Pros and cons of multiple subwoofers

This has been discussed on a few threads here. I finally found an article that explains it well.
I'm using two in the bedroom stereo. In the living room home theater and also on my computer system.
All Polk!

http://hometheaterreview.com/the-pros-and-cons-of-multiple-subwoofers/
«13

Comments

  • honestaquarian
    honestaquarian Posts: 3,186
    These work just fine. Besides that they fit in my small room and if I wanted significantly better performance I would have to pay a LOT of money
  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,478
    Nothing new I've used two in my home theater from day one back in the pro logic days. Opposite corners front and back. I don't need any white pages to tell me already what I've experienced.
  • honestaquarian
    honestaquarian Posts: 3,186
    pitdogg2 wrote: »
    Nothing new I've used two in my home theater from day one back in the pro logic days. Opposite corners front and back. I don't need any white pages to tell me already what I've experienced.

    I agree
    However you are the choir that this stuff is preaching to. Most others, however do not either know or understand this stuff.
  • FTGV
    FTGV Posts: 3,649
    edited April 2017
    This topic has been covered and debated to death the last number of years on numerous audio forums.The Harmon paper and later research by Geddes really got the ball rolling. The benefits of multi sub distributed bass is not just an HT thing. Done right "some" 2ch rigs can also benefit from the addition of a pair or more of good well integrated subwoofers. I am currently experimenting with a set up similar to this . http://jamesromeyn.com/old-pages/home-audio-gear/dsa-1-0-distributed-subwoofer-array-5-pieces-4k-usd/
    The results so far have been very encouraging.
  • Jaybeez
    Jaybeez Posts: 737
    I upgraded my AVR and was able to run 2 subs. I'll never go back to a single sub for HT.
  • mikeyb128
    mikeyb128 Posts: 2,885
    The DSW series subs are awesome. In my mid 20's I ran dual PSW 505's and loved them, they did great for home theater in the room I had.

    My dual DSW Pro 500's on some sundudes were fantastic for home theater. And those were only the 200 watt versions.
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • mrloren
    mrloren Posts: 2,454
    I find the PSW505 to be one of the best budget subs out there. Decent bass for less than $200. It's way better in most cases than no sub. Friend's have them, in-laws have one. Coworker picked one up on New Egg last year for $149. When I am helping spend money on HT and they don't want to spend a lot the 505 is the go to sub. Does it compare to my VTF3, oh no, not at all.

    As for 2 subs if you have the room go for it. I wanted to go dual but wife said no... no place to put it.
    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
    Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
    Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
    Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • mikeyb128
    mikeyb128 Posts: 2,885
    mrloren wrote: »
    I find the PSW505 to be one of the best budget subs out there. Decent bass for less than $200. It's way better in most cases than no sub. Friend's have them, in-laws have one. Coworker picked one up on New Egg last year for $149. When I am helping spend money on HT and they don't want to spend a lot the 505 is the go to sub. Does it compare to my VTF3, oh no, not at all.

    As for 2 subs if you have the room go for it. I wanted to go dual but wife said no... no place to put it.

    I totally agree w/ your statement being that the psw505 is the best $200 sub out there besides finding a used svs. But if you stretch your wallet to $499, then the gap widens substantially and you will hear things you have never came close to hearing when it comes to HT. I have heard and upgraded a few subs, and i'm just telling you that anything polk offers for subs is a complete joke. They will never compete w/ the big boy ID companies and will always fall flat in this area. How do i know this, cause i have experience and know what they sound like. Apparently F1 things i am grabbing at straws on this subject, be he has no idea what he is talking about.

    Relax man.... you are comparing apples to oranges here. Most members here have as much experience as I am old.

    The F1's argument was for the money Polk subs aren't bad. And of course an ID sub will be better. Most people aren't ready to drop 1400 on a sub. You should see the looks I get when I say I payed 2G's each for my subs.
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • polrbehr
    polrbehr Posts: 2,825
    Please take no offense to this but polk subs are TERRIBLE.

