Had the truck dyno'ed today. Y'all are gonna be sick.

Jstas · November 2003

...the truck is rated at 380 horses and 450 pound feet...stock, at the crank.

This afternoon at about 1:45 pm, the truck turned

371.83 rwhp
446.14 rwtq

That means that it is severaly under rated by about 65 horses and 85 pound feet of torque and that is a conservative estimate.

Those estimates would put totals at around 440 horses and about 530 pound feet of torque. The guy running the dyno said those number may be a tad low too. That is a disgusting amount of power to be under rated.

I'll have pictures of the dyno graph as soon as I can.

MTXMAN · November 2003

that sucks man... I'd call up the dealer and be like WTF!!!

Jstas · November 2003

Why? It makes a pile more power than they said it did! I'm totally freaking estatic!

PoweredByDodge · November 2003

john, go in there, be like "u bastids - u falsely advertised the truck, it puts out an assload more horsepower... i want some of my money back!" --- see if they'll bite.. threaten them with court action and class action lightning owner lawsuits... u can be like the woman who sued mcdonalds for making her coffee hot and burning her... be like "my truck's so fast i got a speeding ticket, i want 800 million bucks... and some money so vinnie can get an intake and cam".

it's all good

MTXMAN · November 2003

lol, pbd.

My misunderstanding Jstas. I didn't notice that the factory specs were at the crank vs at the wheels for your's.. definately sweet.

wlrandall · November 2003

Dayum, Jstas!! What are you driving, a Lightening??

sntnsupermen131 · November 2003

yeah he has a lightning
-Cody

Jstas · November 2003

Geez, I totaly forgot to post the dyno graph!

I'll link it 'cause the picture is large but it needs to be so you can read the graph legibly.

Dyno Graph

Items of special interest:

I had 4 seperate runs. Runs 1,3 and 4 and graphed. Run 2 was 351.XX horses and 436.XX pound feet of torque. The first 3 runs, runs 1 through 3, were done without the air filter in. Run 4 made the most power and had the air filter installed.

Also, notice how flat the torque curve is (lower graph) across a fairly wide RPM range. That is basically why it pulls like a freight train.

You cannot see the Air/Fuel graphn because it is not there but it was pretty flat and consistent. That probably doesn't mean anything to anyone here but it is quite important.

The reason the 4th run made more power with the air filter than without is air flow. The engine has a 90mm throttle body. That is a big **** hole. Think of two things. Think of how a river flows and think of packing peanuts. To get an idea of how air flows, think of a river. It's smooth and flowing unles something sticks in the water stream, like a rock or log. What happens? An eddy forms which is a swirling area of water. The area inside the eddy is not very high in pressure but the area around it is. Air does the same thing. It creates a pocket of swirling ihgh pressure air which chokes down the air flow and reduces overall velocity and causes turbulence.

Now think of those peanuts. You can't dump those peanuts into a box or bag without some of them getting stuck on the edge and spilling over. Sometimes they clog up the space you are trying to fit the through. So thinking of air flowing like water and the peanuts being the actual air molecules, you can get a visual of what it is like trying to cram 10 pounds of turbulent air into a 5 pound hole. Doesn't work so well. Well, without an air filter, that is what was happening. Putting the air filter in, it straightens out the air flow like a strainer and smoothes out the flow. That helps to increase and maintain air velocity and reduce turbulence. That allows much more air to enter the engine which in turn makes more power. That, in a nut shell, is why airflow is important. Some of the biggest improvements I have seen done to engines come from the cheapest parts meant only to redirect airflow to a more optimum path. Some of them, like that Tornado thing, are totally bogus though. I won't explain why here though unless someone asks.

Jstas · November 2003

Originally posted by wlrandall
Dayum, Jstas!! What are you driving, a Lightening??

Well, it's pretty heavy so I wouldn't call it a Lightening!

