Tube Buffers; Yaqin CD-1 & Musical Fidelity X-10v3

Jetmaker737 · September 2009

FYI... Decided to go with the Yaqin for now and picked this up on the Gon... should be fun!

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?accstwek&1258579706&/Yaqin-CD2-Tube-Buffer-w/extras

Can anyone comment on the included tubes? (Mullard CV4010, Sylvania 6AK5, RCA Command 5654)

inspiredsports · September 2009

Jetmaker737 wrote: »

FYI... Decided to go with the Yaqin for now and picked this up on the Gon... should be fun!

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?accstwek&1258579706&/Yaqin-CD2-Tube-Buffer-w/extras

Can anyone comment on the included tubes? (Mullard CV4010, Sylvania 6AK5, RCA Command 5654)

Someone else will know those specific tubes better, but that is a very good score with 3 extra pairs of tubes included for that price.

heiney9 · September 2009

The RCA Commands should be fantastic. They are in other variants.

Systems · September 2009

heiney9 wrote: »

The RCA Commands should be fantastic.

Your Mosfet's are going to be getting jealous.:D

Systems · September 2009

inspiredsports wrote: »

I am trusting just one post I read that a decent quality 33uf electrolytic is a good choice and if 3 X 11uf 200VDC Sonicaps would work as well as the 33uf/400VDC Epcos he used.

IMO SoniCaps are overkill for use in what appears to be the PS filtering section.They will certainly work (assuming you can find room for them in the chassis)but would likely prove to be more benificial and cost effective if used for input/output coupling.

inspiredsports · September 2009

GV#27 wrote: »

IMO SoniCaps are overkill for use in what appears to be the PS filtering section.They will certainly work (assuming you can find room for them in the chassis)but would likely prove to be more beneficial and cost effective if used for input/output coupling.

Yep. I just today was able to get in touch with the guy who pioneered that tweak.

He ended up:
--- removing the electrolytic cap he installed tor PS filtering
--- bypassing the existing electrolytic caps with high grade polypropylene caps
--- replacing all of the existing polypropylene caps with a better grade poly caps

I don't have the cap values from him yet, but he said it made the 2 tube CD-2 he is using dramatically better.

Systems · September 2009

inspiredsports wrote: »

.

He ended up:
--- removing the electrolytic cap he installed tor PS filtering
--- bypassing the existing electrolytic caps with high grade polypropylene caps
--- replacing all of the existing polypropylene caps with a better grade poly caps

Yeah thats a more sensible approach to modding it.

I don't have the cap values from him yet, but he said it made the 2 tube CD-2 he is using dramatically better.

You should be able to read the values printed on the body of the caps(the yellow ones in the pic).Those appear to be the coupling caps thus the ones you will want to replace with premium poly's.

inspiredsports · September 2009

GV#27 wrote: »

Yeah thats a more sensible approach to modding it.

You should be able to read the values printed on the body of the caps(the yellow ones in the pic).Those appear to be the coupling caps thus the ones you will want to replace with premium poly's.

The image above is the 2-tube CD-2 version.

My single tube CD-1 image is similar and below. I've been unable to get a schematic for it and the markings on the blue caps are not visible without de-soldering and removing for inspection so I'm trying to get the details from someone who had already done it.

I don't really want mine de-soldered and out of commission while I order and wait for parts.

polkanddie · October 2009

Keiko wrote: »

Dawg...Just a heads-up. The GF B283 is a Yaqin, it's just been re-badged. I'm sure your's will be shipped with the crappy Chinese 6J1 tubes. I've only rolled a couple with mine. Some Raytheon 6AK5W's and some Mullard M8100's. I had read the M8100 is one of the best sounding tubes for this buffer. I can highly recommend them, but they are a little difficult to find. The 6AK5, 5654 and CV4010 (NOS Sylvania Gold Brand, Raytheon, Mullard and Amperex) are good variants for this from what I've researched. Here's a link to an ebay seller where I got my Raytheons from. Not as good as the Mullard's, but a nice sounding tube nonetheless.

http://cgi.ebay.com/PAIR-OF-MATCHED-JAN-6AK5W-TUBES_W0QQitemZ160117790359QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item2547c39697&_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116

Have fun!

