lsim tweeters

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jghglofer
jghglofer Posts: 100
in Troubleshooting
I have blown 2 tweeters in the past 8 months one in my 705 and just last week in my 706
I am using Audyssy and my power is Onkyo tx-nr3010 145w ch asking for help. or has anybody had the same issue.
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  • afterburnt
    afterburnt Posts: 7,892
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    Are you cranking them to gut busting levels?
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  • Legender
    Legender Posts: 478
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    I've been driving my 705s with the following at various times with no issues:
    Yamaha MX1000
    Yamaha M60 (pair)
    Parasound JC-1 monoblocks

    But then I don't turn it up that loud. Only used for 2channel music.
    Music: Oppo103 - Parasound JC2 - Parasound A21- SDA 3.1
    Theater: Denon 3808 - B&K 7500/Emotiva XPA-3- RTi12, CSi5, RTiA7x4, PSW505
    Sleeping: Marantz 70005 - Harman Kardon 2400 - SDA 2
    2 Channel: Cary 306 SACD - Canary Audio 906 - Pass Labs x250 - PS Audio Perfectwave DAC, Polk LSiM705, SVS SB13 Ultra
    Office: Dell Optiplex, Emotiva XDA-2, Adcom 5500, LSiM 703
    Spares: Yamaha CA-810; LSi 15; Kenwood Basic M2a, Yamaha M60/M80, Polk Monitor 7, SVS SB13 Ultra
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  • jghglofer
    jghglofer Posts: 100
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    might be but I would use my rtia7's at the same level and never harmed them. I am thinking they dont AC/DC and bag pipes I think I lost both tweeters to the same song
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  • rooftop59
    rooftop59 Posts: 7,981
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    They are pretty efficient speakers rated at 8 ohms. I tried my 703s directly out of my yamaha rx a1010 and it sounded pretty darn good.

    So my guess would be the same as @afterburnt. Are you just cranking the snot of them?
    Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es; Squeezebox Touch with Bolder Power Supply
    Game Room 5.1.4:     Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra
    Bedroom 2.1    Cambridge Azur 551r; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer
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  • DaveHo
    DaveHo Posts: 3,481
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    Sensitivity is lower on the 705s. Based on my own experience, I actually think the 88db published spec is a little optimistic. You are likely driving the receiver into clipping trying to achieve the same levels you were getting with the rtiA7s. Buy an amp, or turn it down.
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,802
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    jghglofer wrote: »
    I have blown 2 tweeters in the past 8 months one in my 705 and just last week in my 706
    I am using Audyssy and my power is Onkyo tx-nr3010 145w ch asking for help. or has anybody had the same issue.

    That's 145wpc with ONLY two channels driven. Add more channels and that drops like a stone.

    Anyway, DaveHo nailed it.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • jghglofer
    jghglofer Posts: 100
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    thanks for the info
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  • rooftop59
    rooftop59 Posts: 7,981
    edited January 2017
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    F1nut wrote: »
    jghglofer wrote: »
    I have blown 2 tweeters in the past 8 months one in my 705 and just last week in my 706
    I am using Audyssy and my power is Onkyo tx-nr3010 145w ch asking for help. or has anybody had the same issue.

    That's 145wpc with ONLY two channels driven. Add more channels and that drops like a stone.

    Anyway, DaveHo nailed it.

    Not exactly:

    Two channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
    0.1% distortion at 167.8 watts
    1% distortion at 189.5 watts

    Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
    0.1% distortion at 122.1 watts
    1% distortion at 142.2 watts

    Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
    0.1% distortion at 114.1 watts
    1% distortion at 127.2 watts

    Read more at http://www.soundandvision.com/content/onkyo-tx-nr3010-av-receiver-ht-labs-measures#VLMOHp1HqQk4boCw.99

    But despite these numbers, I still imagine you are doing as @DaveHo and @F1nut say. You must be seriously cranking these things up. Get an SPL app on your phone and check your decibels.

    Either turn it down or get an amp. Maybe turn it down either way...;-)
    Living Room 2.2: Usher BE-718 "tiny dancers"; Dual DIY Dayton audio RSS210HF-4 Subs with Dayton SPA-250 amps; Arcam SA30; Musical Fidelity A308; Sony UBP-x1000es; Squeezebox Touch with Bolder Power Supply
    Game Room 5.1.4:     Denon AVR-X4200w; Sony UBP-x700; Definitive Technology Power Monitor 900 mains, CLR-3000 center, StudioMonitor 350 surrounds, ProMonitor 800 atmos x4; Sub - Monoprice Monolith 15in THX Ultra
    Bedroom 2.1    Cambridge Azur 551r; Polk RT25i; ACI Titan Subwoofer
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  • msg
    msg Posts: 9,461
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    come on now, give us some reference - what volume were you at when this happened?
    we won't rib you.
    .okay, I confess. that last part was a lie.
    I disabled signatures.
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,802
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    I'd call going from 167.8 to 122.1 dropping like a stone.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,906
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    Eh, that's not too bad, we've all witnessed worse. Regardless, seems like the volume dial is the issue here....along with sticky fingers.

    I guess the first question should be, what settings has your calibration set for the 705's and 706 ? If they are set too low, could be why your cranking the volume to get the same loudness as before.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
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  • jghglofer
    jghglofer Posts: 100
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    @ tonyb I started playing with the calibration settings last night and notice they were set low. Audyssy had them set to low. they sound ten times better at half the volume. I just need to do my own ear calibration not use the Audyssy mic.
    and like msg said no ribbing there is a learning curve to the perfict sound mix and that curve is longer for some of us then others.
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  • jghglofer
    jghglofer Posts: 100
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    @rooftop59 thanks for the info
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,906
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    jghglofer wrote: »
    @ tonyb I started playing with the calibration settings last night and notice they were set low. Audyssy had them set to low. they sound ten times better at half the volume. I just need to do my own ear calibration not use the Audyssy mic.
    and like msg said no ribbing there is a learning curve to the perfict sound mix and that curve is longer for some of us then others.

