Rti12 Set UP

mufsoman

The new Rti12's just arrived today. Tomorrow night I plan on setting them up in place of the Rti8's. I was reading Mike Lomanaco thread on his Rti12 set up. I don't want to regurgitate the same questions, a bit concerned on the double filtering that was discussed and other tweaks. I will let my ears direct me to the proper settings, but looking for help with where to start. Sheradp already shared some suggestions, but with my set up, as listed below, should I set speakers large or small? With the SC07 and no external amps, which cross over setting will stress the Pioneer least? Should the SVS have two ports plugged to get as much frequency response below the Rti12? I don't use the SVS EQ on the Bash amp, I have it turned all the way down, is this correct? I know lots of questions........Thanks. Pics of the new set up to follow.

leroyjr1

I ran mine 80hz for HT with the sub set at 80hz. Music I turned the sub off and ran them at large/full range. Play around with the settings and see what sounds best.

comfortablycurt

You've got a pretty competent sub, so I'd run the 12's as small. An 80 hz crossover point on the 12's would be a good place to start.

Regarding the double filtering...

Assuming that you're using the crossover settings for the sub in the receiver, you would want to turns the SVS's EQ all the way up. The EQ should be disengaged when it's receiving an LFE signal, but it's best to turn it all the way up just to avoid that possibility of double filtering.

A good setting to start with for the sub(in your AVR) would be 120 hz.

mufsoman

Curt, not sure I understand "turning the EQ" all the way up on the SVS? I use the SC-07 to manage the bass crossover, so the xover setting on the SVS is turned off. I thought I had the EQ set to bypass it since I have not gone through a detailed analysis of my room. For the EQ calibration I have "Q" set to Hi, "Level" set to min and "Freq" set to 20hz. Is this not right? Which one should be turned all the way up to avoid the double filtering??? I use a standard Blue Jeans Cable sub cable from the Poineer to the SVS.

mufsoman

I know there's lots of SVS users out there..... Do I have the appropriate settings (as listed above) for use with the Rti12's and to bypass the Parametric EQ? Currently have the LFE crossover set to 80 in the Sc-07 and the 12's set to small.

Agent

I have a PC12-NSD and here are the settings recommended by SVS. Let the receiver handle the crossover. My sub has the option to turn it off on the back. I keep mine off. It is not recommended that you use both or the subs. Let the receiver handle it. The RTi12's can hit pretty low on their own so try a crossover of 60hz, meaning anything lower than that will be directed to the sub. 80hz is a good place to start and go down from there until you find the sweet spot by ear. Polarity is recommended to leave at 0. I would say if the sub is in the front corner, leave the polarity at 0. If you have the sub in the back sometimes the bass from the fronts can cancel out some of the bass from the sub. What can happen is the sub is pushing the speaker out at the same time the front speakers are pulling back, therefor adjusting the polarty can make all speakers push at the same time, resulting in better bass. If you feel like your bass is lacking, have someone switch the polarity on the sub to 180 as you listen. If it sounds better go with that setting, if not just leave it at 0. I have tinkered with polarity and could not "hear" a difference. An spl meter may be a better judge. As to whether to leave the rti12s on large or small is a bit of a mystery to me. Some say large, other say small. For music I would set them as large, and for HT, go with small. Hope that helps.

mufsoman

Thanks Agent. I will trial lower crossover settings.

But still looking for some advise on the appropriate settings (Q, Level, Freq) to bypass the SVS Parametric EQ and double filtering.....

treitz3

First and foremost, do you have them set up properly? Pic's explain a thousand words you can type and will also help us to help you.

RuSsMaN

Why buy RTi12's and run them small?

Menasor

I would run them full range for music and cross them at around 60hz for movies. That's what I do with my RC-70's

mufsoman

OK, so I crossed the LFE at 50hz in the SC07 and set the Rti12 to small and its sounding pretty good. I also tried 100 and 80. Didn't like those settings much. I also have one vent port plugged on the SVS beast. This combo sounds pretty good. I will also play with two ports plugged tomorrow, just for the heck of it.

FYI - Something else that I have changed in the set up that seems to have made a difference is the position of my center channel. I have always had it tucked under the surface in which my SXRD sits to keep the set up clean looking. I have now moved it out from under the top tier of the cabinet to the very front edge of the cabinet and it has really opened up the center channel sound. SQ is better, not as boomy and it blends much better with the fronts. Front sound stage is sounding pretty well.

mufsoman

BTW - here's a comparative pic of the existing Rti8's vs the new Rti12's. Very impressive......

leroyjr1

Are you using the 8's as surrounds.

leroyjr1

Have you tried having all the ports open on your SVS? That was my favorite, it had more punch.

comfortablycurt

mufsoman wrote: »

Curt, not sure I understand "turning the EQ" all the way up on the SVS? I use the SC-07 to manage the bass crossover, so the xover setting on the SVS is turned off. I thought I had the EQ set to bypass it since I have not gone through a detailed analysis of my room. For the EQ calibration I have "Q" set to Hi, "Level" set to min and "Freq" set to 20hz. Is this not right? Which one should be turned all the way up to avoid the double filtering??? I use a standard Blue Jeans Cable sub cable from the Poineer to the SVS.

