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Legacy Audio Focus Crossover Modification Thread

VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
This will be a fun one :)

Tweeter Network -
Clarity Cap MR
Mills MRC50 Resistors
Jantzen Perfectly Lay Inductor + P Core Where Applicable
Supra Rondo Internal Wiring

Midrange Network -
Clarity Cap MR/ESA
Mills MRC50 Resistors
Jantzen Perfectly Lay Inductor + P Core Where Applicable
Supra Rondo Internal Wiring

Bass Network -
Clarity Cap PX bypassed by Clarity Cap MR
Mundorf Electrolytic bypassed by Clarity Cap MR
Jantzen P Core
Mills MRC50
Supra Rondo Internal WIring

External enclosures, custom fabricated, owner is providing wood side panels to mimic his speakers
Supra QUADRAX wiring to go from enclosures to speakers/amps
NL8 and NL4 connections

Will be fun!

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- Not Tom

"No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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Comments

  • oldrockeroldrocker Posts: 2,227
    I can't even imagine having the "brains" to do what you do.
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  • WLDockWLDock Posts: 2,671
    Looks like fun...reminds me that I need to do some Xover work myself.
    FAMILY ROOM
    HDTV - Sharp AQUOS LC-70LE600U 70" | AVR/Streamer - Onkyo TX-NR3008 | Amp - Parasound HCA-1203A
    Blu-Ray/Media/Gaming - Sony PS3-320GB / Microsoft Xbox One | Broadcast - Xfinity X1 Platform
    Front Spkrs - Coming...DIY Statement II | Center Spkrs - Coming...DIY Statement II | Rear Spkrs - Artison Portrait LRS
    Sub - DIY Stereo Integrity HT 15 | Sub Amp - Dayton Audio SA1000
    Wire - Audioquest Type 4, BJC Belden 5000 | HDMI - BJC Belden | Power Cables - Pangea | Surge - Monster
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  • pitdogg2pitdogg2 Posts: 14,882
    Trey very cool but it looks as if your work cut out for you there.
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    lehagejw9lay.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • tonybtonyb Posts: 31,648
    Holy smokes bro.....given your past work I can't imagine how this puppy is gonna turn out. Who's speaks are these anyway ? I'd be interested to hear the results from the owner.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
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  • drumminmandrumminman Posts: 3,372
    Hard to believe they put those "average" components in speakers of that quality level: sand cast resistors, electrolytic caps. Those upgrades should net a h-u-g-e improvement.
    "Science is suppose to explain observations not dismiss them as impossible" - Norm on AA; 2.3TL's w/sonicaps/mills/jantzen inductors, Gimpod's boards, Lg Solen SDA inductors, RD-0198's, MW's dynamatted, Armaflex speaker gaskets, H-nuts, brass spikes, Cardas CCGR BP's, upgraded IC Cable, Black Hole Damping Sheet strips, interior of cabinets sealed with Loctite Power Grab, AI-1 interface with 1000VA A-L transformer
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    edited March 2015
    Yeah the stock crossovers leave alot to be desired. To add to the injury, almost all the caps use various a myriad of parts to make one value so you might have for different values to make a single larger value.

    I'm looking forward to posting the results. The owner is out in California

    Thanks guys

    :)
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    Also, notice how every single inductor goes the same direction O_O
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • tonybtonyb Posts: 31,648
    Yep, the original Focus had some fairly crappy parts inside. Granted, things have progressed a bit better in the model years but for the most part, crossover parts hasn't been their strong suit. Much can be said for many speaker makers in that regard too.

