Upgrading output caps on my Anthem Pre 2L

thsmith
thsmith Posts: 6,082
edited January 2010 in Electronics
I upgraded the output caps on my Anthem PRE 1L using V-Cap OIMP caps.

It was a very nice upgrade that made the Pre have a sweeter and deeper sound.

I have upgraded to an Anthem Pre 2L for the HT bypass and remote features.

I can honestly say that right now the Pre 1L with V-caps sounds better than the Pre 2L using the very same tubes.

I decided this time to use Mundorf Silver oil caps . I really like V-cap OIMP cap but since I have heard it I wanted to try something different.

The Pre 1L had REL caps and Pre 2L has Solen caps. Personally I think the RELs sound better than the SOlens and they have to go.

Following Chris V's recommendation of going with 1uf vs 2uf that Pre's came with because on knowing my AMPs input impedance I will be going with 1uf on the Mundorfs.

This should give me a good feel how the V-Cap and Mundorf compare. I would love to own a pair of the V-Cap TFTFs but at 4Xs the cost I need to rethink that for awhile.

ANyway, I will post some pics and initial and post burn in observations.
Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
Post edited by thsmith on
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Comments

  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    SIO's sound ok in electronics, they're over rated in speakers.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • NJPOLKER
    NJPOLKER Posts: 3,475
    edited January 2010
    How about these?????

    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=170&products_id=8366
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    I like them, but they won't fit in most equipment. In electronics, the ESA series has been hit or miss for me, in some applications they sound great, in others blah. Sorry for the derail.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • NJPOLKER
    NJPOLKER Posts: 3,475
    edited January 2010
    I bet they will fit in the Anthem Pre-2L. As I remember there is some space around the area they reside in.
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    NJPOLKER wrote: »
    How about these?????

    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=170&products_id=8366

    May have to try those but I have already ordered the Mundorfs. I have Silver and Golds in the AMP 1 and like them. SOme of the reviews I read had the Silver oils rated higher than the Silver Golds.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • NJPOLKER
    NJPOLKER Posts: 3,475
    edited January 2010
    It was just a thought. I was going with Mundorf Silver/oils but could not get 2uF's and the same thing with the Big Blue's.
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  • dpowell
    dpowell Posts: 3,081
    edited January 2010
    If you don't mind, where did you source the 2L and what did you end up paying for it? New/used? I'm interested to see what tube config you end up with. Saving my $$ right now to take the step into a tubed pre......
    ____________________________________________________________

    polkaudio Fully Modded SDA SRS 1.2TLs + Dreadnaught, LSiM706c, 4 X Polk Surrounds + 4 X ATMOS, SVS PB13 Ultra X 2, McIntosh C2300, Marantz AV7704, Bob Carver Crimson Beauty 350 Tube Mono Blocks, Carver Sunfire Signature Cinema Grande 400x5, ADCOM GFA 7807, Panasonic UB420, Sim Audio Moon 380D DAC, EPSON Pro Cinema 6050
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    dpowell wrote: »
    If you don't mind, where did you source the 2L and what did you end up paying for it? New/used? I'm interested to see what tube config you end up with. Saving my $$ right now to take the step into a tubed pre......

    Asking me ? If so shoot me a PM but I posted a Wanted on Audiogon and guy reached out to me. One owner with boxes.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    NJPOLKER wrote: »
    It was just a thought. I was going with Mundorf Silver/oils but could not get 2uF's and the same thing with the Big Blue's.

    You know if your AMPs input impedance is something greater than 40Kohms you can use a 1uf cap.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,576
    edited January 2010
    I'd skip the resale caveat and drop a 2uf in it. I like Chris but he doesn't keep gear either.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
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  • NJPOLKER
    NJPOLKER Posts: 3,475
    edited January 2010
    Its 50,000 ohms and I will stay with the 2uF's, I think. As I remember I had a conversation with someone at Sonic Frontiers/Anthem and he said use 2uF caps.
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    NJPOLKER wrote: »
    Its 50,000 ohms and I will stay with the 2uF's, I think. As I remember I had a conversation with someone at Sonic Frontiers/Anthem and he said use 2uF caps.

    Understand. My Amp's input impedance is 100Kohms.

