The old Pioneer CL-99A's I just got.
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Tony M
Posts: 11,015
Well I got out and tested these old speakers to see what the hype is about.
One speaker worked GREAT.
The other...no sound. 
The one speaker ROCKED my back yard along some others yards too.
I see/hear what the reviewers say about their bass. It seems to lack that 15" bass sound but there's bass there. And played loud, the sound was like a live band. Full and clear! And that's just from ONE speaker so far.
I had time and energy and it was a nice chilly and sunny day so I went to find out why one speaker didn't work. I took the woofer out, hooked it up directly and sound came from it instantly. So at least the main speaker/woofer works. I then pulled the insulation out. Just one thick slab coats the inside. The top part behind the other speakers on top stayed in. I only had so much time to explore and I think I spotted easily what might be wrong.
A capacitor had exploded on the cross-over board. I think it reads 1uf, 46 volts. It looked like it happened a long time ago.
Here are some pictures. I think you cross-over masters might get a kick out of seeing this layout.
One speaker worked GREAT.
The other...no sound. The one speaker ROCKED my back yard along some others yards too.
I see/hear what the reviewers say about their bass. It seems to lack that 15" bass sound but there's bass there. And played loud, the sound was like a live band. Full and clear! And that's just from ONE speaker so far.
I had time and energy and it was a nice chilly and sunny day so I went to find out why one speaker didn't work. I took the woofer out, hooked it up directly and sound came from it instantly. So at least the main speaker/woofer works. I then pulled the insulation out. Just one thick slab coats the inside. The top part behind the other speakers on top stayed in. I only had so much time to explore and I think I spotted easily what might be wrong.
A capacitor had exploded on the cross-over board. I think it reads 1uf, 46 volts. It looked like it happened a long time ago.
Here are some pictures. I think you cross-over masters might get a kick out of seeing this layout.
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
Comments
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15" woofer and basically no box. Were the mids a sealed back?
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Here's some closer picks;
That blown up cap. is just below the 2 vertical resistors. It Looks like it blew right off the board.
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
15" woofer and basically no box. Were the mids a sealed back?
I believe so. I'm 99.99% sure. Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
Here are some close-ups of the woofer material.
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
Fascinating stuff Tony. Thanks for all the photos. Hope you can get the other one playing again.
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I got mine from a guy who had them and a sx780 sitting in his garage. Speakers were covered in dust dirt & grime.
They still have the original crossover's that appear to be working. I'm sure they could benefit from an upgrade.
They do get loud and can shake a room. Mine seemed somewhat harsh and the bass was tight and restricted at the start when I goosed the volume.
I read somewhere they did come with optional angled stands, so I built some that looked similar to what I saw and it improved the bass quite a bit.
After building the stands, I tightened up all the screws and put them on a sx950 and let em loose. The more up I went the bass came alive. Not a bit of muddiness.
To my ears the sound was much better, the more as I upped the volume, the better they sounded. I was shocked at the sound from them due to their age.
Thanks for the pics and have fun with them. -
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two words, my son.
"IMG"
"tags"
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I'm old Doc....
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I'm old Doc....
Lies!!!!To me - old age is always ten years older than I am.
Bernard M. Baruch"....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963) -
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Really cool, Tony, thanks for sharing. My dad has a pair of CS-99 (no A) sitting in his garage. This encourages me to dig them out. I was just checking the specs on these models, and WOW, super-efficient at 97dB! I bet a tube-amp would really sound nice with them "This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
I think tubes would be real nice with these. Maybe any of the older receiver and amp models that tend to have a warmer sound. With all of these mids and tweeters in this one box, it didn't sound half bad or ear piercing to me. I checked all the mids and tweeters and they were playing alright.
I had mine hooked up to a sort-of recent Nakamichi receiver. # is something like a A100 or something.
Like oldrocker said, the louder you go, the more this speaker design likes it. I didn't even have to turn the volume dial much to get to a ridiculous level in my back yard. And the sound sounded GREAT. I had a great big on my face listening to this one beat-up speaker put out live band sound. I'm sure a few neighbors heard it while still being in their homes.
If both were playing, they might've called the police on me. No not really. I have great neighbors. They KNOW me well.
They would think after hearing music being played loudly, "Tony's got a new set of speakers today it seems".
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
For the record, I just noticed there's a little typo in that these are actually "CS" (not CL).
Also for the record, it seems that the CS-99A like yours is more desirable, and a somewhat different animal, than the regular CS-99.
