Opamp questions/recos - DIP vs. DIP adapter

adam2434
adam2434 Posts: 995
edited January 2010 in DIY, Mods & Tweaks
OK, so I just got a Music Hall DAC and I’m thinking about rolling some opamps since the stock ones are socketed. I’m new to opamp swaps, so DIP vs. SMT (surface mount) vs. DIP adapter (brown dog) is a bit unclear to me at this point.

The stock opamps are (2) OPA2134PA and (1) OPA2604AP. I’ve opened the case and they are socketed, so I believe they must be the DIP version and are simply plugged into the sockets (no solder). Does that sound right?

I’m potentially looking at AD8620’s to replace the above, but I’m open to other options.

Here’s where I’m unclear:

From what I’ve read so far, the AD8620 is only available as a SMT (surface mount). Therefore it needs to be mounted to a DIP adapter in order to use a socket. However, it appears as though the pin/lead spacing of an AD8620 on a DIP adapter (brown dog) is farther apart vs. the socket and DIP style opamps (stock). Does that mean that the pins/leads on an AD8620 DIP adapter need to be bent and manipulated to go into the existing socket?

Maybe I’m not looking at this right – are the DIP style opamps much larger than the SMT style, meaning that the pin/lead spacing of a SMT opamp on a DIP adapter is the same as the pin/lead spacing of a DIP style opamp?

I’m also open to other upgrade options to the stock OPA2134PA and OPA2604AP. Are there any good DIP style options (would not require DIP adapters)?

Thanks,

Adam
5.1 and 2.0 ch Basement Media Room: Outlaw 975/Emotiva DC-1/Rotel RB-1582 MKII/Rotel RB-1552/Audiosource Amp 3/Polk LS90, CS400i, FX500i/Outlaw X-12, LFM-1/JVD DLA-HD250/Da-Lite 100" HCCV/Sony ES BDP/Sonos Connect. DC-1/RB-1582 MKII/Sonos Connect also feed Polk 7C in garage or Dayton IO655 on patio.
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  • McLoki
    McLoki Posts: 5,231
    edited January 2010
    Might want to consider the LM4562 as well. (it is an SMT chip) I had great luck with it in my NAD T163.
    Mains.............Polk LSi15 (Cherry)
    Center............Polk LSiC (Crossover upgraded)
    Surrounds.......Polk LSi7 (Gloss Black - wood sides removed and crossovers upgraded)
    Subwoofers.....SVS 25-31 CS+ and PC+ (both 20hz tune)
    Pre\Pro...........NAD T163 (Modded with LM4562 opamps)
    Amplifier.........Cinepro 3k6 (6-channel, 500wpc@4ohms)
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited January 2010
    adam2434 wrote: »
    OK, so I just got a Music Hall DAC and I’m thinking about rolling some opamps since the stock ones are socketed. I’m new to opamp swaps, so DIP vs. SMT (surface mount) vs. DIP adapter (brown dog) is a bit unclear to me at this point.

    The DIP (Dual Inline Package) has legs on both sides of the chip. It's the through hole solder or socket type version. BrownDog makes op-amps adapters and specialized type of op-amps and circuit boards to retrofit the existing op-amps with better flavor of op-amps (could be using DIP or SIP or TO-8 metal can type or SMD as they see fit).

    SMT stands for surface mount technology and SMD is surface mount devices so SMD is the electronics parts that is soldered on the PC board using SMT. Therefore, you need to refer the term "SMD" for the electronics parts.

    The stock opamps are (2) OPA2134PA and (1) OPA2604AP. I’ve opened the case and they are socketed, so I believe they must be the DIP version and are simply plugged into the sockets (no solder). Does that sound right?

    If you see they are socketed and have legs on both sides, they are DIP version.

    I’m potentially looking at AD8620’s to replace the above, but I’m open to other options.

    Here’s where I’m unclear:

    From what I’ve read so far, the AD8620 is only available as a SMT (surface mount). Therefore it needs to be mounted to a DIP adapter in order to use a socket. However, it appears as though the pin/lead spacing of an AD8620 on a DIP adapter (brown dog) is farther apart vs. the socket and DIP style opamps (stock). Does that mean that the pins/leads on an AD8620 DIP adapter need to be bent and manipulated to go into the existing socket?

    If you buy Browndog adapter with AD8620s already mounted on them, it's a retrofit part and it should plug right into your DIP8 socket.

    Maybe I’m not looking at this right – are the DIP style opamps much larger than the SMT style, meaning that the pin/lead spacing of a SMT opamp on a DIP adapter is the same as the pin/lead spacing of a DIP style opamp?

    I’m also open to other upgrade options to the stock OPA2134PA and OPA2604AP. Are there any good DIP style options (would not require DIP adapters)?

    Thanks,

    Adam

    Yes, DIP or solder (through hole type devices) in general have physically larger size than their SMD counterparts. But it's not always the case with every electronics parts.