It's a 2001 Ford SVT F-150 Lightning.

wlrandall · November 2003

Nice, very nice. Like them best in black, kind of a "Darth Vader" look, IMO.

MTXMAN · November 2003

I realy want the ram 1500 club cab with the 5.7 hemi.... but the '05 ram is commin with a new "Rumble Bee" package, reminescent of the Super Bee. 5.7 hemi with 500+ hp with bolt on everything (including supercharger) available for maximum customizability. parts are supposed to be fairly headache free too... now that's gonna be a sweet truck

PoweredByDodge · November 2003

*balling his fkin eyes out*

I WANT A RUMBLE BEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

it sounds cute... and stuff.

*wwwwwwaaaaaaaaaahahahaaaaa*

i am sad.

wlrandall · November 2003

LMAO, PBD, I hear ya, man! That does sound sweet, doesn't it??

sntnsupermen131 · November 2003

i want a hummer...
not an h2 POS, the original
lol
ill race you in the rumble bee...i get to pick the course
-Cody

MTXMAN · November 2003

turns out the rumble bee is all custom work and probaly won't be available stock

Jstas · November 2003

Here is the truck spinning the rollers!

PoweredByDodge · November 2003

u want rumble bee - u got rumble bee...

PoweredByDodge · November 2003

and more rumble bee...

i actually talked to a mopar techie about the springs in front of my truck...

asked about the rumble bee ****...

was told its a project dodge is considering and that they gave this truck up for free in the process for the sake of seeing exactly what would get done with it.

this guy personally wants a vinyl / leather sewn interior to give it that 70's look.

supposedly if/when it ever happens they're considering the current version of the RACE hemi moter (the old style 42X), carbureted, and torqueflited. for nostalgia sake. this would be what was said to be about a 4,500 dollar "upgrade" from the "normal" one that would bemade... and its street legality is still under huge question.

PoweredByDodge · November 2003

bling bling...

goingganzo · November 2003

that is nice but can it handle? i think not. i have a twin turbo stealth with a few mods and over 400 hp plus it is awd and aws. not the fastest off the line but will hold its own and on the track rocks.

Jstas · November 2003

What the hell is your problem?

Rogue Torino · November 2003

some people care about handling some people care about straightline speed. Of course the truck isn't gunna handle as well as a car but that's not what people are looking for in these trucks. Your statement is irrelavent and I don't really see why you posted it. By the way nice to hear about your Dyno runs Jstas, if you don't mind how much did it cost to do them or did you know someone?:)

Jstas · November 2003

I went with my local SVT Owners Association chapter. We got a deal. We had a Dyno Day there and we had 3 runs for 75 or an air/fuel tune for 125. Normally that would be about 300 bucks so yeah, we got a deal.

As far as the handling goes, how many of you have actually driven a Lightning long enough to be able to say that "it doesn't handle"?

Turbota · November 2003

QUOTE: "the truck is rated at 380 horses and 450 pound feet...stock, at the crank.

This afternoon at about 1:45 pm, the truck turned

371.83 rwhp
446.14 rwtq

That means that it is severaly under rated by about 65 horses and 85 pound feet of torque and that is a conservative estimate".
_______________________________________________

You need to realize that drivetrain loss is about 12% for a manual tranny vehicle and about 15% for an automatic.

You did very good. You are making more HP and torque to the rear wheels than if the motor did indeed have a true 380 HP and 450 Ft Lb torque at the flywheel (that's the factory net HP rating).

The Dynojet is very acurate and the numbers you got were SAE corrected to SAE 'standard' conditions (adjusted for ambient temp, baro pressure, and humidity)

Based on a 12% drivetrain loss, your actual net crankshaft HP and torque is approx 417 HP / 500 Lb ft torque. That beats the **** out of the factory Net HP/Torque rating for that motor!