I just bought the same b283 today, But my tubes say rk-d-sda. The guy told me they were british made and were much better than the 6j1's that came with it? should I just get different ones?

I love mine to death. it just brings my stereo to life.

inspiredsports · October 2009

polkanddie wrote: »

. . . my tubes say rk-d-sda . . .

Wow, "SDA" tubes! I wonder if Matt Polk designed them

You probably should give them a good listen, but trust Keiko's replacement list if you are interested in tube rolling.

polkanddie · October 2009

Haha, yea Idk, That would be kindof cool. Im really looking into getting one for my center now. I was thinking of the yaqin cd2. saw one on ebay for $55. I shall be rollin soon.

Dawgfish · October 2009

polkanddie wrote: »

I just bought the same b283 today, But my tubes say rk-d-sda. The guy told me they were british made and were much better than the 6j1's that came with it? should I just get different ones?

I love mine to death. it just brings my stereo to life.

I would give them a listen like inspired sports has suggested. I am not familiar with the rk-d-sda tubes. I can say the Mullard 8100 sound great on this though. The stock 6J1s don't sound bad either. I'm still breaking in the 8100s, so I'll give a review when I'm done with the break-in process. So far so good though.

reeltrouble1 · October 2009

This is a very nice review, as known.................

Tubes Rule. Thanks for taking the time to demonstrate how a tube buffer can add to the enjoyment of a system.

RT1

inspiredsports · October 2009

Thanks. Before trying for myself, I simply never would have believed the addition of one or two little tubes could make such an improvement in the overall listening experience. It's been enjoyable and I still have a couple of other listening ideas.

For one, I want to place the buffers between a turntable and the "phono in" on my preamp.

I've been holding off as I have some new power cables and a duplex outlet that need to season for a few more days before listening critically again.

inspiredsports · October 2009

I've already done a lot of experimenting, but as still a relative newb to tube gear, I don't know much about placement and isolation.

My buffers are currently stacked on top of a CD player that sits on a very solid table on a carpeted below grade concrete floor between the speakers.

The Musical Fidelity tubes have no additional damping, and the single 6922 in the Yaquin sports a Herbie's damper that I have found to keep everything tighter at higher sound pressure levels (90 or more db at the center of the 22'W X 24'D X 8'H space).

My next acquisition is going to be VTI or similar rack that I can fill with lead shot, but I'm still curious if members have experimented with tips/ tricks/ placement of tube gear to minimize sonic disturbances.

Jetmaker737 · October 2009

A report on my experiences so far. Be warned... I'm a newb! My config is an Onkyo 805 as pre into an emo RPA-2 then into my Lsi-15's. This is the only config I've had since I've only been at this hobby for about a year. I added the Yaqin with the RCA Commands between my source, an Oppo 980H, and my Oinker.

With the 805 I had what was to me a pretty decent sound stage with instruments clearly separated and vocals fairly tightly centered. What I noticed after adding the Yaqin was that my old soundstage was flat and at the plane of the speakers, and now it was much more 3 dimensional with the vocals almost in my face.

However, I also noticed that the instrument locations, while remaining pretty much the same location, maybe more widely spaced, occupy a bigger area. I'm not sure yet if this is a good or bad thing. Need to listen to it for awhile.

On the plus side definitely is the more liquid mids and highs I get with the Yaqin. Smoother and richer as you tube guys have noted. So far I'm really happy with the Yaqin and look forward to rolling in some of the other tubes I got. Thanks Inspired for starting this thread and doing such a great review!

reeltrouble1 · October 2009

Inspired,

I personally do not think stacking the buffers on a transport is necessarily the best idea. It is spinning and vibrating and so on, the MF will benefit from some isolation, vibrapods or what have you, just depends on how much you want to spend and available rack space.

RT1

inspiredsports · October 2009

reeltrouble1 wrote: »

Inspired,

I personally do not think stacking the buffers on a transport is necessarily the best idea. It is spinning and vibrating and so on, the MF will benefit from some isolation, vibrapods or what have you, just depends on how much you want to spend and available rack space.