Here's the inside of a CS-99...yikes:
"This may not matter to you, but it does to me for various reasons, many of them illogical or irrational, but the vinyl hobby is not really logical or rational..." - member on Vinyl Engine
"Sometimes I do what I want to do. The rest of the time, I do what I have to." - Cicero, in Gladiator
Regarding collectibles: "It's not who gets it. It's who gets stuck with it." - Jimmy Fallon -
^^^ Aiyeeee! So many electrolytics!
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum/57348-greetings-and-help-needed-with-vintage-pioneer-cs99-floor-speakers
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Thanks for correcting my blunder. I'm glad the model of speakers was this one too. I saw the ad right away and did a very quick search on the web about this model. I was then thinking, man, I've wasted time researching and somebody with that fancy I-phone alert function will call him first. BUT...he said I was the first caller and he lived about 4 miles away.
Maybe Craig's List (CL)was burned into my brain.
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
Good to see you on a journey Tony! Get em running and keep us posted! Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD. -
I found spider egg sacks all over that Magnavox console. The back is like pegboard so I took it across the street. It's in bad shape anyway. I had to take the console w/Pioneers. He made that clear before I went to get the Pioneers.
Are the speakers in them worth taking them out?
I wonder what I'll see if and when I take the back off.
I now have 3 sets of speakers to fix some cross-overs on.
I did order a nice soldering station and solder and soldering accessories for Christmas to myself this year. Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
The Maggotbox might have decent drivers in it. Probably 12 inch AlNiCo 'woofers' and (typically) Jensen RP-109 (or similar) horn treble drivers (too big to really be called tweeters).
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I'll take my screw-gun out there and take the back off and look in there tomorrow probably.Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
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Not to intentionally derail, but since the talk is of consoles. I have the same Pilot console as shown below. Photos borrowed from Reddit and AK. Mine is in similar, 8/10 condition (my receiver has all it's knobs). It's stored in my basement for now. I've never taken the back off to see what the speakers may be. Turntable is a Garrard RC-210. I will take it to a shop (some day) to have all the tubes/wiring etc. checked before use. I like its more compact size, nice wood too. I've had it for about ten years. Unit is ~1960.
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Nice, nice, nice receiver, that Pilot.
'twould be interesting indeed to see what sort of drivers the loudspeakers contain -- I can't even hazard a guess.
Well, OK, I could guess.
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Well I got out and tested these old speakers to see what the hype is about.
One speaker worked GREAT. The other...no sound.
The one speaker ROCKED my back yard along some others yards too.
I see/hear what the reviewers say about their bass. It seems to lack that 15" bass sound but there's bass there. And played loud, the sound was like a live band. Full and clear! And that's just from ONE speaker so far.
I had time and energy and it was a nice chilly and sunny day so I went to find out why one speaker didn't work. I took the woofer out, hooked it up directly and sound came from it instantly. So at least the main speaker/woofer works. I then pulled the insulation out. Just one thick slab coats the inside. The top part behind the other speakers on top stayed in. I only had so much time to explore and I think I spotted easily what might be wrong.
A capacitor had exploded on the cross-over board. I think it reads 1uf, 46 volts. It looked like it happened a long time ago.
Here are some pictures. I think you cross-over masters might get a kick out of seeing this layout.
Tony, do those have the "FB" markings on the woofers and mids ? Ok, did not see the second set of pics. I do not see the marking on the woofer anyway. I had a set and I was blown away by them. I thought no Kabuki should
sound that good. I read somewhere that the "FB" stood for free beating, something to do with the way the paper was constructed...Found it. http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/pioneer-fb-cones.184916/ . I had to let em go at $900.00 though. Cant keep everything...Not enough room.
Here is an article I clipped somewhere when I had mine.
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Thanks for that reference from Pioneer.
Yea, I heard the FB was printed on the ones that are FB. But these woofers look just like them. Oh well.
These do sound good though. The pots on the one that works needs cleaning for sure as I'm positive the other pots in the other speaker will need cleaning too.Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
I am almost 100% sure there is no difference between the FB marked and not marked. Material is exactly the same far as I can see. Here is an image of the back of these with model number.
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Is that speaker in the picture ( PW-385A / z 7146) an FB woofer?Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
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There are some CS99's on our local CL for tree-fiddy but they look somewhat different than yours. The photos posted don't show the model, however. They are obviously a similar version though.
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When they added the A to the number, they changed the layout.
Looks like completely different speakers though.
I'll bet they put out sound like mine do. Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
Here's CS-99A's and a NAD Receiver. No affil.
https://omaha.craigslist.org/ele/d/council-bluffs-nad-stereo-receiver-and/6799033445.html
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I think they value that set-up greatly. I'll bet it does sound great! But 600? I guess most of that price is for the speakers?
I'd like to hear it though. I have a NAD era system just like that I could pair with mine to see what they're talking about and see if it's a 600.00 sound.
Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