    Here is how Chris explained it me

    "You could easily save yourself some dough and put in a 1 uF cap, if feeding into a 100K Ohm load. That would give a -3db corner frequency of
    1.59 Hz. I typically recommend using a -3db frequency of 1/10th the desired actual LF response, in order to account for non-linearities running at the ragged edge of the cap's LF limit. I also recommend using the smallest cap possible to obtain this frequency, since less material will be in the signal path = better transparency vs. a larger value. Note that most manufacturers use much larger value caps because they do not know what their customers amp impedances are, and must use a value that will universally "work" with most fot he equipment out there. You have the luxury of knowing in advance what your approximate input impedance is, and therefore can tweak accordingly. "
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • dorokusai
    dorokusai Posts: 25,576
    edited January 2010
    I thought you explained that pretty clearly the first time but maybe someone missed it. I'd still use a 2uf since I don't keep much.
    CTC BBQ Amplifier, Sonic Frontiers Line3 Pre-Amplifier and Wadia 581 SACD player. Speakers? Always changing but for now, Mission Argonauts I picked up for $50 bucks, mint.
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    Not my finest work but the leads on the Mundorf Silver oil caps were much larger than the holes in the circuit board so I had to wrap and solder some smaller solid copper wire on the Mundorfs to fit in the circuit board. The mundorfs are also much larger than the Solens requiring them to be placed away from the original locations.

    I can tell an immediate improvement over those damn French Solens. The Mundorfs are hot glued onto the circuit board for stability.

    Now for some burn in time.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    BTW, was there a better way to have handled the larger cap lead situation ?
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    I would have attempted to install the S/O's in the same location as the Solens and bent the leads underneath the cap for a neater install and shorter leads.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    Thanks Face for confirming what is bothering me about the install. I also found some leads from V-caps left overs that I can use and be a closer match to the Mundorf leads..

    Going back in !
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2010
    Lasareath wrote: »
    Just solder aligator clips to the board and you try as many caps as you want to very easily!
    Have you seen my crossovers? :D
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    OK, much better. Leads are under the cap and cap is hot glued to PCB

    The spot on the left cap is where I dropped solder on it.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited January 2010
    :)Put the top cover back on and start using it.;)
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    Good morning George, she has been on all night and sounding sweet.

    I am so glad to have those Solens out.

    Up until now the Pre 1L sounded better but it did have V-caps.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited January 2010
    Good to hear,, IIRC you are pumping 1C's with an Anthem amp 1,currently ,,,yes? You still running the EI's?
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    Yep still running the hot rodded 1Cs, Anthem AMP 1 with Ei 6ca7s, Sylvania 5751 BP 3 mica and a pair of Brimar 12au7 varient.

    The pre is running 6922 RCA (Siemens)

    The 1Cs are the only constant in my system for the year but I think the AMP 1 and 2L will be there for a while too.

    Phono stage and TT will be getting some focus now.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • NJPOLKER
    NJPOLKER Posts: 3,475
    edited January 2010
    How about tube dampers?

    http://herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/

    Brent Jessee also sells real nice ones.

    http://www.audiotubes.com/
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    They seem to be something people believe in but I am not hearing anything that would make me go out spend a couple of hundred bucks on them to do my Pre and Amp.

    I have a friend that swears by Herbies and he is always moving them up and down to get the sound right:confused:

    Jeese's Brass rings look interesting though, Thanks for pointing those out.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
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  • lanchile
    lanchile Posts: 560
    edited January 2010
    thsmith wrote: »
    OK, much better. Leads are under the cap and cap is hot glued to PCB

    The spot on the left cap is where I dropped solder on it.

    Make sure you "remove" that drop of solder on top of that cap (it can get loose and fry some components). Better safe than sorry!.;)
    Make it simple...Make it better!
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  • thsmith
    thsmith Posts: 6,082
    edited January 2010
    Yep, it is removed. When I peeled it off it took a piece of the plastic cover off the cap.
    Speakers: SDA-1C (most all the goodies)
    Preamp: Joule Electra LA-150 MKII SE
    Amp: Wright WPA 50-50 EAT KT88s
    Analog: Marantz TT-15S1 MBS Glider SL| Wright WPP100C Amperex BB 6er5 and 7316 & WPM-100 SUT
    Digital: Mac mini 2.3GHz dual-core i5 8g RAM 1.5 TB HDD Music Server Amarra (memory play) - USB - W4S DAC 2
    Cables: Mits S3 IC and Spk cables| PS Audio PCs
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter