To be (Upgrade) or not to be, that is the question ….

Inscrutabl0915 · July 2021

So I’ve had a few posts about this here, and now am seriously on, over, on, back over … the fence on upgrading my bone-stock SDA-SRS2’s … I’ve mentioned that in previous houses I had the necessary rooms to set these up optimally and sounded great. For the $ in them now vs cost to replace, I could have happily lived with them long term. And I would go the whole 9 yards with the recommended upgrades - tweeters, X-overs, binding posts, cabinet treatments, etc - BUT the room in the new house is compromised, can only get about 5 ft between, and worse only 18” to sidewalls. The previous magic is missing, odd early reflections are compromising the soundstage/imaging. I know the upgrades likely would significantly improve some characteristics (transparency, dynamics, tighten up the bass, etc), but I don’t think there is a way to clean up the imaging. Thought about violating the prime directive to not toe in, and though I’ve heard that done to try to mitigate the early reflections, it likely will raise hell with other imaging issues in between. I could put some absorbers/diffusers on the walls, but that seems to also take away the prospective SDA uniqueness.

These mod costs have escalated a lot over the past few years, so I’d be putting in over $2k for the whole enchilada, so just “try it and see” isn’t too appealing from a resale stranded capital perspective.
Is there any hope for this, or need to find these guys a better home, and reluctantly move on to other pastures? (Which is where I think I am heading)

Thanks for the advice, and grief counseling 😁

Emlyn · July 2021

Dump them and try something new. Upgrade money put into them would not increase their value much if any and as you seem to acknowledge already the room is critical for SDA to work right and you don’t have the right room for them. Only reason I can think of to upgrade them is so someone else could enjoy them on your dime after you end up getting rid of them anyway. 😳

Inscrutabl0915 · July 2021

Alas, I fear you are correct. Wasn’t sure if anyone would chime in and say the other gains are worth it, and have some idea for clearing up the imaging confusion short of disconnecting the interconnect, but at that point probably can do better with other modern speakers.

Gardenstater · July 2021

How much $ would it cost to add some absorption panels at the early reflection points. I'd go with at least 3" thick. Are you saying that you have tried it and it destroys the SDA effect, or are you just assuming that?

Inscrutabl0915 · July 2021

It’s an assumption … think I may have seen that mentioned in a previous thread(?)
I used to have some OC703 that didn’t make the trip, but do have lots of fiberglass batts and styrofoam (but obviously not the same)

Mike Reeter · July 2021

I ran into the same issue with a pair of 2.3TL's, too much speaker for a smaller space. Replaced them with a modded pair of CRS 4.1TL's that were a perfect fit. Maintained the great SDA stage and center imaging.

pitdogg2 · July 2021

The SDA'S are getting harder and harder to get, I'd find a way to keep them until a larger place comes along. Get some smaller speakers for now. At one point I had 3sets of SDA's in storage.

Yes I recapped all of them, yours are a great speaker to keep

F1nut · July 2021

^ THIS ^

audioluvr · July 2021

Don't get rid of them. You'd be money ahead to restore them and build a quality system around them

Inscrutabl0915 · July 2021

Ok guys … not unanimous, but clear majority here (and another audio site) says to hang onto them, even if mothballed at the moment. Probably sensible if have the space to sit since very difficult to sell big speakers locally.
But my next large space for them may be on either side of my headstone … this is the third house I thought/said they’ll be taking me out feet first, and eventually I will be right.

I will, however, give a go at long wall placement. This is the view as set up on short wall (12.5 ft total width):

If I place speakers on one long wall, and listening chair against opposite wall, I can get about 9 ft from head to speaker baffle, which allows speakers to have 7-8 ft clear between and more than 3 ft to sidewalls… BUT there are (at least) two negative complications.
1. The angled ceiling creates something of a choral shell effect, not sure about speakers vertical dispersion and resultant odd reflections, and
2. on each long wall I have built recessed shelving … on the left/speaker side they are about 18” deep and house front end electronics gear … the right/chair side they are about 14” deep and house my record collection. I am thinking the equipment shelves will ‘appear’ somewhere between an actual wall and no wall, and will at a minimum affect/reduce or possibly muddy the low end, and the record shelves will look a lot like a wall and have rear reflections hitting my ears to close to front waves for brain to process/reject and will muddy up the sound/imaging. I MIGHT get lucky and act in some modest form of diffusion and mitigate. In both wall/cases, maybe need to play with having portable stand or wall hangable solid sheet good and diffusers to place behind speakers and chair, respectively(?)
3. And, of course, the speakers and chair block access to what is behind them, and not terribly easy to move (especially if I spike them) … maybe just my cross to bear.