Yes, the SC-07 is manage the subs crossover. The SVS's internal EQ should be bypassed when connected over LFE, but just to make sure, you should turn the subs EQ all the way up(on the sub, not the SC-07). Turning the subs EQ all the way up insures that it's not impacting the signal in anyway. It's basically a safe measure to avoid double filtering.

RuSsMaN wrote: »

Why buy RTi12's and run them small?

Because he's already running a pretty competent sub. When you're running your fronts full range, along with a sub, it can create phasing issues, make setup much more of a pain in the ****, and can actually decrease your actual in room bass output. Not to say that it will necessarily sound better or worse either way, but you shouldn't run the woofers on the 12's simply because they're there. The three woofers on the 12's will still be doing a LOT to reinforce the upper bass and lower mid-range between 80-150hz or so.

I've read numerous articles that talk in depth about how a lot of surround setups don't sound as good as they could, simply because people are running full range towers up front and refuse to cross them over. It should definitely be tried both ways though. It's easy enough to change the settings.

Fact is...the 12's can't reproduce low bass with the same authority as a good sub.

I'd agree that for 2 channel use, I would run just the 12's with no sub. 2 channel and HT are entirely different animals though.


Just my $.02

Sherardp

RuSsMaN wrote: »

Why buy RTi12's and run them small?

Exactly, which is why I set them to large in the in the SC-07, the sub is set to Plus and a crossover set to 80hz. This should allow the fronts to handle LFE with the dual subs also. I suggested to the OP to try those settings also and see how he likes them. I also have my subs EQ'd using the Velodyne SMS-1. Subs crossover are set to off, phase 0, and tuned at 20hz with two ports plugged. Both subs volume knobs are set to roughly 9 oclock or just a tad lower. From there I used an SPL meter to fine all adjustments, etc. I use the SMS-1 to control sub volume in my case. In the OP's case it is suggested to use the AVR to control sub output.

As indicated by Curt above, results may vary. I would also recommend trying it both ways.

mufsoman

Leroy, no I'm not planning to use the Rti8's for my surrounds, no where to stand them in my set up. My new Fxi A6's are doing fine for surrounds. Yes, I had all ports open, I'm just trying different settings to see which sounds best to me.

Sherardp, I tried running the Rti12's full range, but didn't like the sound. Possibly didn't have the phase tuned in accurately, but its sounding good right now. The 12's are still breaking in too. So I'm not planning on doing alot of fine tuning yet. I could really tell the drivers were stiff at first and now starting to sound progressively better.

Curt, great feedback as usual, but what does it mean to turn the EQ all the way up? What dial do I turn to do that?

BUT, still looking for a confirmation of what the settings (Q, Level, and Freq) should be at to avoid the double filtering with the SVS EQ. Maybe one of these days I'll get around to calling SVS.....

leroyjr1

.......

leroyjr1

mufsoman wrote: »

Leroy, no I'm not planning to use the Rti8's for my surrounds, no where to stand them in my set up. My new Fxi A6's are doing fine for surrounds. Yes, I had all ports open, I'm just trying different settings to see which sounds best to me.

Sherardp, I tried running the Rti12's full range, but didn't like the sound. Possibly didn't have the phase tuned in accurately, but its sounding good right now. The 12's are still breaking in too. So I'm not planning on doing alot of fine tuning yet. I could really tell the drivers were stiff at first and now starting to sound progressively better.

Curt, great feedback as usual, but what does it mean to turn the EQ all the way up? What dial do I turn to do that?

BUT, still looking for a confirmation of what the settings (Q, Level, and Freq) should be at to avoid the double filtering with the SVS EQ. Maybe one of these days I'll get around to calling SVS.....

If you're using the LFE input on the sub there's no need to even worry about adjusting the plate frequecy as it's bypassed.

mufsoman

I talked to Jack at SVS this afternoon and confirmed that the appropriate settings to disengage the SVS Parametric EQ is Q set to high, Level set to min and Freq set to 20hz. In other words, all three knobs should be turned as far counterclockwise as possible, which is how I have them set now. Every once in a while I surprise myself that maybe I know what I'm doing......:D