the middle of the triad. You familiar with NC?

Micah Cohen · July 2005

I was born there.

MC

audiobliss · July 2005

Ah, indeed? Where exactly? I take it that you moved off when you got the chance. Why come? And where are you now?

ND13 · July 2005

Originally posted by audiobliss
Ah, indeed? Where exactly? I take it that you moved off when you got the chance. Why come? And where are you now?

The murder capital of the USA

VR3 · July 2005

He lives at the home of Polk Audio & Definitive Technology

Micah Cohen · July 2005

I was born in Hickory. I have a lot of family down there. So, you have to listen to me and take my advice and admit that I'm right because I'm from there, see?

"Definitive Technology"? Never heard of them.

MC

F1nut · July 2005

Originally posted by Micah Cohen

Stellar equipment is not a requirement. Even having "an ear" is not so important. I got neither. I'm tone deaf, in a small house, working with second tier equipment.

And there in lies the problem(s) with your arguements. Clapton is not a "in your face" kinda player, his genius is in the subtleties, the fine details of which you'll never hear given the above.

BTW, that recording of the Allman Bros. Band is glaring and harsh. Try this one, http://www.sa-cd.net/showtitle/1531

audiobliss · July 2005

Originally posted by F1nut
And there in lies the problem(s) with your arguements. Clapton is not a "in your face" kinda player, his genius is in the subtleties, the fine details of which you'll never hear given the above.

BTW, that recording of the Allman Bros. Band is glaring and harsh. Try this one, http://www.sa-cd.net/showtitle/1531

Though you may never hear those subtleties, you can still enjoy the music. I'm proof of that, as I'm quite convinced neither my equipment nor my ear are up to properly expressing and hearing them.

Though we've been going back and forth about Clapton, I'll probably look into some of those artists and albums mentioned here; they just could be pretty good.

audiobliss

Micah Cohen · July 2005

Here's the problem with that version of the remaster of the Fillmore shows: It's fake.

Tom Dowd effed it all up on the original 2-disc remaster set. He pasted new versions over old versions, and combined song sets from different nights. All the stuff we knew by heart from when we were kids -- the stuff we air guitared to -- was changed. It pissed everyone off. It was a bad thing to do. He even got rid of Gregg Allman saying, "Putcher hands together," you know? Read the reviews of the disc online. (Plus, having it as SACD seems like overkill.)

The original double LP vinyl was sort of "harsh." The single disc original CD issue was also "harsh." The nature of the show was sort of harsh. It was a harsh show. (Altho, I say you are wrong. It's not harsh at all. It's live blues.)

Tom Dowd died soon after doing the horrible patch-up remaster, and someone went back and remastered THE ORIGINAL SHOW TAPES, restoring Gregg's immortal "Putcher hands together" as well as the complete original show set, without tampering with the versions or patching bits from other shows. The "Deluxe Edition" is THE SHOW, the way it was on vinyl, with no patches, edits or deletions.

Don't argue with me, man. I'm in charge here. :cool:

MC

Micah Cohen · July 2005

I'll probably look into some of those artists and albums mentioned here

[Climbs on his white horse, and begins to ride off into the sunset...] Looks like my job here is done.

MC

audiobliss · July 2005

Micah, does that live Deluxe Edition you recommend have clapping, audience noise, etc. and all that in it? If so, I can't stand that. I'd rather have a version with just the music. I much prefer the studio stuff over live.

What would you recommend in that case?

TroyD · July 2005

oy vey

BDT

Roy Munson · July 2005

A good Allman Brothers CD is the MFSL's Ultradisc gold version of "Eat A Peach" if you can find it. It's long been out of print.

I think what has been missed here is the context of the time in which acts like Hendrix performed. Before Hendrix Rock music was defined by groups like The Stones, the Beatles and The Beach Boys! If you lived in that time this is what the music sounded like. Then along came Hendrix and he was the innovator, no one sounded like him! It was a shock and people couldn't believe what they were hearing! So fast foward to today and have someone in their twenties listen to Hendix for the very first time and they are likely to say "this guy is ripping off SRV". A comparision might be like listening to Elvis. Most people would say that Elvis is passe and they remember the "white jump suit" era, that isn't the real Elvis. The real Evis was the guy that came along and changed the music just like Hendrix did, he was the Hillbilly Cat and those early Sun records are some of the best Rock and Roll of that era! But to listen to it today some would say that it is boring! Boring it's not, Hendrix like Elvis was never boring!!!!!

