tsx 330T a little bright sounding for music ??

so i have a set of these TSX330T speakers. the cymbol hits seem a little harsh, the mids for rock guitar seem a little bright and slightly fatiguing to me. anyone else feel the same way about theirs.

im not sure if its my Cambridge integrated amp which the bass and treble knobs barley do a thing so its hard to warm up the sound. i like really warm mids.

for what i paid for these speakers they sound great but they are not warm enough for my taste.. i got a set of bipolar definitive towers that are way to bright and the mid range is just airy and held back.. not good rock and roll speakers at all. overall sound qulity is amazing but the tone is not good to my ear.. i have a set of energy book shelf speakers and on this amp they sound very dark, a little too dark.. on my old denon receiver they did not so so dark.. on the denon the bass and trebel knobs adjusted a lot more frequency range

but anyone else think there a little on the bright or harsh side ?

Cambridge Azur 651A
Polk LSi M703
Sonos Connect




«13

Comments

  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,704
    Those are entry level speakers meant more for HT use than 2 channel music. The Signature series might be more to your taste.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

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    President of Club Polk

  • gmcman
    gmcman Posts: 1,739
    What are you using as your source...cd, mp3?
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,902
    F1nut wrote: »
    Those are entry level speakers meant more for HT use than 2 channel music. The Signature series might be more to your taste.

    This ^^^

    Though everything else in the chain will also have an effect on the sound you hear, from the source your using, files, receiver, cables, even the room and positioning.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • i think there nice sounding speakers. just a little on the bright side, just wondering others have noticed the same. they were really inexpensive so i picked them up. i have a set of definitive bipolars that are really bright which i hate and i have a set of energys that sound kind of dark all tested in the same room. these polks sound good for a cheap set of speakers. im actually thinking about getting the LSIM703, i have always wanted a really nice set of book shelf speakers.. my amp is a Cambridge i got bluejeans interconnects and i forget what kind of speaker wire but its pure oxygen free copper10 guage wire that seems to be well liked... i play flack files or CD's the flack files sound exactly like the CD. i cant tell a difference when i play the same son on flack or cd
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • strange but i decided to try and adjust the toe in of the speakers again. to start i decided to i put them so there was not any toe in and they sound allot better this way which is strange. they do not sound as harsh now. when i start to tow them in they start to sound bright and harsh.

    for a cheap set of speakers they sound very good, they are not detailed like a higher end set of speakers, they lack the separation you hear in higher end speakers, the overall tone of the speaker is pretty well rounded and they are detailed enough to not sound like a set of chap speakers.

    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 7,658
    There is a way to reduce the tweeter's output. The speaker offers a dual set of binding posts on the rear of the cabinet. If you removed the binding post jumper plate between the two positive terminals and placed a small value resistor, say 4 ohms, between the two positive binding posts that would reduce the tweeter's output. You might want to try a couple of different values, a nice 3 Watt metal film resistor from Dale would be a good choice. I can probably find some values to send you if you'd like to try.
  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,902
    i think there nice sounding speakers. just a little on the bright side, just wondering others have noticed the same. they were really inexpensive so i picked them up. i have a set of definitive bipolars that are really bright which i hate and i have a set of energys that sound kind of dark all tested in the same room. these polks sound good for a cheap set of speakers. im actually thinking about getting the LSIM703, i have always wanted a really nice set of book shelf speakers.. my amp is a Cambridge i got bluejeans interconnects and i forget what kind of speaker wire but its pure oxygen free copper10 guage wire that seems to be well liked... i play flack files or CD's the flack files sound exactly like the CD. i cant tell a difference when i play the same son on flack or cd

    Cambridge makes nice stuff, but to be honest, the further up the speaker series you go, the more the short comings of those cables will be revealed. If your sensitive to fatigue on the top end, or are looking for more separation in your musical presentation, cables certainly play a role there. I think if you move up to the LSIM series, some consideration to better cabling should be on your radar. Just a suggestion anyway.