RT1

Thanks! I think you are absolutely right and I'm going to figure out a way to better isolate the buffers.

I do use those 2" x 2" x 3/4" rubber/cork/rubber laminated pads between components whenever I stack them, but I doubt if they are 100% effective.

The thing I most wonder about is if sound waves don't come into play when listening at higher volumes. I'm curious where the best location for tubes in relation to the speakers might be.

reeltrouble1 · October 2009

many have had success in moving the rack to a wall perpendicular to the front speakers past the first reflection point, the SPL does effect the rack, the gear, you, your walls on to infinity, its just pretty much what you like, what you can do with the room and then trial and error.

those pads you using are pretty good I gave some to a member who's player was skipping at volume and they fixed things just fine, there is a whole special cooridor in the Rabbit Hole for isolation products, those pads you have and an audio rack are a good start then just knock yourself with everything else available, lots of guys here use dynamat inside the components to dampen vibration.

RT1

inspiredsports · October 2009

I'm going to take your hint and study up on the perpendicular wall location. By sheer coincidence I'm doing that with one of my turntables as there just happened to be some heavy iron brackets cemented right into the brick basement wall when we moved here. They lent themselves to the building of a very sturdy shelf.

I think ultimately the majority of my gear will have to go between the speakers. The last tweak to complete my first cycle of upgrades will be a VTI (or similar) rack filled with lead shot. (I've already negotiated with my wife for that to be what she and the kids will be giving me at Christmas, and I may even be allowed to order for good before behavior before then

)

hearingimpared · October 2009

inspiredsports wrote: »

I've already done a lot of experimenting, but as still a relative newb to tube gear, I don't know much about placement and isolation.

My buffers are currently stacked on top of a CD player that sits on a very solid table on a carpeted below grade concrete floor between the speakers.

The Musical Fidelity tubes have no additional damping, and the single 6922 in the Yaquin sports a Herbie's damper that I have found to keep everything tighter at higher sound pressure levels (90 or more db at the center of the 22'W X 24'D X 8'H space).

My next acquisition is going to be VTI or similar rack that I can fill with lead shot, but I'm still curious if members have experimented with tips/ tricks/ placement of tube gear to minimize sonic disturbances.

Greg, I gave you four Isol-Pads to put under the MF tube buffer for isolation.

inspiredsports · October 2009

hearingimpared wrote: »

Greg, I gave you four Isol-Pads to put under the MF tube buffer for isolation.

Absolutely! I don't remember where I found the source online, but I had 24 of them here before the 4 you sent arrived, and I use then on any component with moving parts or tubes inside

.

I'm not having any problems, just over-thinking it like I do everything else to make sure I've come up with the best solution I can afford with the parts on hand.

inspiredsports · October 2009

I've upped the ante with a mod to the power supply of the Yaqin CD1 Tube Buffer after finding a thread at http://www.sound-thinking.org/index.php?showtopic=4002&st=60&#entry65864

The mod called for the addition of two bypass caps, and I chose to use Mundorf 800 VDC Dielectric Polypropylene 0.1UF M-Cap Supreme's.

I've got to say that after just a couple of CD sides I'm blown away by the improvement

, but will reserve a full critique until I get about 100 hours of use on the unit.

Updating the total Yaqin package price as currently outfitted, here's where we are:
--- Yaqin CD1 Tube Buffer @ $117.00 USD delivered
--- Upgrade: 2 Each 0.1uf 800VDC Mundorf M-Cap Supreme Dielectric Polypropylene Capacitors @ $30.30 USD delivered
--- NOS Amperex Holland 6DJ8/ECC88 Vacuum Tube @ $15.98 USD delivered (yes, I stole this $100+ tube)
--- Herbies Audio UltraSonic 9 Tube Damper @ $20.28 USD delivered
--- 5' 15A Shunyata Diamondback Platinum Power Cord @ $118.50 USD delivered (1/2 price musicdirect.com summer sale)
TOTAL: $302.06 USD delivered

The sound for this investment amount is absolutely stellar, and sure to improve as the mod burns in . . . more later. --- gw

kcoc321 · October 2009

What is a decent $$ for a Musical FidelityX-10v3, used?
(sorry I dont know what tubes)

inspiredsports · October 2009

kcoc321 wrote: »

What is a decent $$ for a Musical Fidelity X-10v3, used? (sorry I dont know what tubes)

I've been watching these constantly on eBay since purchasing mine and they always seem to settle in the $190-$210 USD range delivered anywhere in the US. Just search eBay for "Musical Fidelity" and you will generally find a couple for sale at any given time.

