2-Channel Amps

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Comments

  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,171
    dr1978 wrote: »
    I bought it through eBay, so I should be covered, but I won't feel comfortable until the money is back in my pocket.


    This is why I don't recommend Ebay for gear. Seems to be a dumping ground for stuff that has issues. Stick to sites like Audiogon, US Audiomart, HIFI Shark, or right here.

    Some dedicated audio shops also have demos and used gear for sale. Just hit their drop down menus on their websites.
    HT SYSTEM-2 channel
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Dynaudio Audience 72
    Polk FX500 surrounds
    Cary xciter dac
    Cullen modded Sonos
    Joule la-100 pre
    B&k Ref 4420 amp

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Analysis plus crystal oval ic's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
  • dr1978dr1978 Posts: 224
    Lesson learned. At least I already got my refund!
    Pro-ject 2 Experience SB, OPPO BDP-103, Marantz SR5011, Lounge LCR MKIII, B&K Ref 2220, AMC 2100, Polk LSiM705, Polk LSiM706C, Polk RM8, Polk PSW450
  • dr1978dr1978 Posts: 224
    Was telling my buddy about this fiasco and he said he has an AMC 2100 sitting in his closet that he'd give me! Only 100 wpc but it's better than nothing and should allow me to cool my jets and take my time on my next purchase.

    Any opinions on AMC?
    Pro-ject 2 Experience SB, OPPO BDP-103, Marantz SR5011, Lounge LCR MKIII, B&K Ref 2220, AMC 2100, Polk LSiM705, Polk LSiM706C, Polk RM8, Polk PSW450
  • verbverb Posts: 4,040
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS, Micro Seiki MB14 TT, VTL 2.5 Preamplifier, Marantz CD6006 CDP, Conrad Johnson MF2300A Amp, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, AQ Diamondback (version 1) RCA IC's, MIT Terminator2 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, Marantz CD-1, Marantz AMP-1, Acoustic Technologies Classic Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus Subwoofer, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Project BoxE, Polk TSi200's
    Living Room: Pioneer SX-N30 Network Receiver, Pioneer PD10AE CD Player, Furman M8-LX Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi Subwoofer
  • dr1978dr1978 Posts: 224
    edited March 10
    Sounds like I should be happy enough for $50. Decided to offer him a fifty spot for it.

    Down the road what do you guys think would be a better use for this amp? Bridging it and putting 200 watts into my center, or just using it to power my surrounds? With bridging I have read that it can cause a loss of clarity. Plus this would be for HT duty, and I could run into trouble with whatever new amp I get for my fonts not matching up well.

    I guess the other option is to just sell it when I get upgraditis and make a few bucks.
    Pro-ject 2 Experience SB, OPPO BDP-103, Marantz SR5011, Lounge LCR MKIII, B&K Ref 2220, AMC 2100, Polk LSiM705, Polk LSiM706C, Polk RM8, Polk PSW450
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,171
    You could still use it for your center, but I wouldn't bridge it though. This is for HT, you won't have any issues with whatever other amp you buy for the front left and right.

    You can also keep it to power the surrounds and find a 3 channel amp for the fronts.
    HT SYSTEM-2 channel
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Dynaudio Audience 72
    Polk FX500 surrounds
    Cary xciter dac
    Cullen modded Sonos
    Joule la-100 pre
    B&k Ref 4420 amp

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Analysis plus crystal oval ic's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
  • EndersShadowEndersShadow Posts: 16,131
    I think @ZLTFUL has a AMC amp, maybe even that model....
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • dr1978dr1978 Posts: 224
    Finally got the AMC put in place.......eh. I'm straining to hear any real improvement. I didn't listen to much 2-channel when I was just using my AVR, so I can't make a great comparison, but it seems like I'm turning up the dial even more than I did before. If I listen closely I can convince myself that I'm hearing some increased depth and detail, but again, I didn't really listen to 2-channel all that critically in the first place.

