Is there any point buying a powerful amp for low volume listening?

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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,396
    edited June 2010
    One other thing with the Aleph 30; the input and output trannies are hand matched in the circuit and while the photo I provided earlier is not my actual unit, if you look closely you can see the test information hand written in black sharpie on the MosFet case.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 34,913
    edited June 2010
    FTGV wrote: »
    I'm only seeing a single bridge rectifier.


    oops, my bad; I looked at the filter banks; didn't look for the bridges :-P
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  • lanchile
    lanchile Posts: 560
    edited June 2010
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    10-4.

    Looks to me that it does have dual P/S for the two channels with two separate windings for the DC rails on the PT. Maybe not as sexy as "dual mono" all the way back to dual power transformers... but likely more than adequate. Kenwood and hk both used this "twin power" approach on some of their mid-grade amplifiers back in the 70s and 80s.

    I can see only one bridge rectifier with a single X with dual secondaries .some old HK used the "Dual mono" power supply, much better than this one. and also many other companies like Sanyo plus series 55. Now they do not build them like they used to. :(
    Make it simple...Make it better!
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  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 34,913
    edited June 2010
    Speaking of dual power supplies and Kenwood, just happened to have the top off our KA-7100 (a dump find of some years back) tonight. This one has only one PT (as mentioned earlier) but two secondaries for the DC rails (i.e., dual mono back to the secondaries). Some of the older hks had two completely separate power transformers.

    KA7100toppish.jpg

    P6280009.jpg
    P6280010.jpg
    P6280008.jpg

    If you look at the photos, you can see the broken plastic coupler on the extended shaft for the speaker selector (at the amp's top left when viewed from the front). More to the point, you can see my long-ago, cheezy attempt at a fix (epoxy clamped with a cable tie, as I recall). It failed to work (I think the coupler is nylon; I was pretty well doomed from the start).
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  • lanchile
    lanchile Posts: 560
    edited June 2010
    Talking about old good staff, check this old Sanyo plus series amp.;)
    I had one of this fellas. it is a wonderful amp!
    Make it simple...Make it better!
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  • McLoki
    McLoki Posts: 5,231
    edited June 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    The only point for my posts about the Aleph and the articles I linked too is to show you can buy a high quality, lower power amp that sounds fantastic, will drive almost anything and it won't cost you an arm and a leg. It's more about design, parts quality and execution.

    Nothing more, nothing less

    YMMV

    H9

    Then again - maybe some of us have more to compensate for than others... :eek: :p;)
    Mains.............Polk LSi15 (Cherry)
    Center............Polk LSiC (Crossover upgraded)
    Surrounds.......Polk LSi7 (Gloss Black - wood sides removed and crossovers upgraded)
    Subwoofers.....SVS 25-31 CS+ and PC+ (both 20hz tune)
    Pre\Pro...........NAD T163 (Modded with LM4562 opamps)
    Amplifier.........Cinepro 3k6 (6-channel, 500wpc@4ohms)
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,396
    edited June 2010
    McLoki wrote: »
    Then again - maybe some of us have more to compensate for than others... :eek: :p;)

    And then some people are clueless and don't know a lot about this hobby beyond the standard drivel ;), in addition to your suggestion.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited June 2010
    Am I the only one who is beginning to sense a certain amount of Moderation Fatigue from some of our Veteran members? In the last few days there have been moments of unnecessary friction between guys that have been around here for years?

    And I thought...we were doing so well? You know I don't really see anything wrong with anything said above? So what's up? Not enough conflict on the site guys?

    Not really pointing any fingers. I enjoyed the articles Brock referenced and the internal shots of the Pass Aleph--am keen to learn a bit more about 'architectures'...

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • nduitch
    nduitch Posts: 316
    edited June 2010
    cnh wrote: »
    Am I the only one who is beginning to sense a certain amount of Moderation Fatigue from some of our Veteran members? In the last few days there have been moments of unnecessary friction between guys that have been around here for years?

    To relieve tension go here:
    http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87188&page=2
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited June 2010
    cnh wrote: »
    Am I the only one who is beginning to sense a certain amount of Moderation Fatigue from some of our Veteran members? In the last few days there have been moments of unnecessary friction between guys that have been around here for years?