    Absolutely, not ribbing you at all. As soon as I saw the word Audyssey I knew what your problem most likely was. Too many times people use those automatic calibrations and forget they can still tweek those settings.

    As a starting point, return the fronts and center speaker levels back to 0 and adjust to even out the sound to your liking. Hope that helps you some.

    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • msg
    msg Posts: 9,461
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    I've not had much experience with the autocalibrations, but it does seem problematic. Does this really work to get systems close to properly set up? I keep reading about people saying it cuts levels on this or that, and the system setup is all out of whack. Is it even worth it?
    I disabled signatures.
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  • jghglofer
    jghglofer Posts: 100
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    I have to say it works great for HT movies but music. is best if you adjust it to your ear. I turned my Audyssey off and it sounds great just been doing some fine tuning with different genre trying to find the sweet spot for all.
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  • Paradoxex
    Paradoxex Posts: 189
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    Audussey is fine for those who want to set it and forget it for HT. It takes you 70 to 80% of the way to well balanced. That's enough for most.

    Going above that takes manual fine tuning, and maybe extra equipment. Most cannot be arsed to invest that kind of time into their entertainment. For those who go beyond, it becomes a hobby.
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  • K_M
    K_M Posts: 1,627
    edited January 2017
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    F1nut wrote: »
    I'd call going from 167.8 to 122.1 dropping like a stone.

    Thankfully in reality, your "dropping like a stone" is only 1.36 decibels.
    http://www.radio-electronics.com/info/formulae/decibels/dB-decibel-calculator.php



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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,906
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    K_M wrote: »
    F1nut wrote: »
    I'd call going from 167.8 to 122.1 dropping like a stone.

    Thankfully in reality, your "dropping like a stone" is only 1.36 decibels.
    http://www.radio-electronics.com/info/formulae/decibels/dB-decibel-calculator.php



    Thankfully too, we don't measure sound quality by decibels. ;)
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • K_M
    K_M Posts: 1,627
    edited January 2017
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    tonyb wrote: »
    K_M wrote: »
    F1nut wrote: »
    I'd call going from 167.8 to 122.1 dropping like a stone.

    Thankfully in reality, your "dropping like a stone" is only 1.36 decibels.
    http://www.radio-electronics.com/info/formulae/decibels/dB-decibel-calculator.php



    Thankfully too, we don't measure sound quality by decibels. ;)

    Non sequitur^^^^^

    uh, okay. Makes no sense in regards to what we were talking about, but ....ok.
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  • tonyb
    tonyb Posts: 32,906
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    Sure it does....watts per channel dropping means less dynamics, and possibly strain on the receiver as the volume dial gets turned up. Less soundstage, maybe a more congested sound, sterile sounding top end. Has lots of ramifications because receivers don't have the current a dedicated amp would.

    Decibels has more to do with loudness than quality sound. I can take any cheapo receiver and bury the dial to get decibels of loudness, the sound may suck though. See what I'm sayin' ?

    In reality, it's decibels that are not important to the conversation of lost wattage per channels used. I'm at a loss why that even entered the picture here.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
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  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,579
    edited January 2017
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    msg wrote: »
    I've not had much experience with the autocalibrations, but it does seem problematic. Does this really work to get systems close to properly set up? I keep reading about people saying it cuts levels on this or that, and the system setup is all out of whack. Is it even worth it?

    With my Denon 3805 the auto calibration was spot on and that was first gen. Regardless many do not understand you must have extremely quite background to start with. In my situation just the small sound of water flowing from my fish room would just ruin the auto calibration, I had to make sure all aquariums were off. No kids, no wife just dead silence and it worked very well. I would of thought that 3 and 4 generations would work better but sadly it doesn't seem to be true. I can say for certain that the Yamaha I have now is kind of sketchy no matter what it says my speakers are out of phase.
    Post edited by pitdogg2 on
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  • K_M
    K_M Posts: 1,627
    edited January 2017
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    tonyb wrote: »
    Sure it does....watts per channel dropping means less dynamics, and possibly strain on the receiver as the volume dial gets turned up. Less soundstage, maybe a more congested sound, sterile sounding top end. Has lots of ramifications because receivers don't have the current a dedicated amp would.

    Decibels has more to do with loudness than quality sound. I can take any cheapo receiver and bury the dial to get decibels of loudness, the sound may suck though. See what I'm sayin' ?

    In reality, it's decibels that are not important to the conversation of lost wattage per channels used. I'm at a loss why that even entered the picture here.

    Gotcha and yes agree, was replying to the watts dropping comment though.

    Gotta wonder, just how loud to you guys listen to music??? (not you personally, but)
    Post edited by K_M on
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,802
    edited January 2017
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    was replying to the watts dropping comment though.

    So was Tony.
    Post edited by F1nut on
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • jghglofer
    jghglofer Posts: 100
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    @K_M it depends on the mood I am in sometime I just want backgorund and sometimes I just want to hear Ted crankin or like I said in my first post AC/DC and bag pipes i do push the limits but its not all day or night
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  • tonyp063
    tonyp063 Posts: 1,048
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    Doesn't take all day & night. Tweeters can go pear-shaped due to clipping rather quickly.
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