Don't worry about a thing

Ron,

Jstas · November 2003

Sorry but you are flat out wrong and excessivly optimistic. A manual transmission, unless it's a racing unit, will produce about 15-18% drivertrain loss depending on size and weight of the gearing. An automatic would see 15% loss on it's very best day with nothing but an alternator strapped to the front of teh engine. My truck has a Ford 4R100 transmission in it. That transmission is usually reserved for heavy/severe duty commercial chassis vehciles. The only reason they used it is because there is no manual trans in Ford's parts bin capable of handling the power + weight of a truck like this. Ford, and quite a few tuners have verified it, say that the total drivetrain loss, including not only transmissions but the 9.75 inch rear differential and axles plus accessories and that wonderful blower on top add up to about 18-20% total parasitic loss.

Turbota · November 2003

Ok, lets say your transmission / rear differential eats up a greater percentage of HP than what I stated above. Your truck is now pulling 371 rwhp. With the greater percentage of parasitic HP loss that you state, that would increase the actual crank HP even higher than the 417 I predicted above. What's wrong with that? Bottom line, you are making quite a lot more HP and torque at the crank than what the factory rated the motor at.

You need to remember that factory rated HP numbers are NOT based on rear wheel HP. They are based on crankshaft HP (net) ... That's at the crank with all engine accesories attached.

Your pulling almost the same HP at the rear wheels as what Ford rates the Net HP on the engine.

I don't understand what your complaint is .....

Ron,

98 Trans Am ... heads, headers, cam car
12.20 ET @ 113 mph (daily driver)

__________________________________________

Jstas · November 2003

You need to get it through your thick head that I know what I am talking about and every point you are harping I have already addressed.

I don't care what you think you know or how much of an expert you think you are. My complaint is that you are telling me that I am wrong when I have already explained to you and everyone else in this thread the reasons for certain "anomalies". Never once have I complained about it not making rated power. You really need to stop jumping the gun and READ the posts in the thread.

Turbota · November 2003

Jstas ...

Hey, you need to cool down a little. I was just trying to be of some help. By reading your original post, I was under the impression that after you put the truck on the rollers, you felt your truck was not putting out as much HP as the manufacturer rated it as.

My bad: Quote from your second post ... "Why? It makes a pile more power than they said it did! I'm totally freaking estatic!"

I read the first post jumped right past the second ... sorry

The factory has underrated that motor by quite a bit.

Very good dyno numbers .....

PoweredByDodge · November 2003

... for what it's worth, i'd venture to say the lightning probably handles quite well.

I've yet to drive one so what i say is mere speculation, but more more speculation than what Goingganzo said...

the lightning is very low to the ground, even for a 2 wheel drive truck... its pretty much rubbin the floor.

this "slams" the vehicle to the pavement better when you're doing say 30 mph and above becuase teh wind is "Swooshing" up over the top of the truck and very little under, giving u a nice slammage effect.

traction increases, as if it even needed to with the friggin tires they put on the thing... it's already gripping well to the road surface.

now normaly a heavy vehicle is a bad thing, that makes it handle sloppy, but in the case of the lightning it's to its advantae i would say. when you're putting out that much damn power, you need a solid mass to keep it all in check. 500 horses behind a ricer could easily result in a spin out or uncontrolled cornering and **** like that.... especially with an idiot for a driver.

but tha tmuch power in a heavier vehicle will be harnessed better.... and since ford is mass marketing these things, they kind of have to make them ready for "idiot drivers of america" -- cuz not everybody who says "oooh i want a lightnign and have the money for it" really has an **** of a clue about how to drive one.

as the driver grows more intuitive to the vehicle, they can then push it to its full potential, but things like solid tight steering, quality brakes, and a STABLE suspension are critical... and for the critical acclaim the lightning has received, and to this day it being the ONLY true "SPORT TRUCK" on the market... i'd say that speaks volumes for its performance as well as safety and handling abilities.

... and from my screen name, you can tell I'm not a paid endorser.

Had the truck dyno'ed today. Y'all are gonna be sick.

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