TV guru's...I need your help

steveinaz

Ok, I don't know dick about TV's, HDTV, DLP, ECT, ASAP...LOL!

So give me some common knowledge. Tell me about HDTV, the best approach to buying--the difference between HDTV ready versus an HDTV "monitor" etc, etc. Whats better, Plasma, LCD, DLP, CRT, rear projection...I'm absolutely dumb when it comes to video, and would like to jump on the HDTV band-wagon...Help!

scottvamp

Steve, I just went through the process. If your going to go sattelite you don't need a built in HD reciever. I found that nothing can beat a good CRT for the price and PQ. Front projection is the way to go with a dedicated HomeTheater. But if that is not your thing keep in mind with DLP and all others not including CRT, you still have ramp up time, expensive bulb changing and fan noise.
I love my new HDTV and could not be happier - and I am still satisfied with the size also.

TheGrayGhost

”Ok, I don't know dick about TV's, HDTV, DLP, ECT, ASAP...LOL!”

Steve,

You forgot ESPN, UPS, FBI, CIA, and of course FCC.

”So give me some common knowledge. Tell me about HDTV, the best approach to buying--the difference between HDTV ready versus an HDTV "monitor" etc, etc. Whats better, Plasma, LCD, DLP, CRT, rear projection...I'm absolutely dumb when it comes to video, and would like to jump on the HDTV band-wagon...Help!”

I agree with Scottvamp that a CRT (direct view or rear projection) is the best option (after front projector) for excellent high definition TV. And this is coming from a person that has owned a DLP RPTV for 1-½ years. I visit my old CRT RPTV from time to time at a friend’s house and I’m still amazed at the image quality. It’s so much brighter with better black levels than my DLP even after spending 6 months calibrating the DLP.

A HDTV ready and HDTV monitor mean the same thing. It means it has no internal HDTV tuner. You will have to buy a satellite or over the air digital receiver for the monitor. A HDTV monitor can also mean that it can accept limited computer resolutions. My DLP is a ‘monitor’ and I’m looking at a 50” desktop as I type this response. One advantage a DLP/LCD TV has is the Windows desktop will be sharper than on a CRT RPTV.

In my opinion a direct view single tube wide screen TV is better than a 3 tube RPTV because you don’t have to converge the image from the RGB tubes. But a direct view CRT is limited in size (<40”) and very heavy.

Out of the box none of the TVs come calibrated, as they should be including digital TVs. Most are setup to look good and stand out on the showroom floor with different lighting than would be used in the home. For the absolute best image quality you should have the TV ISF calibrated after 100 hours of burnin. An ISF calibration can cost several hundred dollars and may need minor tweaking every year or so to maintain convergence and peak color performance. This is the trade off for the cost of lamps on digital TVs.

steveinaz

Thank you for the help! Keep it comin...

Terrax

Steve,

I would also suggest checking out www.avsforum.com in the RPTV area, as well as, a few other areas. The information about video and HT is amazing. An excellent site.

-Terry

dave shepard

Originally posted by steveinaz
Ok, I don't know dick about TV's, HDTV, DLP, ECT, ASAP...LOL!

So give me some common knowledge. Tell me about HDTV, the best approach to buying--the difference between HDTV ready versus an HDTV "monitor"

I just bought a Hitachi Ultravision 65" s700 it had the tuner in it for over the air HD and they make a noise (from the fan on the HD tuner to keep it cool) that drove me nuts and made my ears ring (hi freq) I called the store and they exchanged it for the 500 which does not have the tuner in it and also then doesn't have the fan to make the noise and am mush happier with it. The store had only a $100 price dif. between the two usally, sets with the tuner are $4-500 more. For me and everyone else if you ever deside to get Satilight (Dish or Direct etc) you will not need the tuner for HD the HD satilight reciever will act as your tuner.

Dave

scottvamp

Originally posted by dave shepard
I just bought a Hitachi Ultravision 65" s700 it had the tuner in it for over the air HD and they make a noise (from the fan on the HD tuner to keep it cool) that drove me nuts and made my ears ring (hi freq) Dave

Heard the same thing about those units. My external Samsung DirectTV tuner does not even have a fan and runs cool to my surprize. Very happy with - great features and menu system.

PolkThug

The best bang for your buck are the good 'ole rear projection CRT's. Hitachi is the best* in this category with the:

57S500 or similar models, as long as the "S" is there.

First two digits = size, next letter is the model, 500 equal HD monitor, 700 = HD built-in tuner.

Professional calibrators love these things, they are extremely tweakable.