    External crossovers....juiced up by Trey.....count me curious....and jealous. Keep us up to date pal, with pics. Could have swore you did some earlier Legacy crossover upgrades, no ?
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    Yes, one of my first monsters was for a set of Empireslj2y7m7hilmr.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • tratlifftratliff Posts: 845
    That looks like a great project. I am hoping the cross overs on my new Focus SEs has been cleaned up since the ones Trey posted were built. I haven't cracked them open for a look but now you make me wonder. One thing I do know about the new ones are that they are using Solen caps. Here is a quote of the website about the new upper end of the cross over:

    "I chose to use Solen metallized polypropylene capacitors imported from France as bypasses in the high frequency network and braided silver cable by Ray Kimber to the upper ribbon. "

    I would love to hear the results after the rebuild.
    2 Channel
    Legacy Focus SE, 2 REL Carbon Limited, McIntosh C50, McIntosh MC601's, VPI Prime w/SoundSmith Zephyr MIMC, Parasound Halo JC3, Marantz SA-14s1, Oppo BDP-105, Technics RS-1500, Furman Elite 15PFi, Douglas Connection (Furutech) Alpha Interconnects, Douglas Connection (Furutech) Alpha Speaker Cables, Pangea Power Cables
    Theater
    Yamaha RX-Z9, Legacy Focus SE (same as 2 Channel system), Def Tech C/L/R 2500, Def Tech BP-2X, Def Tech Pro-Monitors, Vizio M-75
    Office
    Teac NP-H750, Parasound Ztuner, Audio Engine P4N, Grado SR80, Grado iGrado, Audio-Technica ATH-M50, PC running High Rez files
    Living Room
    Yamaha YSP-4100 digital sound projector, Sharp Aquos 60"
    Bed Room
    Yamaha YSP-5100 digital sound projector, Sharp Aquos 70"
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  • tonybtonyb Posts: 31,648
    Trey, has the guy given you any feedback on what the new crossovers did for his sound on the Empires ? I assume he's happy ?
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    edited March 2015
    The crossovers have solen In the tweeter and midrange network. The key wording is bypasses. They also have the kimber cable

    Here is a review for the Empire

    "I found out about Trey’s work by seeing his ad for Tyler Acoustics Supertower speakers. The work done to them really intrigued me and I purchased them from him. I had previously owned Taylo 7u’s and heard the Decade D1, and D2 as well as Woodmere2 at shows. I always wondered what they would sound like with top notch crossover parts and was certainly not disappointed when I heard the Supertowers. I already owned a pair of Legacy Empire speakers when I purchased the Supertowers. After hearing the upgraded Tylers, I began to wonder what the Empires would sound like with their crossovers upgraded in the same manner. I really loved the open sound of the Tylers, but had to have the dynamics/ jump factor provided by the Legacys. I sent Trey the stock crossovers and the single line schematic provided by Legacy. I’ve owned many pairs of Legacy speakers and they all have had the same issue. The cheap crossover parts are audible.

    Trey provided a basic quote and the process began. This was a huge undertaking due to the large number of parts in the crossover. I was kept up to date regularly thru the entire process with pictures and emails stating specific progress and any recommended changes to the basic plan, as well as requests for my input for enclosure construction, etc. I would estimate that we exchanged 20-25 emails during the process. When the crossovers arrived, I took a peak inside and was very pleased with the quality of the work that I saw inside. Parts were neatly laid out and properly secured. Shipping packaging was first rate and secure.
    I got them hooked up in my system and was almost immediately aware that after these finished break in, they were going to be what I was looking for. Gone was the grittiness of the stock crossover system. They now have between 250 and 300 hours on them and it has certainly been worth the wait. Everything is improved across the board with the exception of the large scale dynamics, which remained intact. It is like a large veil has been removed. Increased detail, check. Improved purity of tone and harmonics, check. Better imaging and soundstaging, check. Improved micro dynamics, check. Improved sense of ease, check. More fun to listen to, absolutely! Everything just sounds more correct and I couldn’t be more pleased.
    After going thru this process, I can without hesitation recommend VR3mods for any crossover modification you may be considering. If you like the basic sound of your speakers, but wonder what they are really capable of, by all means have VR3mods upgrade your crossovers. I have had two transactions with Trey and he has been nothing other than highly professional in both cases. Highest recommendation. Thanks" - Cris Legacy Empire Monastery Level


    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    j7jf2ecvswwr.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    I met with the fabricator today. These enclosures will be little tanks for sure. I am excited to put the parts in there. They will most likely look like little robots.b1udkw3hc3zx.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,281
    drumminman wrote: »
    Hard to believe they put those "average" components in speakers of that quality level: sand cast resistors, electrolytic caps. Those upgrades should net a h-u-g-e improvement.

