SDA-1's with a A/V Receiver?

Wolffie

I have a beautiful pair of SDA-1s I bought new and want to upgrade my Yamaha stereo receiver to 7.1 and use the Polks as the mains.
Does anyone have a suggestion as to what A/V receiver would work well with my speakers? I know they require a lot of clean power.
I am considering buying an Onkyo TX-SR805 but would appreciate any suggestions in the $600.00 to $900.00 price range.
Thanks!

Refefer

Oof, get an external amp for those babies. Don't sully them with receiver juice, get them something a little more beefy.

dorokusai

It's possible but I would agree, check out an outboard amplifier for best results.

Wolffie

I was afraid everyone would say that!
It is because an A/V receiver does not have enough power? The Onkyo is running 130 watts per channel with a 60 amp peak output.

Refefer

Would you power a corvette with a lawn mower engine?

dorokusai

Some AVR's are quite capable but your application is best served with dedicated amplification. Don't sweat it....this is where the hobby gets really fun

Wolffie

Thanks for the advice everyone.
I guess I will start doing some research and watch the ads for used equipment.
Is it possible to buy a really good amp & receiver for under $750.00?
Any suggestions would be appreciated....

Refefer

Wolffie wrote: »

Thanks for the advice everyone.
I guess I will start doing some research and watch the ads for used equipment.
Is it possible to buy a really good amp & receiver for under $750.00?
Any suggestions would be appreciated....

You could certainly buy a decent amp and a receiver (with pre-outs) for under $750. What features are you looking for in the receiver? Just 7.1 and the normal DTS/Dolby/etc processing?

And by decent amp, I mean night and day difference over the receiver

ben62670

Yep. A good start is an HK receiver with PreOuts. You can get these from HK direct on Ebay. Also a used Adcom, or Parasound amp works well with these. The receiver you end up getting must have PreOuts. Also if you find an amp you are interested in ask before you buy it. Many here have, or have owned SDA's.

Wolffie

Refefer wrote: »

You could certainly buy a decent amp and a receiver (with pre-outs) for under $750. What features are you looking for in the receiver? Just 7.1 and the normal DTS/Dolby/etc processing?

And by decent amp, I mean night and day difference over the receiver

I would like to have 7.1 and normal DTS, etc., with multi-room capability so I can use 5.1 in main room, stereo in the 2nd.
Since I have an HD TV (1080i) and HD Cable it might be nice to have HDMI capabilities too.
The good A/V receivers on the market make it look like the easy choice since they have so many features. But, I will sacrifice features for better sound any day!

Wolffie

ben62670 wrote: »

Yep. A good start is an HK receiver with PreOuts. You can get these from HK direct on Ebay. Also a used Adcom, or Parasound amp works well with these. The receiver you end up getting must have PreOuts. Also if you find an amp you are interested in ask before you buy it. Many here have, or have owned SDA's.

Are you saying the Harmon Kardon receivers are a good start? Which models?
What kind of power should I be looking for in an amp? 100-200 watts minimum?
Thanks!

ben62670

AVR-247's can be had cheap from HK direct. As far as watts you are going to hear 200 minimum soon. I like powerful sound, and more watts is more better if you are comparing apples to apples. I like used Adcom's. Bang for the buck can't be beat IMHO. If your speakers are the earlier ones you are running 4 ohms. I started with a GFA-5400 130@8ohms, and 200@4. Worked very very well. I have run them with a GFA-555 200@8, and 325@4. Better? Definitely, but not stupendously better. Then a GFA-585 250@8, and 400@4. Much better, but the amp was in a different build quality class. A receiver rated at 130 watts is going to get whooped by a good amp at 130watts, and your 4ohm load will make most receivers quiver even at moderate levels.

BSUfbfan

Go on to "onecall.com" and get a Yamaha HTR series receiver with the feature set you are looking for (around $500) then get a nice used 2-channel amp from Audiogon (around $400) and you are in like flinn. Do NOT run the 1C's off of receiver power please

ben62670

Yami for $500, or HK for about $250 refurbed?
I had a Yami "Natural Sound". For HT OK. For Music? Straight up no.
Better brand.
Better product.
Half the price.

BSUfbfan

Thats arguable, I guess.

I currently sell both brands, and while the older HK gear was flat out awesome, if Wolffie buys a quality 2 channel amp I seriously doubt he would hear any difference in the preamp section of a Yami or the newer Harman Industries stuff.

ben62670

The Yami was too bright, and edgy compared to the HK. Even though we are not talking about driving with the AVR even using one as a Pre it still has that Yami bite that really sets the tone for the amp. Pre's send the signal that gets amped. I also have used an Adcom Pre. Too edgy, but hard hitting bass. I am currently using an Outlaw 990 which is a $900 Pre with no amplification stages. To be honest the HK was a formidable contender to the dedicated Pre's SQ.

Joe08867

Not a fan of Yami at all for music. HK is solid and has a more natural sound.

Onkyo isn't bad but that 130 rating isn't as strong as a 100 rating for HK.IMHO.

If I were you I would go seperate amp for the SDA1's.

Refefer

I'd end up getting the HK. They are one of the few mainstream receiver manufacturers that actually give a damn about their amp section. That's not to say that they're anywhere close to where a solid amp is, but the rest of your speakers being driven by the HK should prove better sounding.

Part of the reason external amps sounds much better compared to their integrated cousins is because of impedance dips. Receivers have a hard time driving anything less than 8 ohms particularly well, which is a problem because over a speaker's entire range, the impedance changes, often times dipping under its rated ohms. While it might end up being 8 ohm nominal, those little dips can play hell on a less capable amplifier sections.

