How musical are the Monitor 60's

Dan2036

I have the Monitor 60's hooked up in my 5.1 setup but end up primarily using them for music. In anyones opinion are these speakers very good for music or just movies ? Any thoughts ?

Dan2036

Unfortunately my ears have only really heard these speakers and have no experience with anything better, i'm just wondering in others opinions are these speakers considered musical, or mostly home theater speakers.

adabro

I liked them for both - I upgraded to RTi A9's after 3 years, but I kept them as my surrounds..

maximillian

"Very good" depends on how much money you want to spend. There is always something better, it's just more money. Well, unless you buy Bose.

If you really don't want to spend more money then just be satisfied with what you have. Speakers aren't the only way to spend money either. There is always better electronics, better interconnects, room treatments, and other gear.

If you seriously want to move forward then probably the best advice is the following:
1) Don't make impulse buys.
2) Try to listen to some good setups. Go to higher end music stores. Fry's carries the LSi line but may not be properly setup. When comparing try to bring the same music (CD's, not MP3's) so you become familiar with how it should sound. Make sure to pick something that is recorded well, has a lot of detail, depth of soundstage, layered sound, etc.
3) Do your research. The search button on this forum is a good place to start. You can also ask more specific questions comparing speaker A to speaker B. Your initial question in this thread is rather broad.
4) Buy used if you are unsure. It can save you some money.
5) See if there is anyone local that will allow you to come over for a listen.
6) Don't forget vintage gear. Some people prefer vintage Polks over the newer stuff.
7) I am partial to Polk speakers (naturally), but many people own and like gear from other companies.

Good luck.
Polk speakers are not the end of the line in terms of audio quality. They have great sound for their price. Again, you can always spend more.

Dan2036

Thanks for your answers guys, to be more specific i was looking at some Monitor 10B or something vintage cause i'm not really looking to spend that much. In comparison to what i have now would the old monitors be a huge step up in sound ?

MANSKITO

let me help you out, get a good pair of head phones. Was in the same boat as you (have monitor 60s and no there not that musical,Great for the money but not that good)

If you looking to get the best price/performance ratio there is on planet earth head phones are the way too do it.

For example my head phones coast me $100 brand new. They blow my monitor 60s away like its not even close.They remind me of speakers in say the 500-800 range. I am actually so impressed by there price/performance ratio that i m currently saving to buy some rather high end ones.

The reason for this is 2 fold, number one head phones pretty much remove any colorations that your listening environment generates(think windows rattling,poor room acoustics etc..) It sounds like your listening in a dedicated acoustically treated room. And just as important head phones are recreating sound on a MUCH smaller scale there for its correspondingly easier. We are talking maybe an order of magnitude smaller and there for that much easier.

All you really need for head phones to sound great is a nice source and pre-amp or head phone amp. Pretty much if your on a budget and serious about audio your best bet is some nice "cans".

I can not stress how amazed I am at the price/performance ratio of head phones. To put it another way I have heard speakers that coast more then I could ever hope to have in my bank account for many years to come and before I gave my first pair of head phones a listen I was resigned to basically settle for sound that was not even close to Hi-fi in nature (the sound that comes out of the monitor 60s) but now my out look has changed drastically to the point where I almost regret buying my speakers and the gear to drive them.

If you can live with having to wear head phones then forget about buying used speakers and trying to strike gold. Do you self a favor and save maybe 100-300 cash money and buy the best head phones you can. The sound that will come out of them will literally blow you away and make you feel like you just cheated the industry out of hundreds if not thousands of dollars. The price/performance ratio is that high. Trust me I have heard speakers from quite a few brands at pretty much every price point from entry level to high end.

NewHTguy

Been thinking about trying a pair of headphones, if for no other reason than being abe to enjoy my cds when the rest of the world is sleeping. Really thinking now...

MANSKITO

NewHTguy wrote: »

Been thinking about trying a pair of headphones, if for no other reason than being abe to enjoy my cds when the rest of the world is sleeping. Really thinking now...

Go for it man no matter what you spend you will be MORE then impressed by what you get for the money.

Dan2036

I did get a pretty good pair of in ear headphones (Klipsch Image S4) but i was geared more towards speakers for the purpose of multi person listening, plus i like it when it shakes the house a bit. As far as budget musical speakers does anyone have any suggestions ? It can be used.

Ron Temple

10Bs are a great place to start and yes, they'll be a huge improvement over M60s.

