New Sharp Elite won best out of al high end Tv shootout. But there is a surprise .
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mantis
Posts: 17,056
Hello all,
I just read an interesting shootout with a surprise model that came in and swept the contest. But you can't buy it anymore so I guess it really doesn't matter to anyone looking for a new set unless your willing to go used or find one in a box somewhere.
Check it out and post your thoughts.
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-20118503-221/sharp-elite-wins-value-electronics-hdtv-shootout/?tag=cnetRiver
I just read an interesting shootout with a surprise model that came in and swept the contest. But you can't buy it anymore so I guess it really doesn't matter to anyone looking for a new set unless your willing to go used or find one in a box somewhere.
Check it out and post your thoughts.
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-20118503-221/sharp-elite-wins-value-electronics-hdtv-shootout/?tag=cnetRiver
Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
Post edited by mantis on
Comments
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Looks like the Panny Plasma is still a great deal when you consider the price is half of the Sharp Elite. I saw the Sharp at my local Best Buy, the 70 incher, wasn't all that impressed with picture quality. My Kuro still has a better picture in my book. Colors on the Sharp didn't have that nature look to them and were a tad on the grainy side. Chalk it up to BB maybe not calibrating it correctly,I dunno,but at that price point if you want to sell them,you best calibrate the crap out of it.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
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Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
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lsi 9's -
+100, Tonyb. If BB wants to showcase the Sharp Elite to prospective buyer$$$, they better get someone in there that knows what the hell to do to make shoppers go WOW!!! Whatever it takes either through calibration,IC's,Blu ray player, etc... spare no cost, make it look better than any other tv in the store.
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Thats the problem with stores like that. They don't display any set to make it look it's best. If you study the picture of the Elite you can tell it's a better set then all others but it's not night and day or price wise a standout.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
In my opinion Dan, if the picture isn't a night and day difference from the closest competitor, then whats the point in buying one ? The price tag sure is a night and day difference though so one would expect the picture to blow all others away. Kuros had a hard time selling in a better economy, now ? Good luck with that marketing strategy.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
If you study the picture of the Elite you can tell it's a better set then all others but it's not night and day or price wise a standout.
The experts didn't think it was better.Interestingly, Zohn said two calibrators voted differently from the audience. Miller and D-Nice both picked the Samsung PND8000, not the Elite, as the overall winner by a nose over the VT30Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
But what makes one an expert??? Thats like saying all the reviews at stereophile are correct, because they know what there talking about???? In retail, its the publics OP, that really count, IMOP,Not an Audiophile, just a dude who loves music, and decent gear to hear it with.
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But what makes one an expert???
Experience.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Not necessarily an expert Jess, but a more valued opinion anyway. Kinda like around here, lots of opinions on stuff from a select few who have no experience at all, but read an article about xyz somewhere and suddenly they know everything. Then the ones with actual experience chime in and are dismissed by those with no experience.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
I got ya, but to me, its like judging a movie, based on what a critic thinks, another so called expert,, I say, let the masses decide, and i add to that, the ones with deep pockets, at those prices.Experience.Not an Audiophile, just a dude who loves music, and decent gear to hear it with. -
Not necessarily an expert Jess, but a more valued opinion anyway. Kinda like around here, lots of opinions on stuff from a select few who have no experience at all, but read an article about xyz somewhere and suddenly they know everything. Then the ones with actual experience chime in and are dismissed by those with no experience.
One of the reasons that Plato didn't like Democracy! Not sure where that leaves us, though?
Well maybe it's like Ortega y Gasset's Revolt of the Masses (one of my favorites)!
In any case, we're living in the wreckage of the Postmodern '90s where everyone thinks that everyone has the right to his personal opinion and that 'all' opinions are equally valid--which, of course, is NOT true!
cnhCurrently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!
Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
[sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash] -
Do you hear that buzzing noise?
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Hello all,
I just read an interesting shootout with a surprise model that came in and swept the contest. But you can't buy it anymore so I guess it really doesn't matter to anyone looking for a new set unless your willing to go used or find one in a box somewhere.