    There are lots of op-amps expert on the Net and on Club Polk. I hope they'll chime in for you.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • adam2434
    adam2434 Posts: 995
    edited January 2010
    McLoki, thanks for the reco. Do recall what stock opamp you replaced and where you purchased the LM4562? Also, what were the sonic improvements?

    A quick search shows that the LM4562 is available in a DIP version, so should drop right into the existing sockets. I'll do some research on its electrical characteristics vs. the stock OPA2134 and OPA2604. I did read where someone replaced their OPA2134 with LM4562, so it seems like this could be a good option. I know that dropping in higher speed opamps can create some oscillation issues, so I'll need to read-up a bit.

    Megasat16, thanks for the very thorough and informative reply.
    5.1 and 2.0 ch Basement Media Room: Outlaw 975/Emotiva DC-1/Rotel RB-1582 MKII/Rotel RB-1552/Audiosource Amp 3/Polk LS90, CS400i, FX500i/Outlaw X-12, LFM-1/JVD DLA-HD250/Da-Lite 100" HCCV/Sony ES BDP/Sonos Connect. DC-1/RB-1582 MKII/Sonos Connect also feed Polk 7C in garage or Dayton IO655 on patio.
    2.1 ch Basement Gym: Denon AVR-2807/Klipsch Forte I or NHT SB2/JBL SUB 550P x 2/Chromecast Audio.
    2.0 ch Living Room: Rotel RX-1052/Emotiva DC-1/Klipsch RF-7 III/Sony ES BDP/LG 65" LED.
    2.0 ch Semi-portable: Klipsch Powergate/NHT SB3/Chromecast Audio.
    Kitchen: Sonos Play5.
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  • McLoki
    McLoki Posts: 5,231
    edited January 2010
    adam2434 wrote: »
    McLoki, thanks for the reco. Do recall what stock opamp you replaced and where you purchased the LM4562? Also, what were the sonic improvements?

    This should explain most of it.

    To directly answer your questions though... I replaced the NJM5332M chips. I thought about using the AD823 chip, but went with the LM4562 in the end.

    Here is a quote from the thread above after I put in the new opamps.....
    The opamps that I used are truely incredible. The level of detail I have now is huge. I notice small details that I could not hear before, also more sounds seem to be made up of a bunch of small sounds rather than 1 big one. (think of a mosaic painting - I just took a few steps closer to it so I can see the inividual strokes rather than just seeing the entire finished picture.)

    One down side to the level of detail that I am geting now is that I notice anytime the soundman slips and lets any sound in a movie distort. Basically the problems come through just as clearly as the other sounds. They actually draw more attention to themselves, since the problems just sound wrong as opposed to part of the scene. Based on this - I do not plan to mod further for fear of it becoming "to much of a good thing".

    Michael

    Edit - Forgot to mention where you can get them.... Digikey carries them.
    Mains.............Polk LSi15 (Cherry)
    Center............Polk LSiC (Crossover upgraded)
    Surrounds.......Polk LSi7 (Gloss Black - wood sides removed and crossovers upgraded)
    Subwoofers.....SVS 25-31 CS+ and PC+ (both 20hz tune)
    Pre\Pro...........NAD T163 (Modded with LM4562 opamps)
    Amplifier.........Cinepro 3k6 (6-channel, 500wpc@4ohms)
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  • fbm211
    fbm211 Posts: 1,488
    edited January 2010
    OPA 627s like george used to replace his Adcom GDA-600 stock opamps are highly regarded.Do you need dual or single.
    SDA-2BTL with custom IC
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  • adam2434
    adam2434 Posts: 995
    edited January 2010
    The stock opamps are all dual, so I would need 3 of the '2x 627s on DIP adapters' which would cost around $150 - more than I want to spend right now.

    After more research today it appears that the stock OPA2134 and OPA2604 are fairly well regarded.

    I know some folks have have dropped Bursons into the DAC too, but those are $90 each, so way more than I want to spend now.
    5.1 and 2.0 ch Basement Media Room: Outlaw 975/Emotiva DC-1/Rotel RB-1582 MKII/Rotel RB-1552/Audiosource Amp 3/Polk LS90, CS400i, FX500i/Outlaw X-12, LFM-1/JVD DLA-HD250/Da-Lite 100" HCCV/Sony ES BDP/Sonos Connect. DC-1/RB-1582 MKII/Sonos Connect also feed Polk 7C in garage or Dayton IO655 on patio.
    2.1 ch Basement Gym: Denon AVR-2807/Klipsch Forte I or NHT SB2/JBL SUB 550P x 2/Chromecast Audio.
    2.0 ch Living Room: Rotel RX-1052/Emotiva DC-1/Klipsch RF-7 III/Sony ES BDP/LG 65" LED.
    2.0 ch Semi-portable: Klipsch Powergate/NHT SB3/Chromecast Audio.
    Kitchen: Sonos Play5.
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