Micah, I think you could add Sabbath to the list of bands that should have quit touring long ago, they probably should have quit around the time of "Faries Wear Boots"! I believe Ozzy was semi conscious at that time!

audiobliss · July 2005

Ooh; I'm gonna hafta get out my Elvis CDs, now!

F1nut · July 2005

Yo Hobbit Pimp!

The SACD release is done from the master tapes, includes "Putcher hands together" and has zero harshness unlike the "Deluxe Edition."

Don't argue with me, you can't win.

XOXO,
The grumpy old guy

Micah Cohen · July 2005

1. Some bands, and The Allman Brothers are one of them, didn't do well in the studio. Some bands, Black Sabbath is one of them, didn't do well live.

The studio just could not capture the sheer power and energy of an Allman Bros show circa 1972. But the Fillmore concert recordings did. It's a testament to a band at the very height of its power, playing live the way it was meant to be played. (Deep Purple's "Made In Japan" is another live set that captures a band at its most awesome, head-exploding best. Nothing Purple did in the studio could ever match it.)

Sometimes you can whittle a band's "greatness" down to simply ONE MUST HAVE album, the one moment when everything worked perfectly, when the planets aligned and the band was PERFECT, and sometimes you luck out and those moments happen on live albums that are so perfectly, richly produced they sound like studio albums. "Fillmore East" is one of those moments. (Others include Purple's "Made In Japan," Little Feat's "Waiting For Columbus," both of these albums have great new remastered 2-disc editions, and Jethro Tull's "Bursting Out." Etc.)

But Sabbath live was a mess. They were all effed up, all the time. In the studio, they were able to harness whatever evil was driving them, and they wrestled five astonishing albums out of it. Live Sabbath sounds like ****. (And if they are still touring, they should be ashamed of themselves, too.)

2. If the SACD of "Fillmore East" is untampered-with, then it's great. I doubt that audiobliss, just getting started, has an SACD player. How's that? So, he's gotta get the "Deluxe Edition" CD. Look, how I know from SACD? I never got into that. That's for audio geeks, old man.

3. Pre-Army Elvis is the absolute end-all-be-all. Wanna hear the sound of every rock musical style ever? Check out pre-Army Elvis. Songs like "I'm Left, You're Right, She's Gone" and especially "Mystery Train," "One Night With You" and "Baby I Don't Care" are so damned amazing that you can't believe it. It's not even worth listening to anything else. You could listen to pre-Army Elvis forever and never get tired of this stuff. The army, tho, sucked all the evil outa him, made him sort of lame.

I RULE!

MC

janmike · July 2005

To each his own. Clapton has been one of my favourites for years.

Micah Cohen · July 2005

Wait wait, I got more. Sitting in front of my computer on a Saturday night, what a **** LOSER!

Hendrix like Elvis was never boring!

Ah, crap I can't even do this anymore! Hendrix is boring because his songs suck. "Crosstown Traffic," "Purple Haze," "Manic Depression," "Dolly Dagger"... They are just poorly written songs and don't stand up to the test of time. Cool at parties, every once in a while, when you hear them played to death on the radio. But not great songs. (GREAT GUITAR PLAYING! Okay! GREAT! Often groundbreaking!)

But Elvis... First off, he was mostly singing covers, so he picked phenomenal songs. And then, like Sinatra, he did them perfectly. He DID THEM. And, plus, the band he had at Sun was amazing, and just near as innovative as Hendrix was a decade-plus later. Elvis's band was an amazing rock and roll band. Simple, talented and tight as a drum. You can't beat it. And it's a lot more fun to listen to than serious old Hendrix all **** up in the studio. Scotty Moore!

ELVIS! Everything is nothing without ELVIS!

Aw, Hendrix is crap. Aren't you just TIRED of hearing the same songs played over and over on the radio, "Hendrix's Greatest Hits"? They are so boring.

That's all I'm saying.

Saturday night, in front of the computer. Don't let this happen to you. :mad:

MC

audiobliss · July 2005

That's right; I don't have an SACD player. Maybe I will go with something live, then. However, can you hear clapping and such in the background? Eric Clapton's Unplugged is like that, and it's really hard for me to get around it (though is amazing renditions of the powerful songs on that CD make it easy enough).

Man, oh man am I surprised. I love Elvis, and I've never even heard of those songs you named. I'm familiar with Always on My Mind, Suspicious Minds, A Fool Such As I, There Goes My Everything (really good!), Kentucky Rain (equally good), Make the World Go Away (ok...so it's all good! lol), You Asked Me To (yup..you guessed it), Too Much, All Shook Up, Stuck On You, and Guitar Man. That's the Elvis I know...and love.

audiobliss

Eric Clapton

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