    I'm going to give it some more time, but right now I am thinking of going down the 3-channel path and using this for my surrounds. My issue with that is my "rack" is really more of a decorative piece that I purchased as a compromise with my wife that matches our decor. Because of that I have serious size restrictions. If either the width or depth isn't <15.5" then it won't fit. I don't really have the room for a separate amp stand either. So unless I magically come across a moderately sized, affordable, 3-channel amp then I'll just have to wait until I earn enough additional brownie points and can get a real rack.
    Pro-ject 2 Experience SB, OPPO BDP-103, Marantz SR5011, Lounge LCR MKIII, B&K Ref 2220, AMC 2100, Polk LSiM705, Polk LSiM706C, Polk RM8, Polk PSW450
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,171
    Could just be a bad match. I would look at the input impedance of the amp, and compare to the output impedance of the receiver. Most receivers will have a 1mv output, but many amps may have a 2mv input. Which means the receiver can only drive that amp to half it's power.

    Most pre-amps have outputs high enough to drive any amp, which is why the combo of a pre-amp/amp is usually preferred.

    What model is the amp ?
    HT SYSTEM-2 channel
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Dynaudio Audience 72
    Polk FX500 surrounds
    Cary xciter dac
    Cullen modded Sonos
    Joule la-100 pre
    B&k Ref 4420 amp

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Analysis plus crystal oval ic's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
  • dr1978dr1978 Posts: 224
    AVR is Marantz SR5011, Amp is AMC 2100.

    I'm having a hard time finding the input and output impedance of the amp and avr respectively.
    Pro-ject 2 Experience SB, OPPO BDP-103, Marantz SR5011, Lounge LCR MKIII, B&K Ref 2220, AMC 2100, Polk LSiM705, Polk LSiM706C, Polk RM8, Polk PSW450
  • WLDockWLDock Posts: 2,209
    The amp has a 1V input sens. https://www.hifiengine.com/manual_library/amc/2100.shtml

    however, the AVR spec does not seem to be listed. I would think its at least 1 volt? You could always check the output voltage of the AVR yourself.

    http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/home-theater-receivers-processors-amps/35677-gain-structure-home-theater-getting-most-pro-audio-equipment-your-system.html#post317692
    FAMILY ROOM
    HDTV - Sharp AQUOS LC-70LE600U 70" | AVR/Streamer - Onkyo TX-NR3008 | Amp - Parasound HCA-1203A
    Blu-Ray/Media/Gaming - Sony PS3-320GB / Microsoft Xbox One | Broadcast - Xfinity X1 Platform
    Front Spkrs - Coming...DIY Statement II | Center Spkrs - Coming...DIY Statement II | Rear Spkrs - Artison Portrait LRS
    Sub - DIY Stereo Integrity HT 15 | Sub Amp - Dayton Audio SA1000
    Wire - Audioquest Type 4, BJC Belden 5000 | HDMI - BJC Belden | Power Cables - Pangea | Surge - Monster
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,171
    edited March 14
    That's actually a good thing the amp has that low of an input impedance, means your receiver should drive it fine to full power. I'm assuming you have it hooked up to the front left and right pre-outs of the Marantz ? If so, with what cables ?
    HT SYSTEM-2 channel
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Dynaudio Audience 72
    Polk FX500 surrounds
    Cary xciter dac
    Cullen modded Sonos
    Joule la-100 pre
    B&k Ref 4420 amp

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Analysis plus crystal oval ic's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 19,591
    edited March 14
    You guys (and I know you know this!) are talking about source voltage output and load sensitivity, not source/load impedance, in the posts above. :) All of the above is true, and important -- but it is also true that appropriate alignment (shall we say) of source (output) and load (input) impedance is a good idea. :)

    The old rule of thumb is that the input impedance of the power amp ("load") should be at least ten times the output impedance of the preamp ("source"). The question is, can the OP find the input and output impedance ratings for the components in question.