Check it out and post your thoughts.
http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-20118503-221/sharp-elite-wins-value-electronics-hdtv-shootout/?tag=cnetRiver
So the Sharp is an Elite in name only, with an Elite price but without the overall Kuro performance? IMO, it sounds seriously over priced if they couldn't even get the color accuracy down. -
I wonder what would stop someone from actually remaking the Kuro? Sharp owns the technology don't they? Seems to me that it's something tried and true, extremely sought after, and hard to come by. No development costs (or not hundreds of thousands anyway). That would seem like a logical business direction?
What do I know though. I just buy the stuff.65" Sony X900 (XBR-65X900E)
Pioneer Elite SC-37
Polk Monitor 70's (2)
Polk Monitor 40's (4)
Polk Monitor CS2
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Oppo BDP-93
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Dish Network "The Hoppa" -
I'd gladly take a Panasonic any day of the week. Talk about an awesome display at a fraction of the cost.Shoot the jumper.....................BALLIN.............!!!!!
Home Theater Pics in the Showcase :cool:
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showcase/view.php?userid=73580 -
I want to Install and ISF calibrate one before I pass my judgement. Passing Judgement on a set due to a showroom look and price tag doesn't cut it in my book.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
I wonder what would stop someone from actually remaking the Kuro? Sharp owns the technology don't they? Seems to me that it's something tried and true, extremely sought after, and hard to come by. No development costs (or not hundreds of thousands anyway). That would seem like a logical business direction?
What do I know though. I just buy the stuff.
These new Sharps sound more like a quattron LED with great black levels because of the local dimming than an evolution of the original Kuro plasma technology. And IIRC, Panasonic either bought some Kuro tech, hired some Kuro engineers, or both to produce their sets. Seems like Pioneer just sold off pieces rather than the whole thing to one company. I'm still waiting to hear what Kuro tech, if any, actually made it in to the Sharp Elites. Or if they just sold them the marketing rights so they could jack up the price. -
I want to Install and ISF calibrate one before I pass my judgement. Passing Judgement on a set due to a showroom look and price tag doesn't cut it in my book.
Should be an interesting read after you do get your hands on one. Although it sounds like the shootout had these sets calibrated and they still concluded, "It fared the worst of the six contenders in color accuracy." Not a legacy you want coming from the Elite brand. -
I think that they have correctly adjusted the sets to their best as they are experianced in that and have the right equipment (not cheep crap). So if the new Sharp "Elite" couldn't easly out-do the others then it dosen't justify the extra price and they are riding on the Elite reputation in the hopes that people will think it is better because it is branded with the "Elite" badge. I call that A$$hole marketing and they will do anything to try and get an edge on the competition even if they have to drag down a highly reguarded set like the original Elite.
Dave -
I want to Install and ISF calibrate one before I pass my judgement. Passing Judgement on a set due to a showroom look and price tag doesn't cut it in my book.
When you calibrate do you use the industries best Monolta 200 meter and software? I looked at them and recieved a quote and the price of over $12k made me about crap and I quickly changed my mind. You just can't do it properly anyother way (with your eyes).
Dave -
I use Sencore gear. The entire rig was over 10k. Video sucks dude and so does buying ISF level gear. It's crazy expensive and they are constantly upgrading and outdating the older gear.dave shepard wrote: »When you calibrate do you use the industries best Monolta 200 meter and software? I looked at them and recieved a quote and the price of over $12k made me about crap and I quickly changed my mind. You just can't do it properly anyother way (with your eyes).
Dave
But in the end if you want to get the last 10% out of a display , there is no better way then a calibration. I usually take around 2 to 3 hours to do one. Unless it's a Kuro then it's like 30 minutes or so. The come out of the box near perfect. Crazy.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
^ An end user can do a pretty good calibration using an Eye One and some calibration software. Pretty simple.Shoot the jumper.....................BALLIN.............!!!!!
Home Theater Pics in the Showcase :cool:
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showcase/view.php?userid=73580 -
The Kuro was never compared directly to any of the flat panels in the room. It was simply used as a reference point. The Sharp Elite destroyed the competition in measured contrast, the main complaint from D-Nice was color accuracy which the Elite had problems with. They discovered the Elite had errors in properly reproducing Teals. All in attendance including Sharp reps believed this could be Fixed with firmware. If it is fixed many of the calibrators thought the Sharp Elite would be an over the top winner, as it has black levels as good as the Kuro's and offers peak brightness levels that the Kuro could never touch. What I found most interesting was how well the Sharp handled motion which was rated better then even a few of the plasmas.