    Which Cambridge do you have btw ? Their signature sound is a tad on the warm side of neutral in my opinion. Is it an integrated ? What is doing your digital conversion to analog ?
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • tonyb wrote: »
    i think there nice sounding speakers. just a little on the bright side, just wondering others have noticed the same. they were really inexpensive so i picked them up. i have a set of definitive bipolars that are really bright which i hate and i have a set of energys that sound kind of dark all tested in the same room. these polks sound good for a cheap set of speakers. im actually thinking about getting the LSIM703, i have always wanted a really nice set of book shelf speakers.. my amp is a Cambridge i got bluejeans interconnects and i forget what kind of speaker wire but its pure oxygen free copper10 guage wire that seems to be well liked... i play flack files or CD's the flack files sound exactly like the CD. i cant tell a difference when i play the same son on flack or cd

    Cambridge makes nice stuff, but to be honest, the further up the speaker series you go, the more the short comings of those cables will be revealed. If your sensitive to fatigue on the top end, or are looking for more separation in your musical presentation, cables certainly play a role there. I think if you move up to the LSIM series, some consideration to better cabling should be on your radar. Just a suggestion anyway.

    Which Cambridge do you have btw ? Their signature sound is a tad on the warm side of neutral in my opinion. Is it an integrated ? What is doing your digital conversion to analog ?

    you think cables make a big difference ?, i feel they do change the sound slightly.. i have purchased a few interconnects that were in the 50-100 dollar range they all sound comparable but only slightly different, i also have a set for the green audio quest interconnects, there a little brighter and maybe slightly cleaner than the blue jeans.

    my sonos connect is my DAC lol.. i had bought a Cambridge DAC but it sounded very sterile and rock and roll music sounded dull with that dac. my integrated amp is the azur 651A

    at one time i had a set of mirage 595iS bipolar speakers, those are the only speakers i have every owned that have been happy with. they burnt up 2 crossovers and than the surround rings started to come off the the speakers so i finally decided it was time to retire them. i have always like the polk audio sound and their high end speaker always sounded great in the shop and i had a set of polk car speakers back in the day that sounded awesome. plus i have had a few sets of low end polks over the years and i always enjoyed them..
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • my definitive have amazing separation. listening to something like Doyle lawson where you got a few guys singing harmony, i can hear each voice separately and the singers sound like they are in the room with me. acoustic guitar when some one slides their fingers across the strings it sounds natural like the guitar is in the room with me. for music with clean instruments these speaker shine but they lack overall warmth IMO.

    the the major problem with these definitive is for rock and roll music. the vocalist sounds like he is in the room with me, the bass player and the drummer sound like they are in the room with me.. the guitar player sounds like he is down the hall instead of being in the room with the rest of the band.. its like the guitar is drawn back and off in the distance instead of being out front and driving the music like it should be. the sound of the guitar is very laid back and airy sounding, its not driving at all its just held back and boring. there is also very little warmth to the overdriven guitar in most rock songs. it sounds nothing like the sound that comes out of a guitar amplifier. its thin and bright and off in the distance.

    on a scale of 1-10 1 being dark bassy sounding and 10 being ear busting high pitched, 5 being a perfect bled of both. i would say they are a 7.5 .... some recordings that are recorded on the brighter side, the vocals sound naisely and unpleasant and the midrange jusut feels too held back.

    i got these speakers on close out for a couple hundred bucks, i knew i did not really care for definatives sound but i knew they overall sound quality was good and i thought maybe i would learn to like them. i realize i should just get the ones i want and stop trying to save a few bucks.


    now thesepolks that i have, for rock music the guitar is out front, its driving hits hard hitting its right behind the vocals where it should be. the drums and bass sound like they are backing the music like they should be. the guitar sounds similar to the sound that comes out of a guitar amp...

    but with these polks i feel like i am listening to music from a speaker, i do not feel like any of he musicians are in the room with me. they do not have that rich natural sound. the over all tone of these speakers seems pretty nice tho . cymbol hits are a little on the harsh side on some songs and its slightly fatiguing, less so now that i re positioned them.. but overall there a pretty nice sounding speaker on the cheap.

    im going to say they are about a 6 and very close to being neutral if the cymbols were a little less harsh i would say they are pretty neutral.. i think i prefer a speaker that is about a 4 on that chart tho, just slightly on the warmer side of neutral. when i had the speakers toed in they were a little fatiguing on the ears tho.

    the LSiM series seem to be slightly on the warmer side of neutral from what i remember and i know in reviews people say they are on the warm side but not dark.. i have not actually heard the 703, nowhere in my area has them in stock. i have heard one of the floor standing version of the SLMi series a little while back and it sounded beautiful from what I remember. i have never taken a speaker home and it sound the same way it did in the store. but i can order a set at best buy and if i am not happy i can take them back. our local stereo shop will tell you can you return things but if you try to take something back they basically say sorry about your luck so i don't shop there any more.