    If you are a true HT audiophile, there is no business having a Polk sub.

    Heck, even the intro SVS, HSU that is the same cost as polk can stomp a mudhole in them with effortless ease.

    and i'm just telling you that anything polk offers for subs is a complete joke.

    Why don't you tell us how you really feel about Polk subs? You left a few grenades
    on your belt. JHC :(

    So, are you willing to put forth a little effort or are you happy sitting in your skeptical poo pile?


    http://audiomilitia.proboards.com/
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,708
    Why are you hung up on a 1400 dollar sub. Svs, hsu, rythmic, etc. has $500 dollar subs that stomp a mudhole in the almighty 505.

    Because that is the comparison you made. You're still comparing a $250.00 sub with a $500.00 sub......still apples and oranges.

    No one said the 505 was a great sub. What we are saying is it's not fair to state that all Polk subs are terrible based on your experience with the one entry level Polk sub you had.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • codycatalist
    codycatalist Posts: 2,662
    F1nut wrote: »
    Why are you hung up on a 1400 dollar sub. Svs, hsu, rythmic, etc. has $500 dollar subs that stomp a mudhole in the almighty 505.

    Because that is the comparison you made. You're still comparing a $250.00 sub with a $500.00 sub......still apples and oranges.

    No one said the 505 was a great sub. What we are saying is it's not fair to state that all Polk subs are terrible based on your experience with the one entry level Polk sub you had.

    ^^^

    I agree I think you read something wrong somewhere Marc (If that is your real name =P) because F1 never stated that the 505 is the best sub but he said for the money it is a great piece.

    I would hold myself back from saying he doesn't have enough experience.
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • codycatalist
    codycatalist Posts: 2,662
    @honestaquarian Firstly is it funny that for the LONGEST time I thought your name was Honest Harlequin? Wow what a difference two seconds of concentration make.

    I had two subs in my set up previously and enjoyed it but it was more of a whatever I could put together system. Had a PSW110 and sold it to a friend (thought it sounded nice but it is a budget sub for a reason) then I found an 8inch Harman Kardon subwoofer which was alright.

    The only reason it is no in rotation is I found a Velodyne CHT-12 for $20 at my local thrift shop. Not everyone can get a HSU or SVS (Yes even the $500 models) and from what I hear the 505 is a great fit for that type of person. One who wants the best bass possible out of a $200 and below package.

    Tell me a better subwoofer for $200 @marcpamjoce

    You have a nice theater for sure but you seem to look down on anything that isn't up to snuff or what you consider a real subwoofer.

    Just curious what was the very first subwoofer you ever bought?
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • polrbehr
    polrbehr Posts: 2,825
    So, are you willing to put forth a little effort or are you happy sitting in your skeptical poo pile?


    http://audiomilitia.proboards.com/
  • mrloren
    mrloren Posts: 2,454
    Why do I have a VTF 3? Because I like deep bass that I not only can hear but feel.

    When I help someone build a system first thing I ask is "what's the budget". And when I say a sub is going to be $400 for an HSU VTF1 I get that oh no look. So 505 it is. One of my many inlaws has all in-ceiling speakers, they use to have this junkie Earthquake sub. Now the have a 505 and love it. Look around for deals on the 505, I've seen them as low as $149 Fry's promo code. When someone is building a system for a grand 505 is a great choice.
    polrbehr wrote: »

    I bet my good ole STF2 could out slam any one of those subs.

    I went from a 9 year old VTF2 to a new VTF3-MK5 and man what a big difference that was. Someday I will get into the $1k+ subs but not today
    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
    Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
    Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
    Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • polrbehr
    polrbehr Posts: 2,825
    mrloren wrote: »
    Why do I have a VTF 3? Because I like deep bass that I not only can hear but feel.

