Thinking of upgrading some old Monitor 70s

nkofahl · November 2018

Hello all, does anyone have any experience with the Monitor 70 (first series with silver cones on the drivers)? I've had these for quite some time and am considering an upgrade, but would like to better understand how they compare to the current polk audio lines. I'd rather not spend a fortune, but would like a solid upgrade. I'm feeding them with 95w from a Denon x2500h. I have recently purchased some S15s to replace my older surround speakers and am pleased with how they sound, but tend to listen to a lot of 2ch + sub music, so they don't get used much.

rooftop59 · November 2018

What skip said... I have a buddy that had a similar setup for years. While he was happy I knew the m70s would sound soooo much better with a ballsy amp.

I think you’ll seriously feel like you bought new speakers with a used amp like a parasound, B&K, rotel, it even Adcom with around 200 wpc.

And like skip said, be s60s are better speakers, but it’s hars to say how much better they will sound than the m70s with the right power. Let us know a budget and we’ll happily spend your 💰 $$$!

afterburnt · November 2018

I think I liked my 70's better thsn my 707's but I don't know.

mrloren · November 2018

I agree with getting a better AVR before replacing the speakers. Get a Denon AVR-X3500 and either and Outlaw Audio 500 amp or an Emotiva BasX-A300 and have them monitor M70 sing

nkofahl · November 2018

So potentially I can upgrade the AVR, it is still in the return period, but curious about some of the amp recommendations. The outlaw model mentioned above is rated at 120w into all 5 channels RMS. Is the recommendation for this model because the Denon isn't actually doing 95w RMS when driving the 2 channels? The difference between 120 and 95 doesn't seem to be all that great if in general a 3db gain is going to require double the power.

Assume I take the 2500h back and get either a 3500h with outputs or a 4400h (around the same price). The 4400 obviously has both the pre-outs and a better internal amp, so it is tempting.

Should I be looking at a 2 channel amp and still driving the S15s off the AVR or should I be looking at a 5ch amp?

Also just FYI, the sub in this scenario is an older SVS PB 12 Plus/2.

rooftop59 · November 2018

Several issues here, and others can explain some of them better. But first, the measurements of AVRs are notoriously deceptive. Many AVR power ratings are best on one channel at 1khz, a very easy frequency to drive, instead of the full band. However, it is true that most of the denon in-command AVR professional test measurements that I have seen do exceed their stated output, so it probably does somewhere around 95-100 wpc. So that brings up the next two points, which are current vs watts and the problem of the shared power supply. You need high current amps to make those speakers sing, not just watts. And sharing the same power supply with all the other things that AVR is doing degrades the sound quality. Also, its not about volume. Sure, your denon will play plenty loud (its a nice AVR). Its about the tightness of the bass, the separation of the instruments, the air around instruments, the size of the soundstage, etc. All of those things will increase when you really up the current behind those speakers. And to do this you need something with guts, so I would go for a used amp with at least 200 wpc or really good current.

mrloren · November 2018

take the 2500 back and get the 4400. I have the 4400 and love it, very nice AVR

I added a BasX-A300 to my system and my S60's said hello, now with an XPA3 it's crystal clear. An AVR might claim 125WX2 but it has a lot to run off that power supply. All an amp does is provide power. When I first got my 4400 I tried it without the amp. It did sound good but once I reconnected the amp it's so much cleaner with a lot more detail.

As for the amp. it all depends on budget. the Outlaw is 120Wx5 on all 5 channels for $600 hard to beat.

You have a nice sub, set the speakers to small and cross over to 80hz. Let the sub do the low end lifting.

rooftop59 · November 2018

I also love my Denon AVR-X4200w. Its a pretty powerfull AVR, but still benefits from external power. For example, I just took an old Audiosource AMP Two out of the closet, which puts out 200 wpc in mono mode, to power my CS400i . I immediately notice an increased heft and clarity to voices and effects that come through the center. So much so that I switched it to full range, and it sounds awesome! Just another example of what external amplification can do...

pkquat · November 2018

I scanned through this and will add my 2cents. The Denon with pre-outs is the way to go. You can either get a 5 channel amp or good 2 channel amp and use the receiver for the surround power. The separate amp will good current will do wonders for the 2 channel listening and power the biggest speakers in the HT setup. With the sub, I think the load should be decent for the reciever. Check the used market for a good 2 channel. If you decide you want more better power for your surround speakers, you can always add an amp or two, or get a multi channel amp. Keep the original 2 channel, sell it, or upgrade. The loss should be minimal if purchased on the used market.

afterburnt · November 2018

My 70's were entirely different speakers once I added an amp instead of running off a RX-A1040 AVR

nkofahl · December 2018

Was able to trade up to an x3500h for minimal additional investment. I'll look for an amp to add to this setup before upgrading the 70s. That said, the 3500h sounds better to me in the mid-bass area where i felt like the 70s were really lacking. I've crossed the 70s over at 80hz and let my SVS handle everything below that. The area around the crossover might be a bit better with the 3500 than with the 2500. I'm wondering if I just did a better job with the calibration or the Multeq xt32 is really better. Either way I'll keep my eye out for a good amp to give the 70s a bit more punch.

mrloren · December 2018

XT32 is a lot better XT in my opinion sucks.

A good amp for not much coin is the Emotiva BasX-A300. I had this one for over a year and it opened up my Signatures nice. The Outlaws are nice amps add a pair on mono blocks or the 5000.

Keep an eye on Craigslist too.

nkofahl · December 2018

Noted. Right now they just don't have the power to make 40hz sound full. That said I can't localize with the level I've set the sub at the current crossover. My ear might not be that critical. The only time I've ever felt like i could localize a sub crossed over at 80 is when distortion is involved and the SVS can play pretty loudly before that's an issue. Even with the ports tuned to 16hz it can play a lot louder than I can handle for music.

This whole exercise started with a new receiver, for a new TV, in a new room, in a new house. Somehow the monitors sounded a bit tired, lacking the punch I'd like as this room is a lot larger and more open than their last home. The better EQ in the 3500 has made things a bit better as the SVS is playing a lot nicer with the 70s, but I'm sure an amp will help a lot more so I'm keeping an eye out.

Thinking of upgrading some old Monitor 70s

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