"One World, One Driver, Pure Music" :-)

mhardy6647
mhardy6647 Posts: 33,608
edited June 2015 in Speakers
FullRanger-shield-FR125.gif

With thanks and apologies to Dave "Planet10" Dlugos:
http://www.planet10-hifi.com/
http://www.t-linespeakers.org/

It got warm up here in the northlands a couple of weeks ago so I decided to pull out a soiled state amplifier to run for a wee bit. I ended up hooking up a late 1960s HH Scott LK-60. This was the kit version of the 260 integrated stereo amp, a relatively early soiled state amplifier that employed an interesting "quasi-complementary" circuit topology. As such, it was still capacitor coupled at the outputs (to remove the DC bias), so it has a certain... softness to its presentation (especially given that it's all original, complete with ca. 45 year old output coupling capacitors!).

I rotated a bunch of different speakers to see what might complement :- ) its qualities -- and I found a pair of winners. Rather unlikely ones, at that.

18273630709_b6366d05a3_b.jpg049 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr

These little Fostex speakers, sold as "kits" (drivers, boxes, and screws) are little more than toys, and priced accordingly... but boy howdy they provide presence and imaging that is astonishing, given their extremely modest nature. Yes, I am cheating by using a subwoofer, but it is crossed in very low and at a low level; just a little fill near the bottom.

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/fostex-p1000e-diy-kanspea-4-full-range-speaker-kit-pair/

One could find better FR drivers, and one could baffle these particular FRs (Fostex FE103-En, modern versions of a driver that's been continuously available since the mid-1960s) more appropriately than these tiny vented boxes, but the overall tone and presentation of even these little guys is actually pretty impressive.

I wish I had a proper pair of speaker stands to give them a little more altitude -- but the Polkstands clones (which I received as a Karma from a CP member a few years back!) actually do a very nice job.

Just thought I'd share.
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Comments

  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,608
    Here is a classic enclosure design including a contour circuit for the classic Radio Shack version of this driver (from 1965). See page 29 of
    http://www.americanradiohistory.com/Archive-Electronics-Illustrated/Electronics-Illustrated-1965-11.pdf

    014.jpg
    image from www.radioshackcatalogs.com (1968)

    FWIW, I don't find the current Fostex FE-103En to be as "tizzy" sounding as I did the R/S 40-1197 version (at least, the ones I bought from R/S in the 1990s).

    PS The site from which the Electronics Illustrated PDF link above originates is an incredible resource of hifi/radio/broadcast engineering resources! http://www.americanradiohistory.com/index.htm
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  • oldrocker
    oldrocker Posts: 2,590
    Cool stuff Mr. Hardy..
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,536
    Full rangers have always intrigued me....cool stuff
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Full rangers have always intrigued me....cool stuff

    Have to agree!

    Would those work as near field speakers, Mark? Or do they need a lot of breathing room?

    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    I got my Full range back loaded horn speakers done! they sound really good depending on the music you play on them like Jazz & Danny Elfmans "Serenada schizophrana" is awesome on them. But other music I have played came out flat and dull some you have to play the right music on them.
    Been using them with my MC100-b at 30wpc in triode mode and they play nice together...still have to sand them and stain etc..

    See what Doc has got me into again! :) it is a simple little kit and a fun way to give it a try and it uses a Fostex FE166En 6.5" full range speaker.

    6cvsoequv07j.jpg
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,608
    cnh wrote: »
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Full rangers have always intrigued me....cool stuff

    Have to agree!

    Would those work as near field speakers, Mark? Or do they need a lot of breathing room?
    That seems to be what Fostex intends them for (i.e., computer speakers).



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  • Jimbo18
    Jimbo18 Posts: 2,334
    These are on our local CL right now, but seem pricey at $400. Nice looking though.

    syasu15ji8ft.jpg
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,608
    edited June 2015
    Jimbo18 wrote: »
    These are on our local CL right now, but seem pricey at $400. Nice looking though.

    syasu15ji8ft.jpg

    Hmm -- those look like Bob Brines (Brines Acoustics) TQWT enclosures? I like what Bob has done over the years; indeed he designed the mass-loaded TQWT enclosures I use for the venerable Radio Shack 40-1354 5-1/4" twincones.

    9599007591_1f3e441faf_b.jpgDSC_6399 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr

    EDIT: FWIW, I would think that pair of CL speakers is easily worth 400 smackers if one likes what they do.

    The Fostex drivers can be a bit of an acquired taste -- some folks really like what they do, others find them shrilly aggressive. For my part, some of them I like, some I really don't -- and, unfortunately, one cannot tell just by lookin' at a Fostex driver what it will sound like, I'd opine.