MANSKITO

Dan2036 wrote: »

I did get a pretty good pair of in ear headphones (Klipsch Image S4) but i was geared more towards speakers for the purpose of multi person listening, plus i like it when it shakes the house a bit. As far as budget musical speakers does anyone have any suggestions ? It can be used.

Well then thats much harder to suggest. Polk's actually rather good when it comes to speakers for price/performance.(why I bought my monitor 60s)

If it was me and i could do it over again, I would be looking for a good pair of book shelfs if i was on a budget and didn't want to buy head phones. And maybe add in a sub latter on if you listen to bass heavy music.

As to that end paradigm makes some really good stuff. I m a fan of there studio/signature line. Also Polks LSI line. Try and find them used on cregs list or ebay. There are other brands and I m sure others will give you some good suggestions. If you go with any thing less then roughly that level of quality then that its not going to be much of a jump from your current monitors. Like for example i wouldn't (others might) suggest a jump from the monitor line to the RTI A line(or its equivalent from another brand) if you already have money invested in some nice monitors because the delta in sound quality won't be that much (maybe 20-40% at most).

Dan2036

So even something like the Lsi7 would be an upgrade on the monitor 60's ? Would the Lsi bookshelf with a good sub compete with the quality of an SDA or even the Monitor 10B ?

Ron Temple

Dan2036 wrote: »

Would the Lsi bookshelf with a good sub compete with the quality of an SDA or even the Monitor 10B ?

Yes in resolution, but not IMO anywhere close in midrange dynamics or soundstage. The 10s are no slouches for bass and many prefer SDAs without a sub for music (I'm one)...Lsi7s w/sub would be great for a small office or room.

MANSKITO

Ron Temple wrote: »

Yes in resolution, but not IMO anywhere close in midrange dynamics or soundstage. The 10s are no slouches for bass and many prefer SDAs without a sub for music (I'm one)...Lsi7s w/sub would be great for a small office or room.

I would disagree with that maybe a little if you got yourself some Lsi7-9s and a good sub you would be pretty much set and from what i have heard out of the older polk speakers vs the LSI speakers I would consider there sound pretty much equal maybe a little in the favor of the larger SDAs but still I don't think you would be hurting for sound quality. But on that note the resolution IMO would actually be higher on the LSI speakers vs the older polks and if your a man that likes to get lost in the details the LSI speakers are the way to go.

Dan2036

My AVR is rated at 65W for stereo, is that good for the my Monitors or would the benefit greatly from an external amp.

Dan2036

Even the 65W HT receiver ? The stereo receiver (HK 3390) which is 80W is not the one I use for the monitors. Would a better sub be my best bet for a major sound improvement, say maybe the PSW505 ?

nooshinjohn

Dan2036 wrote: »

So even something like the Lsi7 would be an upgrade on the monitor 60's ? Would the Lsi bookshelf with a good sub compete with the quality of an SDA or even the Monitor 10B ?

LSi's image very well, but will lack the soundstage and presence of the SDA's. The LSi'7's with a sub will sound very good given the right external amp(65wpc from a receiver is not enough IMHO), but they will not be able to keep up with a set of SDA-1c's and no sub at all. It has been said many times but one more cannot hurt... SDA's RULE!:cool:

Dan2036

Also any suggestions for a sub that would be really tight for music that would pair well the the M60's. Somewhere around <250$

Dan2036

Will it be a significant difference in sound to add better amplification ? The Emotiva XPA-3 says its 200W won't that go above the recommended power for the M60's (20W-200W) during explosions or intense effects, will that hurt the speakers ?
Is the PSW a big step up from the psw10 I currently have? I'm looking to upgrade whatever will make the biggest impact

MANSKITO

Dan2036 wrote: »

Will it be a significant difference in sound to add better amplification ? The Emotiva XPA-3 says its 200W won't that go above the recommended power for the M60's (20W-200W) during explosions or intense effects, will that hurt the speakers ?
Is the PSW a big step up from the psw10 I currently have? I'm looking to upgrade whatever will make the biggest impact

No not really and by the way you don't need or want a more powerful amp you want a higher fidelity amp. Just trust me on this, more powerful amps won't get you much more SPL unless its exponentially more powerful. For example a 300 watt amp won't get much louder then a 50 watt amp(not saying they both will sound just as good at the same level). Your FINE on power. And on that note even the delta between your amp and the best amp ever made won't be as large as the delta between your monitors and better speakers.

Point, if you want an upgrade in sound upgrade the speakers to the best speakers your budget allows and then and only then find gear to support them.

P.S. your very very very unlikely even if you had a 1000 watt amp to actually go above say 100 or so watts draw off of it with a speaker as efficient as the monitors. Most of the time you will actually be using something like 10 or less watts.(remember your speaker will be at something close to 90dB at just ONE WATT.)