    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • gmcman
    gmcman Posts: 1,739
    Can you draw or take a pic of your room? Many things can come into play, like cancellations or reflections.

    When I first bought my RT800's, I didn't really take much consideration into the room. I did however make a speaker cable change about 6 months into owning them...and that's where the rabbit hole started.

    Have you tried a different source..like a different CD player and a regular CD? I never realized my Denon 2910 was bright until I changed it out...never really thought about it until someone suggested it.
  • i have a rather odd set up as far as the room goes but its what i have to work with. you will also see why i want to get some book shelf speakers. and the sub actually sounds better where it is than on the floor, allot of people always say it would sound better on the floor but it does not.

    but this is my room in the house where i can do my own thing when i want. other people live here and they always got the TV on playing show i do not want to watch. im not really a tv person and everyone else is not really a music people.





    46v6aomcllyh.jpg
    30aecw1oedt1.jpg


    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • msg
    msg Posts: 9,306
    Hey Danny, welcome to the forum.
    Man, sure sounds like you know what you're after. That's a good thing.

    I have to echo moving to a different line/up the line a bit, and I'd also say maybe check out the Signature Series, as well. The S20 bookshelf speaker looks pretty beefy, and it may fit what you're looking for performance and placement wise. Reviews around here so far on the Signatures have been very favorable.

    Wondering though with the space, whether a front ported speaker would be a better fit?

    Your consideration for the LSiM703 - I can't speak to how they'll perform with respect to your required music specifics as your descriptions of imaging, presence and speakers disappearing are beyond anything I've really experienced, however, I can say that the 703 has been a great all around performer for me, and just seemed to get better with time. They get pretty low, so even running in straight 2ch, you'll wonder whether you've got a sub engaged at times. They sound surprisingly big for their size, and I think they'd sound good in your space if properly powered and placed. You'll want to get some pads or something to use underneath them for isolation.

    I do see what you mean about your space being a bit difficult to work with. With some good bookshelf speakers, you could save some space and dump the sub, unless you really want huge low-low bass impact.

    703s don't sound their best in a room if they're too close to the back wall. I had mine maybe about 8" to a foot off the wall, and inside two floor standing speakers, which I didn't think would affect the sound quality. I was wrong, and they just sounded cramped; dirty. In another smaller space, again, close to a back wall, not quite as clean, and a constant pressure in my ears for the listening position. I think this was standing waves, maybe? When I got them out 24", the presentation cleaned up significantly. I really couldn't get over the difference, so placement is a big deal.

    Pulling from your signature, you're using the Cambridge Azur 651A?
    https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/products/hifi-and-home-cinema/azur-651a

    I'm not familiar with this unit and not sure what kind of current it offers, but quick read says 75wpc at 8Ω. Not sure how the 703s will work or sound with this, but they're reputed to be relatively easy to drive. As with all speakers, will sound best with some good current driving them. I do agree that TSX 330T probably won't get you where you want to be, and you already know the placement is off for them, with a bookshelf perhaps a better choice.

    I think in this case, I'd probably start with the S20 and a pair of pads to see whether it suits you and works with your existing gear. Then, if not consider the 703 and maybe an amp upgrade, not necessarily in that order. One piece at a time. Hate to say it, but you seem to have some pretty serious expectations there for sound, and you may need upgrades in a few different areas to get you there.

    It can be kind of difficult pulling a system together if you're married to a particular component, but I've heard and am a believer in not trying to build a system around a pair of speakers that aren't to your liking, or aren't particularly known for being able to perform as you would like. I made this mistake when I first started with a pair of RTi10s. I tried like heck to make them work for music, but they just didn't work out. 703s and some Monitor 10s were more to my liking, and even then, after 3-4 months of obsessing over the RTi10s and gear, it took some time for my ears to settle, the RTi10s were that miserable for me. The LSiM series and Vintage Polks are really quite nice. Obviously many other brands to choose from, but if you like Polk, these two lines are good choices, with the Signature Series making a name for itself. I've been very curious about the S20, myself and trying to find an excuse for a pair.