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  • Jimbo18
    Jimbo18 Posts: 2,334
    Good eye, Mark. They are indeed Brines, according to the ad.

    f4gfo8gnfm7x.png
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  • msg
    msg Posts: 9,974
    cool stuff, indeed, as others have mentioned.
    I do enjoy these displays :)
    makes me wanna build something too!
    I disabled signatures.
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,608
    edited June 2015
    Bob's "products" owe much to Martin J King's work -- but he's always been pretty straightforward about that, and he (Bob) is certainly capable of designing (and, presumably, also of building) a good-sounding, empathetic box for a good driver.

    The ML TQWT cabinets I have, built by my woodworker friend Mike Berg using void-free, (EDIT: I think!) Baltic birch plywood, cost about as much as the CL speakers (materials and labor, sans drivers) a decade or so ago -- and I would still consider them very cost-effective loudspeakers.
    http://brinesacoustics.com/Pages/Proposals.html#RS 40-1354a

    MikeBergInside.jpg

    Tastes vary though -- certainly speakers like these aren't for everyone.
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    edited June 2015
    Hey Doc In that kit you posted I see they have a option between the FE103en or the FE103 SOL which is a 50th anniversary edition. wonder what the difference is?

    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-4-fullrange/fostex-special-fe103-sol-8-50th-anniversary-limited-edition-4-full-range-8-ohm/
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    For the most part I like the full range speakers I made as they sound really great with the right music, they even seem to mellow out some overly bright songs.
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    Jim the kit I bought cost like $478 so I think those speakers are worth getting to me! they look pretty good.
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,608
    edited June 2015
    Voltz, I just happened to realize :- ) something that might be worth mentioning.

    You probably know this already, but the Fostex drivers are rather notorious for requiring a long, long break-in run before they sound their best -- on the terms, it is oft claimed, of hundreds of hours. I.e., they may, over time, sound mo' better-er with mo' other types of music than what you've found to date.

    EDIT: Ahh other than price & cosmetics, I don't know what is really different about the anniversary version. Madisound does have links to the datasheets, though, so one may peruse them for clues (sort of like Scooby-Do and the gang).

    FE-103 Sol:
    http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/pdf/FE103-Sol Data Sheet.pdf
    http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/pdf/Fostex_FE103SOL_Manual.pdf

    FE-103En:
    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/images/products/secondary/fe103en-1.jpg
    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/images/products/secondary/fe103en-2.png
    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/images/products/secondary/fe103en-3.png
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    I had read several forums about them and others had mention they needed some good ole burn in time! I hope to do the starting sunday, but tonight I hope to get about 8 more hours on them before I fall asleep, had to get up around 3am this morning and work 8 hours so maybe 5 is more realistic.
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    edited June 2015
    I got my speakers sanded, and 1 of them has been pre-stained , wanting to get some new stain as I didnt like the one i choose (early American) as its a light walnut look to it which I will use on the bases.

    Hey doc have you seen or heard the Omega full range? I like their look and the prices are not bad

    http://omegaloudspeakers.com/super7xrsmk2.html

    tjoxg8hplbpf.jpg

    p.s. I don't have any plans of buying them just like looking at the full range speakers after you put the thought into my head :p
    Post edited by voltz on
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 33,608
    No, I haven't heard them -- they look nice.
    Wonder who builds the drivers for them?
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    RS7 driver found in 7 series speakers

    - Perfect point source and phase and time accurate
    - Full-range 7" driver
    - One-piece whizzer / dustcap assembly
    - Dual cone with twin rolled edge surround
    - Lightweight OmegaFibreCone material, with treated and pleated accordion fabric surround
    - Open, cast-aluminum basket, which greatly reduces back wave bounce back
    - Powerful Ferrite motor
    - 95dB SPL
    - 8 Ohm

    but I'm dont see who makes it
    dx5glafvh511.jpg
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    they got a big following on their forums.
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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  • voltz
    voltz Posts: 5,384
    here a pic of the speakers after 2 coats of clear coat, probably add at least 1 more. Put the speaker in just for the picture.

    jb1mfdddunm3.jpg
    2 ch- Polk CRS+ * Vincent SA-31MK Preamp * Vincent Sp-331 Amp * Marantz SA8005 SACD * Project Xperience Classic TT * Sumiko Blue Point #2 MC cartridge

    HT - Polk 703's * NAD T-758 * Adcom 5503 * Oppo 103 * Samsung 60" series 8 LCD
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