Don't buy the PSW10 if you can help it, its one of the few Polk products that I'm not a fan off. Almost any sub would be an upgrade over it. I second the PSW 505.

cnh

Manskito some good advice above and numerically he is correct. However better sound is NOT simply about 'sounding' louder. Let me give you an example.

M70s are the most musical of the Ms but they're still a mid-level speaker at best. When you hook them up, to let's say an Onkyo 605 (90w/channel)...they sound OK but are not that impressive in 2 channel....at the same volume setting on an Onkyo 805 (130w/channel) they open up, have better lows, more detailed highs, and much better imaging and soundstage!

Add a 250w/channel power amp and again everything I just said about the 605 vs the 805 is even BETTER. Now we have not ACTUALLY doubled the VOLUME....but increased the quality of the power and its headroom, etc.

It is most definitely NOT true that you need a 1000 w/channel to really improve the sound quality of an AVR in two channel!

If you add a quality pre-amp to the power amp and replace the Onkyo 805 with it...again there will be a noticeable difference in Sound quality.

Can a really good set of headphones compete with a higher end speaker system...probably not unless we're talking a 1000 dollar pair with a tube amp pre or something. Even then....headphone sound is not really the way you hear sound in the 'real' world....where there are reflecting surface and room boundaries, etc. And I prefer not to wear them unless I'm listening late at night. But, no doubt there are some FABULOUS HEADPHONE SYSTEMS out there!

Advice....get some M70s and the PSW505...for the price you can't do much better. Remember Polk is about the best sound for the 'dollar', not the best sound EVER.

Vintage Polks like Monitor 10s will probably sound better in 2 channel than M60s. And SDA 2A/Bs much better than those for less money? So if you want to get the best budget 2 channel you can..buy some SDAs get a great SACD/CDP and a good pre-amp/ and power amp. And you'll be HAPPY!!

cnh

MANSKITO

cnh wrote: »

Can a really good set of headphones compete with a higher end speaker system...probably not unless we're talking a 1000 dollar pair with a tube amp pre or something. Even then....headphone sound is not really the way you hear sound in the 'real' world....where there are reflecting surface and room boundaries, etc. And I prefer not to wear them unless I'm listening late at night. But, no doubt there are some FABULOUS HEADPHONE SYSTEMS out there!

cnh

I would agree with most of what you said, I understand that higher power amps sound better because they generally have better parts and do not have to "work as hard" to supply the same power. I was just addressing the common concern "is the 50-100 amp x powerful enough?" And in that respect I stand by what i said power ratings are not as important as fidelity of sound, but it is true they often go hand in hand.

As to the head phones vs speakers yes you are correct they do not image properly with normal recordings. But there are recording techniques that can alleviate this problem. for example if you have some head phones at hand PLEASE listen to this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUDTlvagjJA .

And no I do not believe that the best headphones are better then the best speakers I m just saying that there price/performance ratio is MUCH higher then that of speakers especially when given a proper binaural recording. For example my monitor 60s coast me $200 and my sennheiser HD 555s coast me $100 the HD 555s win by a large margin especially in areas of resolution and detail at half the coast(given your standard recording yes the monitors image a little better). Yes its true that if i had the money I would have the best speakers that money could by but on a budget like mine headphones are pretty much the only way to get mid-Hi fi sound.

cnh

That's cool....I agree and Sennheisers are great phones even their mid lines. If I were upgrading mine, that's what I'd go with....I don't have anything against phones...

Will take a look at that link...thanks!

cnh

Dan2036

I'll have to get a Psw505, unfortunately I already have a Psw10 but I have someone I can give it too. Very cool link by the way Manskito, eerie, but cool.

BeefJerky

MANSKITO wrote: »

As to the head phones vs speakers yes you are correct they do not image properly with normal recordings. But there are recording techniques that can alleviate this problem. for example if you have some head phones at hand PLEASE listen to this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUDTlvagjJA.

Wow, that was incredible. And, this was just using some old Koss K/6LC headphones.

MANSKITO

BeefJerky wrote: »

Wow, that was incredible. And, this was just using some old Koss K/6LC headphones.

Ya I know you should hear some music recorded like that, because of the separation of stereo channels you can pick up stereophonic and directional cues amazingly well more so then even traditional loud speakers. If you want to check out a CD or too that is recorded with binaural tech.

http://www.papabear.com/store/store.html

From the Caves of the iron Mountain is maybe my favorite.