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I'll have to go back and re read it. Thanks for pointing that out. If the new Elite panel has no problems with Motion , that is a huge plus in my book. Now fix the off angle viewing problems and LED would be the best choice over all panels. Panasonic would have some problems at this point.The Kuro was never compared directly to any of the flat panels in the room. It was simply used as a reference point. The Sharp Elite destroyed the competition in measured contrast, the main complaint from D-Nice was color accuracy which the Elite had problems with. They discovered the Elite had errors in properly reproducing Teals. All in attendance including Sharp reps believed this could be Fixed with firmware. If it is fixed many of the calibrators thought the Sharp Elite would be an over the top winner, as it has black levels as good as the Kuro's and offers peak brightness levels that the Kuro could never touch. What I found most interesting was how well the Sharp handled motion which was rated better then even a few of the plasmas.
Panasonic does have a Professional line that I would love to add to this type of VS battle. That would be very interesting.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
The two advantages the Sharp has over the Kuro is peak brightness while maintaining incredible black levels and size. The advantages the Kuro has is color accuracy (which Sharp said they would fix via firmware) and viewing angles. I guess one could argue that viewing angle problems can be over come by sheer size.
I'll be in the market for a large TV in the next 12 months so I've been following the Elites quite a bit. I had thought of buying a used Kuro but like the larger size of the Elite. I find the pricing of the Elites a little mind numbing...I doubt they'll hold retail be Xmas. People wouldn't pay for Kuros so I don't know what's changed other then having a worse economy...
I watched the shoot out last weekend on their live feed. It was interesting, most of the video has since been broken into segments and posted on YouTube. -
Slightly off topic, but there was a 820 series Sharp Quattron owner on AVS that stated similar results and that he thought Sharp could fix these issues with a firmware upgrade. Well nothing ever came to be so you get as close as you can, but it makes me wonder if Sharp has some firmware tweaking to do with current sets in addition to the new Elite model.
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The two advantages the Sharp has over the Kuro is peak brightness while maintaining incredible black levels and size. The advantages the Kuro has is color accuracy (which Sharp said they would fix via firmware) and viewing angles. I guess one could argue that viewing angle problems can be over come by sheer size.
I'll be in the market for a large TV in the next 12 months so I've been following the Elites quite a bit. I had thought of buying a used Kuro but like the larger size of the Elite. I find the pricing of the Elites a little mind numbing...I doubt they'll hold retail be Xmas. People wouldn't pay for Kuros so I don't know what's changed other then having a worse economy...
I watched the shoot out last weekend on their live feed. It was interesting, most of the video has since been broken into segments and posted on YouTube.
Actually all the Kuro's sold very well until Best Buy got a hold of them. Even when the Economy was crashing , they where still our number 1 selling TV . The price did drop at the end and people where buying them up. I was seriously considering picking one up then but they all got sold before I could commit on one. I got mine used from a very good customer.
I also didn't know about the video's , your a wealth of knowledge on this topic and I'm loving it. You should also consider a Panasonic Professional before making a choice.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
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These new Elites are awesome...
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Hopefully they release an 80" soon
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I'll be in the market for a large TV in the next 12 months so I've been following the Elites quite a bit. I had thought of buying a used Kuro but like the larger size of the Elite. I find the pricing of the Elites a little mind numbing...I doubt they'll hold retail be Xmas. People wouldn't pay for Kuros so I don't know what's changed other then having a worse economy...
I'm also looking to replace a secondary flat panel some time in the next year and certainly don't mind paying a premium price for a premium product. But the biggest change I can think of other than the poor economy is the collapse of prices for flat panels in the last few years. Kuros came of age at a time when even the value large panel HDTVs were going for 3-5 grand a pop. So 6-8 grand for the best didn't seem like that much of a leap for those with some extra coin. But asking the same price when you can get a 55", quality TV for only a grand and change seems a little excessive. Especially when their product comes out of the gate with such flawed color reproduction. They can run all the tests these guys did in their shootout during the lab in development. They knew when they released it that they had major color reproduction problems. I really hope they get this sorted out by firmware soon as I might like to get a TV of this quality especially at a sale price during Christmas. But I'm not going to spend this kind of coin on a firmware promise.