    And yes, cables are known to transform a system that previously just wasn't working out. Cables will make a profound difference in the areas you're looking to address with imaging and presence. In your position, if you get some quality basics in place, personally, I'd be making some broader moves first and get your speakers and integrated/amp in the ballpark of what you're after.
    I disabled signatures.
  • msg
    msg Posts: 9,306
    From a quick search for amplification type...
    Specs and weight don't tell the whole story, but just for a little info on the unit build
    http://www.hifi-review.com/152664-cambridge-audio-azur-651a.html
    I disabled signatures.
  • msg wrote: »
    From a quick search for amplification type...
    Specs and weight don't tell the whole story, but just for a little info on the unit build
    http://www.hifi-review.com/152664-cambridge-audio-azur-651a.html

    i read allot about this amp and the build and read many reviews on audiophile type sites which all seemed to love it. it sounds pretty similar to my denon but much cleaner and smoother and it does get pretty loud pretty quick, with the volume knob half way the thing screams... when i went to the local stereo shop to check the amp out they had it hooked up to a set of crazy expensive speakers but decided to get it and its a nice amp.. i just brought my denon amp up from the basement to do a comparison test again a couple of days ago and the Cambridge does sound better.

    one thing i can say is i had a really warm set of speakers for many years.. and after that i got a set of speakers that were on the dark side that i listened to for several years. that might be part of why i think these speakers are bright.. some of my friends do not seem to think they are that bright.

    as someone asked earlier my speaker wire is KnuKonceptz Kord Kable 10 Gauge, over sized Oxygen Free Copper speaker cable 462 strands. i have had a few other brands as well and i decided to try a heavy gauge wire this time. i have never heard a difference in sound from different speaker wire. interconnects yes but not speaker wire.
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • msg wrote: »
    Hey Danny, welcome to the forum.
    Man, sure sounds like you know what you're after. That's a good thing.

    I have to echo moving to a different line/up the line a bit, and I'd also say maybe check out the Signature Series, as well. The S20 bookshelf speaker looks pretty beefy, and it may fit what you're looking for performance and placement wise. Reviews around here so far on the Signatures have been very favorable.

    Wondering though with the space, whether a front ported speaker would be a better fit?

    Your consideration for the LSiM703 - I can't speak to how they'll perform with respect to your required music specifics as your descriptions of imaging, presence and speakers disappearing are beyond anything I've really experienced, however, I can say that the 703 has been a great all around performer for me, and just seemed to get better with time. They get pretty low, so even running in straight 2ch, you'll wonder whether you've got a sub engaged at times. They sound surprisingly big for their size, and I think they'd sound good in your space if properly powered and placed. You'll want to get some pads or something to use underneath them for isolation.

    I do see what you mean about your space being a bit difficult to work with. With some good bookshelf speakers, you could save some space and dump the sub, unless you really want huge low-low bass impact.

    703s don't sound their best in a room if they're too close to the back wall. I had mine maybe about 8" to a foot off the wall, and inside two floor standing speakers, which I didn't think would affect the sound quality. I was wrong, and they just sounded cramped; dirty. In another smaller space, again, close to a back wall, not quite as clean, and a constant pressure in my ears for the listening position. I think this was standing waves, maybe? When I got them out 24", the presentation cleaned up significantly. I really couldn't get over the difference, so placement is a big deal.

    Pulling from your signature, you're using the Cambridge Azur 651A?
    https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/products/hifi-and-home-cinema/azur-651a

    I'm not familiar with this unit and not sure what kind of current it offers, but quick read says 75wpc at 8Ω. Not sure how the 703s will work or sound with this, but they're reputed to be relatively easy to drive. As with all speakers, will sound best with some good current driving them. I do agree that TSX 330T probably won't get you where you want to be, and you already know the placement is off for them, with a bookshelf perhaps a better choice.

    I think in this case, I'd probably start with the S20 and a pair of pads to see whether it suits you and works with your existing gear. Then, if not consider the 703 and maybe an amp upgrade, not necessarily in that order. One piece at a time. Hate to say it, but you seem to have some pretty serious expectations there for sound, and you may need upgrades in a few different areas to get you there.

