Pioneer sc-25 pre out voltage? emotiva xpa5

VanDaManVanDaMan Posts: 33
Hi,

Recently picked up a emotiva xpa5 gen3 for my polk rtia9. It is now hooked up with my pioneer sc-25 which is 140watts per channel.

The problem I have now is that the Pioneer sounds better then the xpa5, the pioneer sounds more cleaner/powerful then the emotiva.

I recently called emotiva tech department and they are saying the Pioneer pre out voltage is not powerful enough to power the emotiva, they say it should be 1.5v for good power to power the emotiva. So what should I do? buy a new receiver? Anyone know the pre-out voltage on the Pioneer sc-25?

I've been doing some research and I was thinking of buying two Art cleanbox pro as I have the polks rtia9 bi amped, other forums say it well help boost the pre-out voltage is this true?

Thanks in advance for the help everybody.

Van

Answers

  • jeremymarcinkojeremymarcinko Posts: 2,597
    The easiest thing to do would be to sell the Emotiva rather than purchasing their processor at $2k. Try something else, at that price point I would even give the Monoprice Monolith or an Outlaw amp both made by ATI. There are many more options used as well.

    That being said I loved the way my emotiva xpa1's sounded on my rti home theater. But if it's not your thing then better off selling rather than spending more to improve something you didn't like to begin with.
  • Dennis GardnerDennis Gardner Posts: 4,589
    edited June 19
    Lots of Emotiva owners have had issues with Pioneer and Onkyo receivers not having enough preout voltage present to get the dynamics with the external amp that they felt they should have. It appears that the sensitivity on the internal amps is a better match for their preamps in their receivers.

    Using the Art DI box or any other maker is always an option if you want to go balanced. The Behringer Ultra DI 8000 gives you 8 channels of boost to work with for around $100 on the used market. It should be noted that noise issues are always the risk when adding amp stages in any system.
  • WLDockWLDock Posts: 1,950
    The Pioneer is rated at 335mV output so get the CleanBox to drive up the voltage.
  • mantismantis Posts: 14,553
    The SC-25 has a nice amp section in it. What are you trying to drive that you need external amps?
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 27,204
    WLDock wrote: »
    The Pioneer is rated at 335mV output so get the CleanBox to drive up the voltage.

    If that's true, that has to be the lowest I've ever seen, for an upper end receiver.

    He's driving RTIA 9's Dan.

    Van,

    Make sure the cables your using to hook up the amp are of decent quality. I'd forget about the bi-amping aspect also. Most receivers usually have less voltage that most amps need for full power. Usually receivers carry around 1 volt of line output and most amps require 1-2 volts, give or take.

    Most the times, this isn't an issue as even without full rated power, the use of an additional amp is still way better that the power sections build into receivers. The Pioneer SC series is more so an exception than the rule, as they have some decent power build in so the differences won't be as night and day as compared to others.

    Maybe start with a better description of how you have everything hooked up, what cables are used and what they are plugged into. Sometimes easy mistakes are overlooked.
  • mantismantis Posts: 14,553
    Ok cool,
    I'd like to know how the output voltage of the Pioneer Elite receiver was obtained?
    It's not in the manual as I just looked. If the voltage is only 335mv, thats less then half of anything else on the market and a very poor decision on Pioneer's part.
    I have owned many Pioneer Elite receivers over the years and have tried using External amps with them starting way back with a Rotel RMB1095. I never felt that the output was low or had any issues. I have had B&K amps , Niles, NAD and had no issues with any of them. I never knew what the output voltage was or dug into it as I never had any issues.
    The Emotiva amps IMO are sub par at best and not my first choice in amps if I was gonna try and upgrade from Pioneer Elite's ICE or D3 amps. I feel they are awesome amps and years ago I was able to power a set of really hard to drive Dynaudio Audience 82's which are 4 ohms and only 87db. Thats why back then I had the Rotel RMB1095 amp still in my system when I upgraded from the Rotel RSP1068 preamp to the SC-07 at that time. When I switched to the Internal amps of the Pioneer SC, I was shocked how good they where and how strong and loud they played without losing dynamic range is why you would want external amps on any receiver.
    The reason o use external amps is so you have head room, dynamic range and more current to drive your speaker. Most receivers suck with internal amps but not the Elite SC higher end models. The RTIA9's are not difficult to drive but to get out of them max performance, a quality external amp is not a bad idea.
  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 37,319
    edited June 19
    WLDock wrote: »
    The Pioneer is rated at 335mV output so get the CleanBox to drive up the voltage.

    The 335mv is for the record out not line level out, the line level is 1.5v.
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 27,204
    F1nut wrote: »
    WLDock wrote: »
    The Pioneer is rated at 335mV output so get the CleanBox to drive up the voltage.

    The 335mv is for the record out not line level out, the line level is 1.5v.

    Now that makes more sense, which begs to question if the OP has it hooked up properly.
  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 37,319
    I also wonder if he ran the calibration program again after hooking up the amp.
  • WLDockWLDock Posts: 1,950
    edited June 20
    Oh wait, I stand corrected...the spec does say REC OUT. Anyway​, I seem to remember some others stating that the pre-amp voltage on some of the Pioneers as being a tad low. I guess it's assumed that pre outs are .75v-1.5v as they do not list this spec on several of their models. Some others have used a Cleanbox on the output. Be sure to check the settings and recheck, etc.
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