    When I help someone build a system first thing I ask is "what's the budget". And when I say a sub is going to be $400 for an HSU VTF1 I get that oh no look. So 505 it is. One of my many inlaws has all in-ceiling speakers, they use to have this junkie Earthquake sub. Now the have a 505 and love it. Look around for deals on the 505, I've seen them as low as $149 Fry's promo code. When someone is building a system for a grand 505 is a great choice.
    polrbehr wrote: »

    I bet my good ole STF2 could out slam any one of those subs.

    I went from a 9 year old VTF2 to a new VTF3-MK5 and man what a big difference that was. Someday I will get into the $1k+ subs but not today

    Is that similar to a STFU B) ? I'll bet my 9 y.o. SVS could too, for the money I spent and when you consider you need a hand truck to get it in the house...

    I have not heard a 505, but no one was more surprised than I was when I felt what a DSW Pro 550 could put out, especially for its size. I'm not saying it's an end-game sub, but I can easily tell people they should consider them if they're in the market for one.


    So, are you willing to put forth a little effort or are you happy sitting in your skeptical poo pile?


    http://audiomilitia.proboards.com/
  • mrloren
    mrloren Posts: 2,454
    The STF2 is an older HSU sub http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html

    mine is 12 years old, I got it "B" stock and just had to replace the amp on it for $145. It is my first true sub. before that I had a Sony 12" that I still use at work.
    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
    Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
    Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
    Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • hochpt21
    hochpt21 Posts: 5,423
    Reading this thread title, I thought maybe we were talking about a Roger Waters album. :D
    2 ChannelTurntable - VPI Classic 2/Ortofon 2M BlueAmplification - Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II, Parks Audio Budgie PhonoSpeakers - GoldenEar Triton 17.2 Home TheaterDenon AVR-X3300W; Rotel RMB-1066; Klipsch RP-280F's, Klipsch RP-450C, Polk FXi3's, Polk RC60i; Dual SVS PB 2000's; BenQ HT2050; Elite Screens 120"Man CaveTurntable - Pro-Ject 2.9 Wood/Grado GoldAmplification - Dared SL2000a, McCormack DNA 0.5 DeluxeCD: Cambridge AudioSpeakers - Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary; LSiM 703; SDA 2A
  • spazmo
    spazmo Posts: 21
    I only need one,my Sunfire 12" does just fine.
  • mrbigbluelight
    mrbigbluelight Posts: 9,197
    Well, I guess svs pb12plus/2 would suffice for watching cartoons and such, but I'd recommend quad Funk Audio 21.0L's at a minimum if one is truly interested in an adequate HT experience.



    Sal Palooza
  • mrbigbluelight
    mrbigbluelight Posts: 9,197
    I run those in my bedroom.
    Sal Palooza
  • ZLTFUL
    ZLTFUL Posts: 5,640
    Well, I guess svs pb12plus/2 would suffice for watching cartoons and such, but I'd recommend quad Funk Audio 21.0L's at a minimum if one is truly interested in an adequate HT experience.



    Now 4x) 21.0 would be insane. Are you running those quads or are you speculating? You would need alot of sealed subs to dictate the output of lets say a JTR 4000 or the new PSA V3601, or heck even the new 18" Rythmik. Sealed subs are not any good for HT applications, IMHO. Anywhere around the port tune would spank the sealed subs and in order to introduce sealed subs into a Home Theater, you would NEED room gain to compensate. I have heard both applications and sealed subs don't cut it unless you are a 2 channel audiophile.

    I know quite a few folks who would disagree with you on that sentiment. I know you are expressing your opinion and I won't begrudge you of that at all but there is a reason Jeff (Permanian of JTR fame) still sells both sealed and ported subs.
    Sure, the 4000ULF has massive amounts of output. It was literally making me physically nauseous sitting at less than a meter from it.
    But the caveat here is different strokes for different folks.

    The KC theater crawl in February (see AVSForum) had some good examples of both sealed and ported and even a couple of folder horns. Many folks' favorite theater of the entire crawl was 8 sealed 18s.

    Arguably one of the best theaters on AVSForum is The Savoy. David uses 2 JTR S2s (sealed) and 4 18in sealed MBMs.