    A lot of Legacy's cost is in the use of multiple drivers and the cabinetry.
    audiothesis.com/
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    Yeah, the drivers in these speakers are very nice and the cabinets are fairly intricate. I would love to hear them! :)
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    Designing the back plate to 3D print, black main panel with white text... bwmwbky32clt.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    I think I like this one better :)y7nsjnrthixz.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • Inspector 24Inspector 24 Posts: 1,230
    *Subscribed
    Down
    RTiA9 - CSiA6 - FXiA6 - Dual HSU VTF-15H Mk2
    Parasound HCA-3500 - HCA-2003A - Marantz SR7005
    Sim2 D60 - Dragonfly 106" Panny 500

    Up
    LSi15 LSiC - RX-V3000
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    edited April 2015
    My first full size (second) prototype. I am still tweaking 3D printing. I pulled this one off before it is even cooled down, just testing the fit of my rendering. I didnt let it finish printing but the full print mimics the NL4 gaskets you can buy separately. It will cover the entire connector's edge.rg6g5v0ntlm6.jpg
    t4ff9uhrr0am.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    Isolated substrate from the enclosure, will help reduce vibrations reaching the crossover components and maintain a solid center of gravity. I also like that you will be able to see the components from each side of the unit (that is until they put the wood sides on it)l3pvw9rnitks.jpg
    axf8r1gkujd0.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • tonybtonyb Posts: 31,648
    Trey, your work needs to be seen, not hidden. Maybe if you can leave an area of that box visible, maybe even illuminated, it would add to the owners pleasure and gain you some free advertising by all who see it. Just sayin'.....the way you build crossovers, I'd want to show it off, not hide it.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    Thank you Tony! That kind of design traits I leave up to the owner. If they want the work shown, I can work it in but otherwise I treat every build as if they will be hidden. I like a "Utopian" approach where everything is built as if it WILL be seen though, if that makes sense.
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    Initial fit testyohe8f9vrxb2.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • erniejadeerniejade Posts: 5,104
    Maybe I missed it but what series focus are they?

    Amazing work!
    Den: Lumin D1,Wireworld Silver Eclipse, KEF LS50 Wireless, Velodyne SPL1200, Technics 1200, Denon DL160, Jolida D9,

    Living Room:,T+A PA 1530R, Tyler Highland H2, Aries Mini, High Fidelity Reveal RCA, Grant Fidelity Tube Dac 11, W4S recovery, Wireworld Platinum Starlight, PS Audio Direct Stream JR.

    Have but haven't used in a while: LH Labs VI Dac, Cayin SCD50T

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  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,550
    To my knowledge these are the current production model.yyb8x0rqint4.jpg
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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  • Moose68BashMoose68Bash Posts: 3,623
    Trey,
    That appears to be a very challenging and complex project.
    And, as always, your work seems to be absolutely remarkable.
    Well done!
    Phil
    Family Room, PS Audio PW Transport, DirectStream DAC w/Bridge II; AQ Sky XLRs, McIntosh MC 220 Tube Pre; AQ Sky XLRs, CAT 600.2 Dualmono Amp, Morrow SP7 Speaker Cables, SDA SRS 1.2tls (RD0198s, Dreadnought, Black Hole 5, Acousta-Stuf, Dynamat Extreme, JBWeld. Vr3 Mods: "The Abbot" Monastery-Level Xovers, Custom Internal Wiring, Binding Post Plates, & SDA ICs).

    Exercise Room, Wadia 171 iPod Dock, PS Audio PerfectWave MkII DAC w/Bridge II, AQ Sky XLRs, Perreaux PMF3150 Amp, Dreadnought, Supra Rondo 4x2.5 Speaker Cables, SDA 1Cs (Vr3 Mods Xovers).

    Synology 713+ NAS on Gigabit LAN serving PW MkII DAC & DirectStream DAC.
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  • zingozingo Audiophile Posts: 11,837
    Super sexy! I'm a big believer in form following function.
    Jake
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  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,281
    Welcome back Jake! What rock were you under?
    audiothesis.com/
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