Your SDA's run at 6 ohms nominal, so you're already pushing a receiver past where it's comfortable. An adcom amp, while not only inexpensive as amps go, will drive those SDA's left right and center AND leave room for plenty of dynamics. They handle a 4 ohm load like it's not even there

Drop $250 on an H/K, $400 on an amp, and you will be in for an awesome time

Refefer

I forgot to mention, welcome to the forums!

Wolffie

Thanks everyone for the helpful information.
The consensus seems to be the HK receiver over the Yamaha and I'm wondering which model I should be looking for. One person mentioned the AVR-247...any others worth considering?
The manual on my speakers says the DC resistance is 5 ohm, so are these really classified 4 ohm?
Would anyone know which model I have (a,b,c)? I purchased them in July of 1986, and they are just marked SDA-1. They have the internal SafetyGuard tweeter protection circuit rather than the outside fuses.
One last thing...from what I have seen on the Forum some people upgrade the tweeters. Does this make a significant improvement? If so, what is recemmended and about how much do they cost?
This is getting fun...thanks!
Wolffie

Joe08867

If they have fuses I would say they are just SDA-1's not A B or C.

Are your tweeters set side by side or up and down from each other??

Side by side = first generation.

Up and down = last generations.

As far as tweeter upgrades go. It is a very big improvement. But listen to your own ears. I believe the replacement tweeters are $48 per shipped for Club Polk members. So you are looking at just under $200 to upgrade.

Marty913

I 2nd (3rd) the Harman Kardon recommendation. I used mine as a pre-pro paired with a Carver 5 channel amp & it was very nice. For 7 channel you could use a couple of the HK channels for the side surrounds. The AVR-247 is probably the lowest model that offers HDMI switching of 1080P. The much lower priced AVR-340 is 7.1 but only does component switching. There a quite a few of both on EBAY.

Just to add to the response to the receiver versus amp question, the recent issue of Home Theater reviewed one of the mid-range Sony receivers. It's rated at 100 watts per channel BUT with 5 channels driven it drops to 65, and with 7 driven it drops to around 45. There are receivers out there that really deliver the watts, but they are more rare than the "specs" would indicate.

Ron Temple

Yeah, looks like theres a bunch of 247s coming due within the next day or so. The probably average ~ $250. The best method I've found on these AVRs is to snipe in the last minute if the unit hasn't gone over your price point. Be patient, there's always more coming up tomorrow.

Wolffie

Joe08867 wrote: »

If they have fuses I would say they are just SDA-1's not A B or C.

Are your tweeters set side by side or up and down from each other??

Side by side = first generation.

Up and down = last generations.

As far as tweeter upgrades go. It is a very big improvement. But listen to your own ears. I believe the replacement tweeters are $48 per shipped for Club Polk members. So you are looking at just under $200 to upgrade.

Tweeters are side by side. There are NO fuses.
Wolffie

Wolffie

Ron Temple wrote: »

Yeah, looks like theres a bunch of 247s coming due within the next day or so. The probably average ~ $250. The best method I've found on these AVRs is to snipe in the last minute if the unit hasn't gone over your price point. Be patient, there's always more coming up tomorrow.

Thanks Ron!

Face

I used a AVR-245 as a pre for a while and it worked great. I also purchased it from HK direct on Ebay.

Wolffie

Marty913 wrote: »

I 2nd (3rd) the Harman Kardon recommendation. I used mine as a pre-pro paired with a Carver 5 channel amp & it was very nice. For 7 channel you could use a couple of the HK channels for the side surrounds. The AVR-247 is probably the lowest model that offers HDMI switching of 1080P. The much lower priced AVR-340 is 7.1 but only does component switching. There a quite a few of both on EBAY.

Just to add to the response to the receiver versus amp question, the recent issue of Home Theater reviewed one of the mid-range Sony receivers. It's rated at 100 watts per channel BUT with 5 channels driven it drops to 65, and with 7 driven it drops to around 45. There are receivers out there that really deliver the watts, but they are more rare than the "specs" would indicate.

Very interesting about the true power ratings of receivers.
I thought the AVR-340 was a more expensive model...Am I wrong?
Wolffie

Wolffie

Face wrote: »

I used a AVR-245 as a pre for a while and it worked great. I also purchased it from HK direct on Ebay.

Do you know why there are so many of these re-manufactured units available? Everyone seems to recommend them, but I do not want to buy something unreliable.
Also, do they all have pre-outs, or is it only on older models?
Wolffie

Face

The reman units are pretty trouble free.

The 245 and 247 have pre-outs, I'm not familiar with the other models. I would imagine that their better lines also have pre-outs.

Joe08867

Wolffie wrote: »

Tweeters are side by side. There are NO fuses.
Wolffie

If your tweeters are side by side the are original series SDA1's not b's or c's.

I have original SDA2's with side by side tweeters. I am not sure if the SDA1's have a dimensional tweeter but if they do you may want to try disconnecting it. You will be amazed by the difference in sound.

Wolffie

Joe08867 wrote: »

If your tweeters are side by side the are original series SDA1's not b's or c's.

I have original SDA2's with side by side tweeters. I am not sure if the SDA1's have a dimensional tweeter but if they do you may want to try disconnecting it. You will be amazed by the difference in sound.

How would I know for sure if the tweeters are dimensional or not? I would think they are since there are two in each, just like the mids and lows.
Is it easy to disconnect them? Exactly what does it do to the sound?
Wolffie