    And I thought...we were doing so well? You know I don't really see anything wrong with anything said above? So what's up? Not enough conflict on the site guys?

    Not really pointing any fingers. I enjoyed the articles Brock referenced and the internal shots of the Pass Aleph--am keen to learn a bit more about 'architectures'...

    cnh

    Hey Bro, the way I'm reading it, it seems like good old fashioned ribbing rather than friction or conflict. JMHO!:)
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,396
    edited June 2010
    cnh wrote: »
    Am I the only one who is beginning to sense a certain amount of Moderation Fatigue from some of our Veteran members? In the last few days there have been moments of unnecessary friction between guys that have been around here for years?

    And I thought...we were doing so well? You know I don't really see anything wrong with anything said above? So what's up? Not enough conflict on the site guys?

    Not really pointing any fingers. I enjoyed the articles Brock referenced and the internal shots of the Pass Aleph--am keen to learn a bit more about 'architectures'...

    cnh

    Mild conflict usually can lead to great discussion. My comment was NOT directed toward any veteran members, FTR :)

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • madmax
    madmax Posts: 12,434
    edited June 2010
    cnh wrote: »
    Am I the only one who is beginning to sense a certain amount of Moderation Fatigue from some of our Veteran members? In the last few days there have been moments of unnecessary friction between guys that have been around here for years?
    cnh

    Those old farts are a bunch of loonies, friction is necessary.
    Vinyl, the final frontier...

    Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... :D
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,396
    edited July 2010
    This link is specifically for CHN, he wanted some more informative articles. Some of the graphs get a little out there if you don;t have an EE degree, but Nelson has a way of writing and explaining things that are easy to comprehend. So get the meat of the discussion and don;t worry too much about the technical aspects.

    http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/distortion/distortion.html
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited July 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    This link is specifically for CHN, he wanted some more informative articles. Some of the graphs get a little out there if you don;t have an EE degree, but Nelson has a way of writing and explaining things that are easy to comprehend. So get the meat of the discussion and don;t worry too much about the technical aspects.

    http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/distortion/distortion.html

    Thanks Brock,

    I'm definitely interested in this and will give this a serious read!

    cnh
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited July 2010
    heiney9 wrote: »
    This link is specifically for CHN, he wanted some more informative articles. Some of the graphs get a little out there if you don;t have an EE degree, but Nelson has a way of writing and explaining things that are easy to comprehend. So get the meat of the discussion and don;t worry too much about the technical aspects.

    http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/distortion/distortion.html

    Is that a new cable channel?:D
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,396
    edited July 2010
    Here are a couple more CNH,

    http://www.passlabs.com/pdfs/articles/sweet_spot.pdf

    http://www.passlabs.com/pdfs/articles/leaving_class_a.pdf

    http://www.passlabs.com/pdfs/articles/xa_paper.pdf

    http://www.passlabs.com/pdfs/articles/seclassa.pdf

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
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  • cnh
    cnh Posts: 13,284
    edited July 2010
    Thanks again...actually this is very interesting as I run an Adcom with SDAs, the original GFA-555...and will be probably thinking about upgrading the pre in a while to a GFP-715 or the even cleaner GFP-750 which would be (555/750) an all PASS system.

    cnh (no Joe, I'm not a channel yet...but one can always hope--lots of Ad money there---more gear!!)
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,136
    edited July 2010
    cnh wrote: »
    cnh (no Joe, I'm not a channel yet...but one can always hope--lots of Ad money there---more gear!!)

    Hahaha, I was just busting on Brock's typo of CHN!!!:D
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  • kappclark
    kappclark Posts: 136
    edited September 2011
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    Plenty of good sound out there that's not expensive. Plenty.

    Like wine snobbery, the most fun if finding stuff that's good and cheap.

    I picked up a parasound 50wpc off ebay ($75, had it professionally restored$250), and I just cannot believe the detail, dynamics etc...an improvement to my HK receiver, for sure. A vintage wine for me ! Listening to Harry Potter soundtrack now, and what a treat it is!
    *************************
    ** Bill Clark Windham, VT **
    *************************
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