You do not need satellite or an OTA tuner to get HD. Time Warner will give you the HD box for no additional charge.

I bought the 57S700, with the HD tuner built-in, but that ended up being worthless because TW gives you the HD box anyway that gives you HD channels through the normal cable line.

Regards,
PolkThug

*As mentioned in above posts, calibration is key.

brettw22

I think I remember reading something a while back that the FCC was going to be mandating that all TV's be sold with HD Tuners built in due to the convergence of all broadcasts going that route. I don't recall the time frame mentioned though.....

I would at least wait on a purchase of a HDTV until the Intel LCOS comes out around the end of the year. Pitched as the greatest since sliced bread (what isn't any more) it's supposed to resolve the downfalls of DLP and LCD.....

PolkThug

Originally posted by brettw22
I think I remember reading something a while back that the FCC was going to be mandating that all TV's be sold with HD Tuners built in due to the convergence of all broadcasts going that route. I don't recall the time frame mentioned though.....

Negative. There is NO requirement to go to HD, (I used to think there was too til I started reading). The only future broadcasting requirement is simply "digital". But there are even loopholes to that.

johnny_utah

Actually, the FCC has mandated more built-in DTV tuners. The ruling currently states that half of all TVs sized 36 inches or larger are to include built-in tuners by July 1, 2004, and the other half by July 1, 2005. The mandate trickles down to smaller TVs and other gear with TV tuners, such as VCRs and DVD recorders, until finally, on July 1, 2007, every TV tuner will be able to receive digital broadcasts. At that point, the logic goes, broadcasters will turn off their analog over-the-air transmissions for good.

johnny_utah

sign up for Voom. The have more HD than anyone. www.voom.com. It's great.

I have a 65" Mitsubishi that I am very hapy with. IMO, if you are going to get an HDTV, for the money, i'd go with a CRT rear projection. All of the technologies have some flaws, but the rear projection is about the cheapiest, it will satisfy your needs until something better comes out later. That something being a tv that has no burn in, can be viewed at all angles, and plays all feeds smoothly, and doesn't have to be a front projector.

nebborjk

sign up for Voom. The have more HD than anyone. www.voom.com. It's great.

Does Voom pay you guys for this advertising?

HBombToo

I was under the impression the fcc mandates come from the Hollywood Flamers that are insisting some sort of flag be impressed on the digital signal to prevent recording?

There is a lot of chaff regarding high res pirating.

HBomb

ch47d

So give me some common knowledge. Tell me about HDTV, the best approach to buying--the difference between HDTV ready versus an HDTV "monitor" etc, etc. Whats better, Plasma, LCD, DLP, CRT, rear projection...I'm absolutely dumb when it comes to video, and would like to jump on the HDTV band-wagon...Help!

I am not aware of a HD provider that does not use a set top box so, there is no reason to buy a HDTV with a built in tuner, unless you want to watch only over the air broadcasts. Now, CRT, DLP, LCD, and plasma. It depends on what kind of source you typically view, that will determine what to buy. If you watch alot of 4:3 material, I would not recommend plasma or CRT. The reason is permanant burn in where the vertical bars form on both sides of the screen (yes, you can stretch the image to fill the screen, but that sucks.). DLP, LCD, and plasma all use pixels to display an image. HDTV can either be 1080i (interlaced) or, 720p (progressive) horizontal lines of resolution. DLP, LCD, and plasma can be made to display 1080p but, they are VERY expensive. Basically, affordable digital HDTV displays are going to be 720p. CRT will be 1080i. The differance between progressive and interlaced is, interlaced refreshes the screen in two steps. First the odd lines then, the even lines. Each step takes 1/60th of a sec. Progressive refreshes the image in one step, from top to bottom, in 1/60th of a sec, and then from bottom to top in 1/60th of a sec. It results in smoother picture without artifacts. DLP, stands for digital light processing. It uses a segmented color wheel and, in a HD display 1280x720 tiny little mirrors that tilt at varying degrees to display the image. The advantage of DLP is reduced screen door effect between the pixels, and better contast ratio then LCD projection. The disadvantage is, some people see dithering, or rainbows, but most people cannot. LCD stands for liquid crystal display. It works by opening and closing red, green, and blue pixels in an LCD chip, in front of a bright bulb to display the image. The disadvantage is an undesirable "screen door affect" between the pixels.