    It can be kind of difficult pulling a system together if you're married to a particular component, but I've heard and am a believer in not trying to build a system around a pair of speakers that aren't to your liking, or aren't particularly known for being able to perform as you would like. I made this mistake when I first started with a pair of RTi10s. I tried like heck to make them work for music, but they just didn't work out. 703s and some Monitor 10s were more to my liking, and even then, after 3-4 months of obsessing over the RTi10s and gear, it took some time for my ears to settle, the RTi10s were that miserable for me. The LSiM series and Vintage Polks are really quite nice. Obviously many other brands to choose from, but if you like Polk, these two lines are good choices, with the Signature Series making a name for itself. I've been very curious about the S20, myself and trying to find an excuse for a pair.

    And yes, cables are known to transform a system that previously just wasn't working out. Cables will make a profound difference in the areas you're looking to address with imaging and presence. In your position, if you get some quality basics in place, personally, I'd be making some broader moves first and get your speakers and integrated/amp in the ballpark of what you're after.

    these have a front firing bass port and if i turn my sub off i almost cant tell its off so i think front port does work well in this room.

    when you say to get some book shelf's and pads i'm not really sure what pads are. i have been into home audio about 20 years now, maybe longer. i have liked it since i was probably 14 or 15 years old. main problem is being able to afford good gear..

    i fee like i hear every flaw in a set of speakers and i do more thinking about how they sound that enjoying the music i think. i wish i were not like that. my old mirage speakers i never really did that with..

    the polk 703, kef q300, and there was a set of B&W speakers that all seem appealing.
    as far as the new signature series at their price i figured there just a nother set of entry level type speakers. ill have to check some of those out..
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • mrloren
    mrloren Posts: 2,454
    I agree with the Signature S20 would be a better fit in your room. I have a pair in the bedroom HT I like. I went from the RTI8/RTI4 to Signature S60/S20 for my main HT speakers. Yes they are a lot warmer than the RTi.

    For your speaker cable the KnuKonceptz Kord Kable 10 Gauge is just thick wire. I would get some Furez from Doug http://douglasconnection.com/Raw-Speaker-Cable_c33.htm 10 or 12 AWG would do you good. I went from Monoprice 12AWG to the 10AWG Furez and did notice a nice warming difference.
    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
    Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
    Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
    Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • so you guys think the S20 may actually sound better in my room than the 703 will ??

    i could position the back of the speakers about 15 inches away from the wall, i would think my amp would be able to power they pretty well. but im not sure..

    i know the 703 is a pretty high end speaker. im not so sure the signature are what you wold consider high end or not, i have not heard much about them yet..
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • gmcman
    gmcman Posts: 1,739
    edited May 2017
    Well, I know I can't say for sure without listening...but it's a safe bet you're not going to get what you're after with your speakers with them sitting on your dresser...they are too high.

    You are likely getting some reflections from the ceiling and they are amplifying the highs from the tweeters.

    I would at least try them on the ground and maybe even move the dresser just to experiment. I honestly believe you will be chasing your tail with tower speakers like that being positioned that far up.
  • gmcman wrote: »
    Well, I know I can't say for sure without listening...but it's a safe bet you're not going to get what you're after with your speakers with them sitting on your dresser...they are too high.

    You are likely getting some reflections from the ceiling and they are amplifying the highs from the tweeters.

    I would at least try them on the ground and maybe even move the dresser just to experiment. I honestly believe you will be chasing your tail with tower speakers like that being positioned that far up.

    i got about 20 inches from the ceiling, i occasionally hear sounds from my speaker coming from some other place in the room which really should not happen, i was kind of thinking its the side wall or ceiling reflecting the sound some place. but its only every so often that i hear that happen.

    i remember flipping the speakers upside down once to see if it would drastically change the sound but it did not make a huge difference. i really don't have any other place to move the dresser.
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • msg
    msg Posts: 9,306
    edited May 2017
    Okay good, so you did some research on the integrated.

    Pads are a thing that Dan (@EndersShadow) told me about. They're for speaker isolation and also positioning/angling. Bookshelf speakers are to be de-coupled (isolated) from the stand/cabinet/base they're sitting on, and the stand/cabinet/base to be coupled ("joined") to the floor, typically spikes on the feet of stands. Start with speakers, then try pads and see what you think. Some prefer smaller contact points for the decoupling pads, using something as simple as Blu-tack.
    https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007YFWUDO

    15" would be helpful. You'll just play around with placement to see what sounds best to you, but they may do pretty well with 15" or less. Give them some room to breathe on the sides, as well. I'd consider taking the sub out of the picture for a while. It'll be good for seeing what any new speakers are capable of, aid in driver break-in, and give you the breathing room you need for the speakers. if you can get a base to elevate your tv, and put your components beneath, that would be even better.