    Anyway, you may prefer ported subs but that doesn't mean it is the best or sealed is the worst.
    Like I said...different strokes for different folks.

    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • mikeyb128
    mikeyb128 Posts: 2,885
    edited May 2017
    I used two SB ultras For theater use and they were potent little monsters, they had this slam you in the chest feeling, and had gobs of output. Yes my PB's dig deeper and have more output, but man those little sealed svs ultras kicked some serious a$$ in my basement, enough to get complaints from the neighbor 2 houses over. This was on a cement slab!

    A friend of mine is a huge DIYer, he used 4 sealed 21 inch B&C subs in his room. 2 up front, 2 firing into the back of the couch. Holy sh$t is it amazing.
    Post edited by mikeyb128 on
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    Not being a bass-hole, I do not even use my sub (Polk LSiW) anymore in the HT. The Aerial Acoustics 7T in the front, PSB Synchrony One Center, and PSB Synchrony One in the rear have more than enough bass for movies. Freaking Interstellar pops the dedicated 20 amp breaker for the HT from the bass in the opening scene.
    Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD; Pass XP-22 pre; X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers; SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
    Three 20 amp circuits.
  • gp4jesus
    gp4jesus Posts: 1,969
    edited May 2017
    BlueFox wrote: »
    The Aerial Acoustics 7T in the front, PSB Synchrony One Center, and PSB Synchrony One in the rear have more than enough bass for movies. Freaking Interstellar pops the dedicated 20 amp breaker for the HT from the bass in the opening scene.
    You need another (or 2) dedicated 20 A feed(s). I "upgraded" at my new place.

    Tony

    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside* & out 8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out *soldered LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & “Plugged*” Mids - 981, connected w/MP Premiere ICs Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s *Xschop's handy work
  • gp4jesus
    gp4jesus Posts: 1,969
    I hafta moving the last of the crap from my old place to storage, Goodwill, or wherever. [then] finish connecting/powering my surrounds.

    I'm considering using my Audio Pro* sub as a dedicated rear channel sub, just for fun. W/surrounds set to Large as it* digs quite well into the high 20s. Maybe doesn't compare to some subs but should do well for the rear.

    Tony
    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside* & out 8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out *soldered LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & “Plugged*” Mids - 981, connected w/MP Premiere ICs Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s *Xschop's handy work
  • gp4jesus
    gp4jesus Posts: 1,969
    gp4jesus wrote: »
    I'm considering using my Audio Pro* Evidence** sub (8", f3, 27hz) as a dedicated rear channel sub, just for fun. W/surrounds set to Large, should be interesting.
    Just picked up a second Evidence** - one for each surround channel. One, as above, WAS interesting. Two? Can't wait till Sunday after church.

    Tony
    Samsung 60" UN60ES6100 LED Outlaw Audio 976 Pre/Pro Samsung BDP, Amazon Firestick, Phillips CD Changer Canare 14 ga - LCR tweeters inside*; Ctr Ch outside BJC 10 ga - LCR mids, inside* & out 8 ga Powerline: LR woofers, inside* & out *soldered LR: Tri-amped RTi A7 w/Rotels. Woofers - 980BX; Tweets & “Plugged*” Mids - 981, connected w/MP Premiere ICs Ctr Ch: Rotel RB981 -> Bi-amped CSi A6 Surrounds: Premiere ICs ->Rotel 981 -> AR 12 ga -> RTi A3. 5 Subs: Sunfire True SW Signature -> LFE & Ctr Ch; 4 Audio Pro Evidence @ the “Corners”. Power Conditioning & Distribution: 4 dedicated 20A feeds; APC H15; 5 Furman Miniport 20s *Xschop's handy work
  • Using the 'Golden Ratio' for sub placement, my Emotiva DC-1 has all outputs active. I feed a MiniDSP that does all the correction that the dual subs didn't account for. My delay lines are setup, house curve setup along with a flat response profile.

    I don't think there is really any con to multiple subs other than additional footprint being taken up.