So, to sum it up. For front/rear projection, DLP will have the best black level, and reduced screen door affect but may cause some people to see "rainbows". LCD will be the second least expensive but, may seem like you are looking through a screen door when seated close to the screen. CRT rear projection is typically the least expensive, due to being the most mature technology and can have an outstanding picture. CRT front projectors are bulky expensive and a pain to calibrate. DLP and LCD will not burn in if you view alot of 4:3 content but, CRT may, especially if you have the brightness set at high levels.

Plasma and LCD flatpanels have amazing picture quality but, are very expensive. CRT tube tvs have excellent picture quality but are limited to about 36" in size.

Sorry for the long post, I tried my best to condense it.

I had VOOM hooked up while I was on leave. I only had 1 day to enjoy it. VOOM absolutely ROCKS!

ch47d

Here is a couple of other things to keep in mind. Not all DLPs are the same. The first generation kind of sucked. Since then they have improved considerably. You will see HD2, HD2+ and HD3 chip displays. Each one is a new generation. You will see 5, 6, and 7 or more segment color wheels. All of these things result in better contrast ratio and reduced rainbows. For home theater you want at least 2,000:1 contrast and 1,000 lumens for front projection. As a rule of thumb. If you can get your room really dark you can get away with less lumens. Most HD2 projectors will better 2,000:1 contrast. The Sharp 12000u will do 5,000:1!

Something that has not been covered, for plasma in particular, is EDTV. EDTV is not HDTV!. It is digital but, only 480p. If you find a really good deal on a HDTV compatable plasma ($3,500 or less) it is probably an EDTV plasma. It will play HD sources but, will down convert it to 480p!

steveinaz

I appreciate the time you guys are taking to educate me. Will Cox cable offer HDTV in the future?

ch47d

I think they do, in certain areas. If they don't have it where you live don't hold your breath. VOOM is way ahead of every other HD provider and at a very reasonable price. If you think about the expence for cable companies to upgrade their equipment to HD. It is no surprise they drag their feet compared to satellite providers that can cover the whole U.S. and get their money back. What I don't understand is why VOOM can provide over 30 HD channels using the Dish Network satellite and Dish only gives something like 6 HD channels.

TheGrayGhost

Originally posted by PolkThug
Negative. There is NO requirement to go to HD, (I used to think there was too til I started reading). The only future broadcasting requirement is simply "digital". But there are even loopholes to that.

PolkThug,

What loophole would that be? Once a certain level (percentage) of penetration is reached all analog transmitters will be turned off, unless the broadcaster wishes to bid for the spectrum.

You’re certainly correct about there being NO requirement to transmit HDTV. The FCC wording states “one digital stream with video resolution at least equal to the current analog signal”. Any way you look at it that is 480i and can be provided in digital format using only 3 Mbps of the 19.3 Mbps bandwidth in the digital spectrum allocation.

Any licensed station can use the other 16.3 Mbps bandwidth as a source of income (multi-casting, video on demand, wireless Internet, wireless cable, etc.) and would be required to pay the government 5% of gross revenues earned.

As to the TV Tuner requirements. The ATSC specifications require tuners to support all 18 resolutions including HD resolutions up to at least 1080p. So all tuners can be considered HDTV tuners.

johnny_utah

Originally posted by ch47d
What I don't understand is why VOOM can provide over 30 HD channels using the Dish Network satellite and Dish only gives something like 6 HD channels.

Voom has it's own satellite in space that it uses. It has 2 transponders on a dish network satellite that the FCC is letting Voom use.

If you look at a Voom disclaimer it says "The STARZ! and SHOWTIME PlusPacks are delivered on satellite capacity that is only temporarily available to Rainbow DBS. Rainbow DBS may be required to cease transmitting over this capacity at any time." although they will be using the transponders until the satellite goes up for auction in October.

In addition dish network uses space on Sky Angels' satellite.

ch47d - Good point about EDTV.

arufener

I've spoken with a number of sales persons at circuit city, good guys, frys, magnolia hi-fi. I've heard over and over that the Sony’s KV-34HS510 34" Hi-Scan® FD Trinitron® WEGA is the best picture avalible on the market today. With this model, sony uses the highest quality parts avalible. CRT, is still the best picture, and HD on top of that. Their is so many things about this TV that makes it the best. I can't afford it, but I have a friend that has one. It really is amazing. I've compared it to everything else, and as far as I can tell, if you can sacrifice the size, get this TV.
The only other thing that I would get besides this is a front projector. You can get amazing quality with those now, and their prices have dropped over the past 2 years. Plus they are massivly huge, if you know what I mean, talk about stretching your dollar.

Check out THIS SITE for more info on the sony TV I was talkin about.

thanks
arufener