    I can't really comment on how the S20s sound in comparison to 703s, since I've not heard both, but there are some here who have. I know @DSkip could offer some insight here; others as well.

    Curious, have you tried the 330s on the floor? even with one in the corner to the right of your cabinet? For what you're after I think any speaker is going to need some breathing room.

    By all means, no need to stick with Polk, obviously. There are some who prefer other bookshelf speakers over 703s, but not sure of the cost vs. sound quality. Since you're open to that, though hopefully the others can make some recommendations.

    Once you get settled in speakers, I second MrLoren's suggestion re: the Furez cable from Douglas Connection. My experience was similar. Smoother sound, greater presence of subtle details. Good cables can reduce congestion and offer increased clarity and separation, among other benefits.

    Another option, have you ever considered delving into headphones? Maybe simplify the main system, but go headphone for the stereo refinements you're after?
    I disabled signatures.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,704
    The Power Port on the S20 and LSiM703 helps with rear wall placement, but in your situation I think the suggestion of front ported or maybe even better, sealed would be the answer.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • msg
    msg Posts: 9,306
    edited May 2017
    Jes, can't remember, are/were you running some front ported bookshelf speakers? Trying to remember what you were using in the stands couple/decouple es'perment.

    You might also consider BlowTorch Audio Werks.
    I disabled signatures.
  • mrloren
    mrloren Posts: 2,454
    Bookshelf speakers would bring down the tweeter height a lot.

    One thing I forgot to say about the Furez or any speaker wire. Make sure you terminate it with some quality banana plugs. Doug sells some nice silver Furez for $25 a set. or Amazon has Audioquest silver BFA for $60 a dozen.

    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
    Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
    Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
    Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • these polks are front ported and they belt out some bass in this room., all others speakers i had were rear ported and none of them produced bass like these. my sub is rear ported and it sounds great where its positioned.

    i have these banana plugs. i decided to get these not long ago and they did not change the sound when i installed them. https://www.amazon.com/Sewell-Direct-SW-29863-6-Deadbolt-6-Pairs/dp/B007QUYQSY/ref=pd_sim_23_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B007QUYQSY&pd_rd_r=KY7FM9TJDDJGQASVBFJ0&pd_rd_w=QZeAP&pd_rd_wg=0rgbG&psc=1&refRID=KY7FM9TJDDJGQASVBFJ0

    in my room speakers on the floor is not really good work.. i did flip some towers upside down once to see how they sounded with the speakers not up so high and i did not notice a huge difference

    i have never heard of pads for bookshelf speakers, ill look into those...

    ok. looking at the speaker wire. im not really sure how its so different from what i have. both are oxygen free pure copper wire speaker wire is just basically plain old strands of copper so if its good quality copper im not sure how that would change the sound.. can someone explain how that speaker wire would be better ? its not expensive so i could give it a try i just not sure how it could make a difference unless my wire is made out of lower quality copper which it does not seem to be as far as i know.
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,902
    tonyb wrote: »
    i think there nice sounding speakers. just a little on the bright side, just wondering others have noticed the same. they were really inexpensive so i picked them up. i have a set of definitive bipolars that are really bright which i hate and i have a set of energys that sound kind of dark all tested in the same room. these polks sound good for a cheap set of speakers. im actually thinking about getting the LSIM703, i have always wanted a really nice set of book shelf speakers.. my amp is a Cambridge i got bluejeans interconnects and i forget what kind of speaker wire but its pure oxygen free copper10 guage wire that seems to be well liked... i play flack files or CD's the flack files sound exactly like the CD. i cant tell a difference when i play the same son on flack or cd

    Cambridge makes nice stuff, but to be honest, the further up the speaker series you go, the more the short comings of those cables will be revealed. If your sensitive to fatigue on the top end, or are looking for more separation in your musical presentation, cables certainly play a role there. I think if you move up to the LSIM series, some consideration to better cabling should be on your radar. Just a suggestion anyway.