    There was a recent thread at AK on (sort of) this same topic. It might be worth a look, but like so many discussions there in the past couple of years, it sort of degenerated into an off-topic "urinating contest" along the way :( PM me if you want a link.

    You can also try Steve "Decware" Deckert's white paper on the topic (typos and all), if you like.
    http://www.decware.com/paper55.htm
  • alucidideaalucididea Posts: 105

    I’ve got a question on this subject. I just got the following hardware:

    Yamaha RX-A3070:
    • Rated Output Level / Output Impedance
    PRE OUT
    SUBWOOFER (50 Hz) ................. 1.0 V/470 Ω ExceptSUBWOOFER(1kHz)..........1.0V/470Ω
    ZONE OUT ................................... 1.0 V/470 Ω
    • Maximum Output Level
    PRE OUT/ZONE OUT ..................2.0 V or more

    NAD M22:
    Input Sensitivity ............. 1.6 V (ref. Rated power)
    Input Impedence ........... 17kΩ + 200pF

    This seems like a decent match, however I’m a bit confused by the specs. Does this mean it has a minimum 1V output with a maximum of 2+V? I was hoping you could help me make sense of the specifications. Thanks in advance.
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,171
    alucididea wrote: »
    I’ve got a question on this subject. I just got the following hardware:

    Yamaha RX-A3070:
    • Rated Output Level / Output Impedance
    PRE OUT
    SUBWOOFER (50 Hz) ................. 1.0 V/470 Ω ExceptSUBWOOFER(1kHz)..........1.0V/470Ω
    ZONE OUT ................................... 1.0 V/470 Ω
    • Maximum Output Level
    PRE OUT/ZONE OUT ..................2.0 V or more

    NAD M22:
    Input Sensitivity ............. 1.6 V (ref. Rated power)
    Input Impedence ........... 17kΩ + 200pF

    This seems like a decent match, however I’m a bit confused by the specs. Does this mean it has a minimum 1V output with a maximum of 2+V? I was hoping you could help me make sense of the specifications. Thanks in advance.

    You'll be fine, the Yamaha has 2v on the preout and the amp has 1.6 on the input. Your kosher...
    HT SYSTEM-2 channel
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Dynaudio Audience 72
    Polk FX500 surrounds
    Cary xciter dac
    Cullen modded Sonos
    Joule la-100 pre
    B&k Ref 4420 amp

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Analysis plus crystal oval ic's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
  • alucidideaalucididea Posts: 105
    tonyb wrote: »
    You'll be fine, the Yamaha has 2v on the preout and the amp has 1.6 on the input. Your kosher...
    So I will be getting the full power from my amp?
  • dr1978dr1978 Posts: 224
    Well I finally did what I should have done in the first place and did a comparison with and without the amp. I'm getting deeper bass and maybe overall fullness, but it's not enough of a difference for me to settle on. I'm happy with the pickup at the price, but I'll be in the market for another 2 or 3 channel amp.
    Pro-ject 2 Experience SB, OPPO BDP-103, Marantz SR5011, Lounge LCR MKIII, B&K Ref 2220, AMC 2100, Polk LSiM705, Polk LSiM706C, Polk RM8, Polk PSW450
  • dr1978dr1978 Posts: 224
    tonyb wrote: »
    That's actually a good thing the amp has that low of an input impedance, means your receiver should drive it fine to full power. I'm assuming you have it hooked up to the front left and right pre-outs of the Marantz ? If so, with what cables ?

    Yep, it's hooked up correctly, and the cables should be ok. I picked up some blue Jean interconnects.
    Pro-ject 2 Experience SB, OPPO BDP-103, Marantz SR5011, Lounge LCR MKIII, B&K Ref 2220, AMC 2100, Polk LSiM705, Polk LSiM706C, Polk RM8, Polk PSW450
  • deronb1deronb1 Posts: 4,348
    Sorry to hear about the amp. Rarely read about bad experiences with Parasound. I had a 1500a that was fantastic. Kinda wish i still had it.
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