Bi-amping Polk TS1300's via Denon AVR

Uilleann

So the Denon 1910 is a 7.1 channel AVR - though we're using it in a 5.1 config presently. The manual says we can use the extra two channels to bi-amp the front mains if desired. The Batpig Denon page makes a good point in stating that bi-amping with the 1910 *might* offer a little more headroom at higher volumes, but that results may vary. I'm wondering if it would make much difference at all as each of the seven channels are all using the same power supply. We rarely listen at extreme volumes, but I wonder if it might make enough difference to even warrant the two extra wire runs to the mains.

Anyone out there try this with a similar set-up? And just to nip it in the bud before it gets doing down another track: We're not interested in adding external amps to *really* make a bi-amp difference. ;); hehehe

Thanks to any and all in advance for your insight!

Bri~

tonyb

In short, no...save the coin on the extra wires.

Uilleann

I already have the wire. Cost isn't a factor. Its more the sound improvement/headache to add wires ratio.

In truth, it probably wouldn't take me much time to do - I'm just wondering if I'd notice much difference in sound? Any difference at all?

wutadumsn23

IMHO, no. In the time it took you to post this and wait for us to give you an answer, you could have already tried it and seen for yourself, lol. I agree with tony that it isn't even worth the cost of the extra speaker wire, but as you stated, you already have the wire. The only way to find out is to hook em up and see if you hear a difference. Good luck.

-Jeff

98Badger

I agree with wutadumsn and tonyb. No real benefit, but since you have the extra wire, why not try it so you know for sure? If you had separate amps and an external crossover, things might be different. I've tried biwiring (which is really what you are talking about) with other speaker brands and it never made any significant difference in what I heard.

Squishy Tia

98Badger wrote: »

I agree with wutadumsn and tonyb. No real benefit, but since you have the extra wire, why not try it so you know for sure? If you had separate amps and an external crossover, things might be different. I've tried biwiring (which is really what you are talking about) with other speaker brands and it never made any significant difference in what I heard.

In my AVR, a newly purchased Onkyo TX-NR5007 (for a mere $1900, as it were, hehe) I can also bi-amp (and I did). There is a difference in the highs. The lows, while they don't have any improved "punch" do have more accuracy, which I care about more than punch. The 5007 though, has four independent power supplies (it's really three devices separately powered in a single chassis); one each for the video/audio processing and display units, and the third transformer for the surround/center, and a forth HUGE (we're talking Adcom Huge here) toroidal transformer feeding the mains, with 22,000µF capacitors as backup.

While it isn't true bi-amping (audiophile "true" that is), it is delivering from two power supplies. I'll be testing the volume levels out tomorrow if I can do it without making my grandpa get another migraine (he gets them constantly now).

The only downside to the Onkyo receivers is that they use the Audyssey system, which while it does have a preprogrammed "flat" curve (flat across the entire spectrum), it does not use that curve except in THX modes. I had to raise the treble on all channels by 3db to simulate the flat curve. But that lets me still use DD/DTS/Dolby TrueHD and Dolby Master Audio, Dolby EX without compromise, as those use their own settings.

I still have my Adcom 555 MkII though, so there is still the choice of going other routes with the A9s that this thing is powering right now, should the bi-amp mode not pan out as I'd hoped (I'm not gonna bother with bridging just yet, even though this AVR has that option).

wutadumsn23

Keep in mind that that 5007 is a beast, and I wouldn't doubt that it would have enough "extra" power to make a little bit of a difference.

-Jeff

Squishy Tia

wutadumsn23 wrote: »

Keep in mind that that 5007 is a beast, and I wouldn't doubt that it would have enough "extra" power to make a little bit of a difference.

-Jeff

Well, as it turns out, bi-amping on the 5007 produces substantial distortion, so that's a no go. And at 145w/channel it has less power than the adcom. That, combined with the fact that the Audyssey EQ high end rolloff is rather extreme and muddies my audio greatly, this thing goes back. I'm just going to get another Adcom GFA 555 MkII and use the bridged mode on each amp to power each of my A9s.

Don't get me wrong, the 5007 has a TON of features, almost all of which I like. But the Audyssey rolloff >6.3KHz was a showstopper for me. The ONLY way to bypass that was to either use a THX listening mode (which I dislike doing), or jack up the treble to insane levels, which just adds distortion past certain volume levels.

A shame, really, as I didn't have any of the HDMI/video passthrough delay issues many reported with the 3007/5007.

wutadumsn23

That's a shame, I was really considering one of the new NR's when it was time to upgrade my 806, they seem to be real quality units on paper. I don't doubt an Adcom amp would outperform it though, that is what an amp is designed to do, the AVR is more of a jack of all trades.

-Jeff

Squishy Tia

Yeah. I have a choice with the Adcoms though. I can either bridge or passive bi-amp. I may go the latter route since these Adcoms do not have the fan option installed. I'll have to see what it sounds like though. Since the A9s are 8 ohm (nominal of course), that means that when separated each section (upper/lower) has to be 16 ohms, since they're 8 when bridged in parallel via the buss bars. Problem is, once separated, being 16 ohms per array, that basically halves the effective current draw from the amplifier, since there's more resistance. It might still give me headroom, but I'll just have to see what it does for the sound.

Worst case scenario, I can use the second Adcom I have to power a CSiA6 once I can get one for a decent price.

mjcmt

Uilleann wrote: »

but that results may vary. I'm wondering if it would make much difference at all as each of the seven channels are all using the same power supply. We rarely listen at extreme volumes, but I wonder if it might make enough difference to even warrant the two extra wire runs to the mains.

Try it! Generally with the multi-channel amps, a single PS supplies all channels, so there will be marginal benefits, more similar to bi-wiring. It would be beneficial if each channel had a seperate PS, usually not the case w/ surround receivers.