    Which Cambridge do you have btw ? Their signature sound is a tad on the warm side of neutral in my opinion. Is it an integrated ? What is doing your digital conversion to analog ?

    you think cables make a big difference ?, i feel they do change the sound slightly.. i have purchased a few interconnects that were in the 50-100 dollar range they all sound comparable but only slightly different, i also have a set for the green audio quest interconnects, there a little brighter and maybe slightly cleaner than the blue jeans.

    my sonos connect is my DAC lol.. i had bought a Cambridge DAC but it sounded very sterile and rock and roll music sounded dull with that dac. my integrated amp is the azur 651A

    at one time i had a set of mirage 595iS bipolar speakers, those are the only speakers i have every owned that have been happy with. they burnt up 2 crossovers and than the surround rings started to come off the the speakers so i finally decided it was time to retire them. i have always like the polk audio sound and their high end speaker always sounded great in the shop and i had a set of polk car speakers back in the day that sounded awesome. plus i have had a few sets of low end polks over the years and i always enjoyed them..

    A few suggestions, some already covered by others.

    Seeing your limitations in the pic speaks volumes. Definitely go with a bookshelf type of speaker like the 703's. Maybe move that subwoofer down to the left side of that dresser. Having the gear ontop of the sub is giving you unwanted vibrations.

    I also have 2 Sonos connects, one is a Cullen modded version. Neither one's internal dac floated my boat. I use a Cary Xciter dac with mine and the sound improved greatly. Think I paid 400 bucks for mine a few years ago. Obviously there are many other dacs out there, but I'm a big proponent of using external dacs with these small digital devices to get them up to snuff of a cd player. Like everything though, comes down to matching gear's sound signatures that play to your preferences. Also, if your playing MP3 files or music from a service like Spotify or most any other, that music is also MP3 quality which will never sound as good as your downloaded files in lossless. Which also brings up, hope the music you have on your computer is in a lossless format like flac or apple lossless.

    Cables, like everything else, is again a matching of sound signatures that compliment your gear and your preferences. Given what you already stated about musical preferences and sound, and given you want to get the LSIM 703's, some cable brands to look at that I think will do well for you....

    MIT
    Acoustic Zen
    Wireworld
    Analysis plus

    Now, don't get sticker shock when you google up those names. Many of us buy on the used markets where prices are half or more than half of retail. I use a combination of brands, Acoustic Zen Satori speaker cables and Matrix Interconnects, Analysis plus crystal oval interconnects, Wireworld Eclipse interconnects.

    Don't want to go there yet ? One of our members sells cables, makes them too, Douglas connections, and Doug is a great guy to deal with so have no reservations. His prices are about as reasonable as one can ask for....for the quality you'll get. Many other brands to look at too like Audioquest and Kimber cable but it's like going into an ice cream shop and deciding on what flavor suits you out of the 40 available. Know what I'm sayin' ?

    To sum up, I believe the speakers themselves will make the biggest difference for you with where you want to go sound wise, but they aren't the only thing in the chain holding you back. Placement is key in that room, which your limited to bookies in my opinion. Getting the Sonos to sound like a cd player with better separation of instruments and all those other audio terms we like to throw around is also key. Adding a warmer sounding dac in the mix will help in that regard immensely. Matching up the right cables can take a bit of trial and error on your part.

    Good luck to you, and I hope you enjoy those 703's if you get them.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • mrloren
    mrloren Posts: 2,454
    these polks are front ported and they belt out some bass in this room., all others speakers i had were rear ported and none of them produced bass like these. my sub is rear ported and it sounds great where its positioned.

    i have these banana plugs. i decided to get these not long ago and they did not change the sound when i installed them. https://www.amazon.com/Sewell-Direct-SW-29863-6-Deadbolt-6-Pairs/dp/B007QUYQSY/ref=pd_sim_23_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B007QUYQSY&pd_rd_r=KY7FM9TJDDJGQASVBFJ0&pd_rd_w=QZeAP&pd_rd_wg=0rgbG&psc=1&refRID=KY7FM9TJDDJGQASVBFJ0

    in my room speakers on the floor is not really good work.. i did flip some towers upside down once to see how they sounded with the speakers not up so high and i did not notice a huge difference

    i have never heard of pads for bookshelf speakers, ill look into those...

    ok. looking at the speaker wire. im not really sure how its so different from what i have. both are oxygen free pure copper wire speaker wire is just basically plain old strands of copper so if its good quality copper im not sure how that would change the sound.. can someone explain how that speaker wire would be better ? its not expensive so i could give it a try i just not sure how it could make a difference unless my wire is made out of lower quality copper which it does not seem to be as far as i know.