Also, a concern was that the tubes used in the X-10v3 were in short supply in the rare event the originals failed. I've just just found "tubetoons" on eBay who has NOS JAN Phillips 6112 tubes (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120469491964&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT) for under $20 per pair delivered. You can't "roll" the tubes in the X-10v3 in the conventional sense as they are soldered in.

kcoc321 · October 2009

inspiredsports wrote: »

I've been watching these constantly on eBay since purchasing mine and they always seem to settle in the $190-$210 USD range delivered anywhere in the US. Just search eBay for "Musical Fidelity" and you will generally find a couple for sale at any given time.

Also, a concern was that the tubes used in the X-10v3 were in short supply in the rare event the originals failed. I've just just found "tubetoons" on eBay who has NOS JAN Phillips 6112 tubes (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120469491964&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT) for under $20 per pair delivered. You can't "roll" the tubes in the X-10v3 in the conventional sense as they are soldered in.

Thanks...I have a local here selling one for $150...we'll see if he calls me back...:)

Conradicles · December 2009

Thank you Greg for your work on this thread. Just read most of it because I purchased a Yaqin from Notasuv that will arrive soon. Hope my small journey into tubes will be as rewarding as yours. Again, thanks!
Eric.

inspiredsports · December 2009

My sickness increases.

I've just sent the Musical Fidelity X-10v3 off to Rock Grotto in Scotland (the inventor/manufacturer of the Little Pinkie Power Supply Unit) where a new set of NOS 6112 tubes that I picked up will be installed, and where the owner will perform the ultimate X10 upgrade by installing . . .

http://www.rock-grotto.co.uk/x10v3mods.htm

That will bring the X10 up to the ultimate state of it's existence.

Moving along, I just purchased my first full tube preamplifier, the old standby Dynaco PAS-3 that uses 4 12AX7's for $160 delivered. The unit has a strong matched quad of Telefunkens and the sound is amazingly good for an all stock component that is pushing 70 years old!

I figured this component was a good starting point to test my improving soldering skills before moving on to a "real" tube preamp, although some have called it a "giant killer" and I can see (hear

) why.

I'm currently using the Yaqin between my CD player and the Dynaco PAS-3 where it still adds a nice enhancement even over and above the sweetness of the tube preamp.

I have been studying McIntosh tubed preamps and have a my eyes on the C-20 and C-22 models when funds allow. I'm also tempted by the more affordable Conrad Johnson CJ PV-7. I love the sound of 12AX7 tubes and have a matched quad of Mullard Blackburn's on the way that will work in any of these 4 preamps no matter what I land upon.

Jetmaker737 · December 2009

Yikes dude... you are sick! Where are you gonna stick the MF when it comes back?

I had a Yaqin in line with my CDP (thanks to this thread) and loved it! I loved it so much I picked up a Jolida JD-100 CDP which uses 12AX7's. I threw some Sovtek LPS's in there and it's awesome. I sold the yaqin on A-gon. It also went with some Mullards as well as some RCA commands.

Contradicles - If your experience is like mine you'll find more bang for your Yaqin buck by putting it in line with your CDP as opposed to your Pre and amp.

inspiredsports · December 2009

Conradicles wrote: »

Thank you Greg for your work on this thread. Just read most of it because I purchased a Yaqin from Notasuv that will arrive soon. Hope my small journey into tubes will be as rewarding as yours. Again, thanks!
Eric.

That was a great deal with the upgraded tubes!

Tube Buffers; Yaqin CD-1 & Musical Fidelity X-10v3

Comments