Ok you enablers, what say you?
(BTW, I’m having heart surgery a week from today, and not sure I can get all the rearranging fit in with all the other preparations … wife is still in a sling from shoulder replacement, so lots to get done to make next couple months more manageable, and so may have to press pause on this for a bit)

odcics2 · July 2021

Getting reflections off your equipment rack? Probably would help if it was behind the front of the speakers.
I had that issue.

JayCee · July 2021

First, and foremost, wishing you a good outcome and speedy recovery w/the heart surgery!!!

Yes, to moving to the longer wall. Not preferable if you have the appropriate space elsewhere, who does(??!), but found it better to compromise the distance from the speakers vs more room side-to-side for best case results. Also, SDA's always perform better w/minimal "stuff" between and in front of them. SPIKE the speakers! One of the golden rules on CP. PITA to move but once dialed in...done! Use sliders to position and/or Herbies afterward. I've had folks on this site tell me my method of spiking (decoupling) won't work. It does....in my particular situation. Tried, tested and proven, again, for my situation. I'm also a big fan of outriggers on bigger SDA's.

Going to copy/paste in my experience w/some of your same room issues. Posted on another site and must be a member to view so won't link. No editing, cherry-pick anything appropriate....

JayCee wrote:

Current room is 11’x16’. My house is a 106 year old Craftsman and the room is upstairs with a dormer roof line that angles above the speakers (+ seated position). Fortunately, I theorize, this works to my benefit by eliminating bass frequency corner loading.

Following pic is from a bookshelf demo hosted by another site I belong to. Over the past 5 years (and different houses) I’ve experimented w/acoustic panels; built using 2x4’s, 2" of Owens 705 acoustic panels covered w/a light duty customized/printable canvas that has a pic I took skiing in France. (Going to move the canvas to the exercise room and will replace w/the same fabric but more suitable look.) I’ve also experimented w/panels behind me and found they sucked the life out of the sound. A simple Persian rug actually does better on the back wall and it dampens just enough to knock down echo. This room shouldn’t work but with experimentation it’s dialed in. I’ve lived in 4 different houses in the past 10 years and this is by far the best sound I’ve ever had. Paul’s recent newsletters/podcasts re. room treatments have been timely and will help me moving forward.

More current pic w/a DIY rack I made to house my PSA stack. Most recent purchase being the P15, last fall.

Probably will get a question on the speakers so…Polk Audio SDA-SRS 1.2tl’s that are UBER modded w/new XO’s, upgraded inductors, billeted solid metal plates and internal bracing. Don’t discount the affordable “budget” reputation Polk has. These speakers were produced in 1989 and, post mod, sound nothing like factory. Not to say they were bad, and they weren’t (aren’t), but they were built to a price-point and knowledge that the average consumer amp of yore wouldn’t do them justice. This, confirmed by Matthew Polk w/insight and way forward for the DIY crowd on how to upgrade for better sound. Not knocking anyone and their brand loyalty (or lack thereof) but Polk just doesn’t get a second look in many circles. Post mod, If I blindfolded you and dropped you in the sweet spot, you’d never guess Polk. Also, adding great gear (BHK, etc.) is an eye opener. Quality in = much better sound and, IMHO, ends up with the very best these speakers were/are capable of. Wonderfully wide, deep, 3D sound stage.

JayCee · July 2021

......

Inscrutabl0915 · July 2021

@odcics2 … since down low and mostly behind front plane, don’t think this particular one is doing too much damage

Thanks @JayCee … didn’t make it before having to go out of town, so will be a few weeks if I get friends to do the moving, or much longer of waiting for me.

But gonna try them in a few places on the long wall, and if they get pretty close to what I’ve heard before then will proceed with all the upgrades. Will use a couple sheets of plywood or drywall to blank off some area behind them to see if those shelves really make much of a difference … hoping not. Big advantage that absolutely nothing in between them beyond their back plane.
Have sent my Plinius off to be completely refreshed and expect that will be better than new and a good partner for these (or most anything). In the meantime, upgrading the Mon 7’s for use in the current short wall configuration.

See ya on the flip side.

To be (Upgrade) or not to be, that is the question ….

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