    Those plugs are just brass with a little, very little gold covering them. I had some GLS locking plugs that were made from the same stuff, yes they worked good till I changed to these https://www.amazon.com/SureGrip-100-Bananas-Silver-Audioquest/dp/B01ERUR330/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1494520566&sr=1-1&keywords=Audioquest+SureGrip+100+BFA

    These gave me a nice hello
    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.
    Family Room:LG QNED80 75", Onkyo RZ50 Emotiva XPA3 GEN3 Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM. Main: Polk LsiM 705Center: Polk LSiM 704CFront High/Rear High In-Ceiling Polk 80F/X RT Surrounds: Polk S15 Sub: HSU VTF3-MK5
    Bed Room; Marantz SR5010, BDP-S270Main: Polk Signature S20Center: Polk Signature S35Rear: Polk R15 Sub: SVS SB2000
    Working Warehouse; Yamaha A-S301, Sony DVP-NS3100ES for disc Plok TSX550T SVS PB2000 Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • mrloren wrote: »
    these polks are front ported and they belt out some bass in this room., all others speakers i had were rear ported and none of them produced bass like these. my sub is rear ported and it sounds great where its positioned.

    i have these banana plugs. i decided to get these not long ago and they did not change the sound when i installed them. https://www.amazon.com/Sewell-Direct-SW-29863-6-Deadbolt-6-Pairs/dp/B007QUYQSY/ref=pd_sim_23_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B007QUYQSY&pd_rd_r=KY7FM9TJDDJGQASVBFJ0&pd_rd_w=QZeAP&pd_rd_wg=0rgbG&psc=1&refRID=KY7FM9TJDDJGQASVBFJ0

    in my room speakers on the floor is not really good work.. i did flip some towers upside down once to see how they sounded with the speakers not up so high and i did not notice a huge difference

    i have never heard of pads for bookshelf speakers, ill look into those...

    ok. looking at the speaker wire. im not really sure how its so different from what i have. both are oxygen free pure copper wire speaker wire is just basically plain old strands of copper so if its good quality copper im not sure how that would change the sound.. can someone explain how that speaker wire would be better ? its not expensive so i could give it a try i just not sure how it could make a difference unless my wire is made out of lower quality copper which it does not seem to be as far as i know.

    Those plugs are just brass with a little, very little gold covering them. I had some GLS locking plugs that were made from the same stuff, yes they worked good till I changed to these https://www.amazon.com/SureGrip-100-Bananas-Silver-Audioquest/dp/B01ERUR330/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1494520566&sr=1-1&keywords=Audioquest+SureGrip+100+BFA

    These gave me a nice hello

    i see they have silver and gold.. is there much of a difference.. i see the BFA 100 and the BFA 300 which is a little less money..
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • littlewoodboats
    littlewoodboats Posts: 823
    edited May 2017
    How do you feel about going vintage? I am not a big fan of ports at ear level. The Monitor 5 jr+ seems more forgiving to a less than optimal set up such as yours. The ports of your current speaks right in your face might be the overwhelming factor on sub placement. Crossed 80hz the sub placement should not matter much in your situation.

    For me personally I would hold off on any major gear changes (including cables) until you have speakers in place you enjoy.
  • How do you feel about going vintage? I am not a big fan of ports at ear level. The Monitor 5 jr+ seems more forgiving to a less than optimal set up such as yours. The ports of the current speaks right in your face might be the overwhelming factor on sub placement. Crossed 80hz the sub placement should not matter much in your situation.

    i would rather go with something newer. older speaker can start running into issues and without having any idea what they sound like, so i would be pretty reluctant to buy some older used speakers.
    Cambridge Azur 651A
    Polk LSi M703
    Sonos Connect




  • littlewoodboats
    littlewoodboats Posts: 823
    edited May 2017

    i would rather go with something newer. older speaker can start running into issues and without having any idea what they sound like, so i would be pretty reluctant to buy some older used speakers.

    You are correct that going vintage can have its issues. With vintage Polk's we are lucky with rubber surrounds plus simple crossovers that would need updating. With the LSIM series they would always be able to grow with your space.

    If your budget allows I would go with the 703's. Your current space is what it is so all you can do is deal with it to the best of your ability with thoughts to the future.